District 141 Meets with United, Secures Wage Increases for Members Working Under Modified Contracts

[700UW]

Delaney? You mean the guy that went on "Vacation" and was never seen again?

Yes Delaney and others were all swept into office with Tim's major campaigning.

 

[Kev3188]

I have been that room, bottom line is you all can say and think what you want but being in the room is a gut wrenching experience and none of you know what the company told them or what ultimatums that were given. As you know none of us know exactly what transpired.

 

Getting more people in the room would be a great start. Imagine being a company negotiator expecting the usual crowd, and opening the door to a room packed with rank and file employees. What a message that would send!


 

Has Tim occasionally brought up some valid points? Absolutely. But most of the time his points are so slanted to try and effect a change that put's him back in a leather chair of his own that I can't give him too much credibility. Obviously (And surprisingly) you don't feel the same way about Tim I guess?
Personally I think he's as much a cancer as Ford and Harrison is to all of us.
I guess maybe you didn't read his dire warnings about the IAM on "No Way Afa"
You really want to attach yourself to giving this guy even an ounce of credibility Kev? I'm really very surprised actually here now.

Why? I've been agitating for change for a long time. This shouldn't be anything new?

As for Tim, I think it's important for any group to have a voice of dissent. Without that, it's a short jump to groupthink. Love him or hate him, he has the ear of a lot of people.


  

Oh and don't forget Tim was very instrumental in getting those who were in power and negotiated those bad deals elected.
Funny how people forget that fact.
Why do you think he was given the organizing job at 141?
To the victor goes the spoils.

Question for you both: Have you forgotten how long I've been on this board, or are you throwing these things out for everyone else's sake? If it's the latter, you might as well rehash AGW, and the dabbling with the IBEW as well.

With regard to organizing, Tim has referred to the IAM model as outmoded. In my experience, he's 100% accurate.

 

[T5towbar]

You seem to forget that the IAM after the merger was announced that they were going to get retro in stand alone talks BEFORE the representing elections. That was one of the selling points in he election since the IBT could not get this done. You keep blaming CO for this. Of course it was he duty to represent everyone once the total elections was over and the IBT lost. But why wasn't the retro issue was taken care of? And the company trying to pull the "nuclear option".on sCO, that wasn't going to happen You mean to tell me that hey we're going to kill TWO major hubs plus CLE and all of the rest?.That would be operational suicide and probelmatic since Jeff went on Capitol Hill and made his plea about no immediate job loss..Politicians would be all over this one. And Jeff came from CO and killing HIS workforce would have him bounced by the BOD. So that was a bluff. You still haven't given me any rationale on why the District could not get the retro deal done before going into a merged contract. I know the real reason ...... All of those thousands of new members equals DOLLARS for the District. They lost sight of this As I sad before , it could have been done, but wasn't. And after all of this happened, why was are Cargo immediately given up on a side LOA no less?

And I can remember that we (the ramp) went thru three representational drives (2 I was personally involved in). Know what? All three was lost by the same 200 mysterious votes. The IAM drive was disturbingly disheartening. A lot of effort was put into that one and like the TWU drive, it lost by the same amount. All kinds of pressure was put on us. All of our Flight Attendendants did a lot of heavy lifting in this campaign as well. And BTW, the Pax Service group was anti-Union. They were the protected ones that the company seemed to lookout for. I remember after the cuts came, everyone else was restored but us on the ramp. This is one of the prices we paid for standing up.

 

[WeAAsles]

 
Why? I've been agitating for change for a long time. This shouldn't be anything new?

As for Tim, I think it's important for any group to have a voice of dissent. Without that, it's a short jump to groupthink. Love him or hate him, he has the ear of a lot of people.
 
 

I agree that every group should have an agitator to keep them on their toes occasionally. But I draw the line between an agitator and a possibly psychopathic habitual liar who's motivation for whatever reason he or you want to call it, gets people hurt. 

Sorry but I'll never join that team.
 

 
 
Question for you both: Have you forgotten how long I've been on this board, or are you throwing these things out for everyone else's sake? If it's the latter, you might as well rehash AGW, and the dabbling with the IBEW as well.

With regard to organizing, Tim has referred to the IAM model as outmoded. In my experience, he's 100% accurate.

No point in bringing it up or trying to insult your intelligence. Since you are being quite casual about it all I have to surmise that maybe it's a shrugging of the shoulders for you?

I'm sorry to say Kev but I think you have a bit of a hard on for their organizing initiative because they aren't putting enough emphasis into trying to capture your group (Basically money)

I said to you in another area that the reason they are putting or were putting way more in to the FA's is because they are showing the initiative to make it happen from the ground up. Maybe I'm wrong but are you seeing something from your group that I'm not? Do they have the drive to resist? Do they have the passion to want it super bad?

If not in all sincerity are you going to spend a fortune on something that maybe in the end just becomes a sinkhole with no way out?

If they did allocate the small fortune you and I know that it would take to make it happen will it ultimately pay off?

(No not pandering to the audience. This is direct to you)

 

[WeAAsles]

You seem to forget that the IAM after the merger was announced that they were going to get retro in stand alone talks BEFORE the representing elections. That was one of the selling points in he election since the IBT could not get this done. You keep blaming CO for this. Of course it was he duty to represent everyone once the total elections was over and the IBT lost. But why wasn't the retro issue was taken care of? And the company trying to pull the "nuclear option".on sCO, that wasn't going to happen You mean to tell me that hey we're going to kill TWO major hubs plus CLE and all of the rest?.That would be operational suicide and probelmatic since Jeff went on Capitol Hill and made his plea about no immediate job loss..Politicians would be all over this one. And Jeff came from CO and killing HIS workforce would have him bounced by the BOD. So that was a bluff. You still haven't given me any rationale on why the District could not get the retro deal done before going into a merged contract. I know the real reason ...... All of those thousands of new members equals DOLLARS for the District. They lost sight of this As I sad before , it could have been done, but wasn't. And after all of this happened, why was are Cargo immediately given up on a side LOA no less?

