Delta Flight Attendants set to Vote!

[southwind]

If the DL F/A's,....have 1/10th of a brain, they will ask themselves,..................."I wonder why, part of my cabin crew has a Union, even though in conversations with many of them, they don't LIKE Unions" ???

Meaning the PILOTS.

Deltoids,........................it's called..."ULTIMATE PROTECTION"(Kinda like a CONDOM) (Or an AMERICAN EXPRESS Card,................."DON"T LEAVE HOME WITHOUT IT") !

Yeah, I noticed "THE ULTIMATE PROTECTION" the Northwest mechanics got. It got them out of a J.O.B.
What I really like about all the pro-union peeps , is the way they didn't back up these mechanics, whether they were IMA, AMFA, TEAMSTERS or any one of the other dozen unions, you didn't have the Ba_ _ s to help your fellow union-bretheren !

Yes ,having a union is like a condom, you never know when it might burst !

 

[JakesWorld]

I am not quite sure what you meant by your statement that the pilot groups would not stand by you. It would not be ALPA's responsibility to negotiate for you. AFA would represent your interests at the bargaining table.

My initial post was in response to another writer regarding how can one group of cabin crew have unions and the other not....they were referring to pilots being union. I failed to address that first off pilots are not cabin crew and I also never said that ALPA should negotiate for F/A's nor would I expect them to. I have respect for very few pilots due to the fact that over the years I have known that group to be selfish and have an its all about me attitude. Pilots have very little regard for their unionized "brother/sisters" within other work groups. Just my opinion.

 

[luv2fly]

Pilots have very little regard for their unionized "brother/sisters" within other work groups. Just my opinion.

Do you feel that other unionized employee groups have much regard for each other? What would you expect one unionized employee group to do in order to show their "regard" for another?

 

[BABABOOY]

I writing this even though I know I will get flamed.
However I must say after much research on my own, as I stated on these boards before,
It is a choice between the lesser of two evils. I must say,at this point, with the ballots
on their way, I will most likely rip mine up. Luke I am sure your not surpised.
I know I will have detractors out there calling
me all sorts of names as some on here like to do (N'or Easta) