New vote on Thursday

[767jetz]

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eolesen, you've called it correctly. It also is the sentiment of the UAL mechanics at my station. A case of the concession you vote in now haunting you on your next job. As mechanics say, "Build a thousand houses, and nobody calls you a carpenter."
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Voting in concessions may lower the bar for all of our professions, but bankrupcy will certainly lower the bar even further. When the judge is finished with us, it will take 20 years raise that bar again. What we're talking about here is the lesser of two evils.

Remember that the concessions only kick in if the ATSB loan guarantee is approved. It is one of the requirements of all of our ERP's. If you vote yes, and the ATSB does not approve the guarantee, then we're back to square one anway. A no vote will mean we go to CH11 at our current rates, and the judge will hand us ALL a $hit sandwich. A yes vote will probably mean ATSB approval, avoiding the BK judge, and living to fight another day. If there wasn't a very good chance of getting the ATSB approval and avoiding CH11, Tilton would have pulled the trigger on Dec. 2nd. Instead, we are using the grace period to wrap this thing up. IMO that's a good sign.

To all UAL MECHANICS, (not Bob)

Please keep in mind that Mr. Tilton has addressed some of your concerns since the first vote. (ie: quality of work life, and clarification of the vacation changes) Please keep in mind that although it is not a great deal, it is still better than CH11, and it is the last deal before we run out of time and options.

Don't let an AMERICAN AIRLINES employee sway your opinion. I certainly hope you vote yes. But in the end, just vote what's in your heart and in the best interest of your families. Maybe when we get through this, we can finally start to stick it to American, Continental, NWA and all the people lobying so hard for our collective failure. Our best revenge to them and the former management who put us where we are is our success.

 

[ual06]

From another thread:



It's true! Bob Owens is the Sec/Tres of the TWU Local.

Claims to be pro-mechanic, but swears oath to one of the most docile unions in the industry.

Now be prepared for the regular speech. "He is just giving his members the best representation he can at this time and
they elected him to do this job".

I have always taken issue with pro-mechanic stands while he holds office in the Docile TWU Local which was setup
as a farse to weaken AMFA during a strong organizing effort.

Never the less, he is correct in my mind about concessions for the mechanics profession and the reversal of hard
work and sacrifice of others. This isn't to say that UAL employees are not facing sacrifice also. Just remember who
has stood their ground in the past, and watch what happens. Face it, the IAM will declare a yes vote regardless of the
actual count.

Just my opinion... which I-AM entitled too?



Posted: 12/4/2002 12:43:55 AM / IP: Recorde

 

[Bob Owens]

On 12/4/2002 12:49:27 AM ual06 wrote:



"It's true! Bob Owens is the Sec/Tres of the TWU Local."

Local 562 to be exact.

"Claims to be pro-mechanic, but swears oath to one of the most docile unions in the industry."

Yes I am. I've been a mechanic for 22 years. My coworkers (AMFA supporters)requested that I run for office when when we were given seperate locals. They did so because they felt that I was able to articulate their concerns and fustrations. They elected me and despite any oath my allegience is to those I represent as opposed to the institution that represents them. When interests clash, I'm still a mechanic.

"Now be prepared for the regular speech. "He is just giving his members the best representation he can at this time and they elected him to do this job"."

Thats right, its called responsibility to the membership. During the USAIR deal, IAM representatives made a complaint about my postings against concessions. He called me on it, I told him that I would not stop.

"I have always taken issue with pro-mechanic stands while he holds office in the Docile TWU Local which was set as a farse to weaken AMFA during a strong organizing effort."

The fact is like it or not this is what is in place and what we have to work with. The drive for AMFA remains as it has been for the last 40 years. Strong in the line stations, where I'm from, and weak in Tulsa. The seperate locals gave the line mechanics the opportunity for a greater degree of self governance and representation than they ever had before.

"Never the less, he is correct in my mind about concessions for the mechanics profession and the reversal of hard work and sacrifice of others. This isn't to say that UAL employees are not facing sacrifice also. Just remember who has stood their ground in the past, and watch what happens. Face it, the IAM will declare a yes vote regardless of the actual count."

Thanks

"Just my opinion... which I-AM entitled too?"

Thats questionable around here, atabuy says you might get into fight and have your car messed up.

 

[Bob Owens]

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On 12/4/2002 12:49:27 AM ual06 wrote:

From another thread:



"It's true! Bob Owens is the Sec/Tres of the TWU Local."

Local 562 to be exact.

"Claims to be pro-mechanic, but swears oath to one of the most docile unions in the industry."

Yes I am. I've been a mechanic for 22 years. My coworkers (AMFA supporters)requested that I run for office when when we were given seperate locals. They did so because they felt that I was able to articulate their concerns and fustrations. They elected me and despite any oath my allegience is to those I represent as opposed to the institution that represents them. When interests clash, I'm still a mechanic.

"Now be prepared for the regular speech. "He is just giving his members the best representation he can at this time and they elected him to do this job"."

Thats right, its called responsibility to the membership. During the USAIR deal, IAM representatives made a complaint about my postings against concessions. He called me on it, I told him that I would not stop.

"I have always taken issue with pro-mechanic stands while he holds office in the Docile TWU Local which was set as a farse to weaken AMFA during a strong organizing effort."

The drive for AMFA remains as it has been for the last 40 years. Strong in the line stations, where I'm from, and weak in Tulsa. The seperate locals gave the line mechanics the opportunity for a greater degree of self governance and representation than they ever had before.

"Never the less, he is correct in my mind about concessions for the mechanics profession and the reversal of hard work and sacrifice of others. This isn't to say that UAL employees are not facing sacrifice also. Just remember who has stood their ground in the past, and watch what happens. Face it, the IAM will declare a yes vote regardless of the actual count."

Thanks

"Just my opinion... which I-AM entitled too?"

Thats questionable around here, atabuy says you might get into fight and have your car messed up.

 

[atabuy]

Bob,
It is nice to see how concerned you are for all union members and want to see fairness in all things. Well in most things anyway.
It was nice to see how TWA employees integrated into your seniority system.
I guess it was easier to put them all on the bottom.

 

[atabuy]

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On 12/4/2002 528 AM Bob Owens wrote:

Thats questionable around here, atabuy says you might get into a fight and have your car messed up.
Bob,
Your like a dog with a bone on this. Where do you park your car. lol
Since logic doesn't always work, I tried to give guys a different prospective. You know how men and cars have this thing going on.
They think Ual has them bothered. You know how mad you get when someone opens their door into your new car. The physical harm was what I heard and commented on.
In the 70's we used to have overtime bans. Employees that worked during them usually had their cars painted, and their tires flatened. Just sharing information here. No threats.

Well Bob,
I see you have time while on union business to write quite a bit here. Do your members know you are taking time out of your busy schedule to do this.

It also gives another reason why you want too see Ual go into BK and posible Ch. 7. Growth at AA means dues paying members.
With your limited knowledge of business, judging this from your posts, how could you ever become Sec/treasurer?

You might be for the working man, but it isn't at Ual.
You have proven again why so many members don't trust unions as well as the company.
The Grand Master has been exposed for all to see.
Don't you just love the drama here.

Bob, I would go to an alias, if you get your membership to stand too tall.