And I can remember that we (the ramp) went thru three representational drives (2 I was personally involved in). Know what? All three was lost by the same 200 mysterious votes. The IAM drive was disturbingly disheartening. A lot of effort was put into that one and like the TWU drive, it lost by the same amount. All kinds of pressure was put on us. All of our Flight Attendendants did a lot of heavy lifting in this campaign as well. And BTW, the Pax Service group was anti-Union. They were the protected ones that the company seemed to lookout for. I remember after the cuts came, everyone else was restored but us on the ramp. This is one of the prices we paid for standing up.

I think you guys paid a lot of prices. But I at least see the payoff has finally arrived. 

To hit your other comment personally I think it's pretty pathetic if that's why your group ultimately decided to go with them. As is it seems typical the promise of a few bucks always comes out on top to have a contract that protects the job that gets you even more (long term) bucks and pays your bills.

And again to be honest yes I do continue to blame your group for not getting in a Union after Lorenzo kicked out your last one 30 years ago. To get a Union or be in a Union is a group effort. It doesn't matter how hard the individual wanted it or worked for it if he couldn't get the numbers to follow him or her.

So yes T5 I have to blame you and the people you work with just as much as I have to blame Kev and the people he works with for not getting it done at the airline he works for. Just as much as I would blame myself if I was in the position.

 

[Kev3188]

I'm sorry to say Kev but I think you have a bit of a hard on for their organizing initiative because they aren't putting enough emphasis into trying to capture your group (Basically money)

I have no tolerance for ineptitude, or for those that have forgotten that a union works for it's people, not the other way around.

 

[xUT]

Thanks for deleting my posts! 
At least I should get a notice or a reach around.
Communism is alive and well here.
 
xUT

 

[WeAAsles]

I have no tolerance for ineptitude, or for those that have forgotten that a union works for it's people, not the other way around.

Kev I think out of respect for you I'm going to back away from continuing this part of our conversation. The particular portion of my response that you chose to single out and respond to has a thought formulated in my mind that I don't want to particularly share on this publicly read forum.

I hope some of the conversation we've been having since yesterday does at least maybe put some food for thought in your mind?

Otherwise what's the point in continuing on in the direction you've been trying to head? Maybe you need to do a rethink my friend?

Or finally decide to let it go?

 

[T5towbar]

I'll probably be voting NO on this TA on Friday.
Despite the improvements on pay and scope, I strongly feel that PT Caps are needed.
My hub got decimated without them, and I feel the inclusion of some sort of caps would restrict the inclination for people to get involuntarily downgraded. I just have mixed feelings about this now that the BOD is opening up to these hedge funders.

MX and FA are still negotiating. Why the sudden rush of a week? We need to digest this further.

 

[Kev3188]

So there are no PT caps at all?

 

[700UW]

So your willing to let UA close it all except the seven stations?

And give up $30 an hour?

Your not in Section 6.

 

[WeAAsles]

I'll probably be voting NO on this TA on Friday.
Despite the improvements on pay and scope, I strongly feel that PT Caps are needed.
My hub got decimated without them, and I feel the inclusion of some sort of caps would restrict the inclination for people to get involuntarily downgraded. I just have mixed feelings about this now that the BOD is opening up to these hedge funders.
MX and FA are still negotiating. Why the sudden rush of a week? We need to digest this further.

It's of course your prerogative. As long as you're aware that you have no PT cap right now and to acquire one "may" take you many years more if it happens at all?

I'm sure that those Hedge Funders are on the up and up when they say that they care about the employees in the Company. Just ignore the fact that the Pilots went out and protested at their offices.

What do Pilots know anyway?

 

[T5towbar]

Of course we're not negotiatng a new contracts.

Why one week to decide something like this? There is a lot of skepticism among the people I talk to. What are we going to lose and how bad we will get hurt. This District hasn't seen everyone yet to discuss this.

Either way I vote, I just have a bad feeling that the other shoe is going to drop.............

 

[WeAAsles]

Of course we're not negotiatng a new contracts.
Why one week to decide something like this? There is a lot of skepticism among the people I talk to. What are we going to lose and how bad we will get hurt. This District hasn't seen everyone yet to discuss this.
Either way I vote, I just have a bad feeling that the other shoe is going to drop.............

Why one week. Probably because of just what you're beginning to do here now. Over analyze. Do your level best to try to find the negatives and convince yourself that this can't be 100% better than what you have right now.

Human Nature is always waiting for that extra shoe to drop. We wake up every day with that thought and go to bed with it as well.

We're not a very positive species you know.

 

[Worldport]

Why one week. Probably because of just what you're beginning to do here now. Over analyze. Do your level best to try to find the negatives and convince yourself that this can't be 100% better than what you have right now.

Human Nature is always waiting for that extra shoe to drop. We wake up every day with that thought and go to bed with it as well.

We're not a very positive species you know.

 I don't understand why they wouldn't have a cap we have one I looked at the LUS contract its there. Only ten lines but it's there. Are you sure this isn't a communication problem. The should clarify this ASAP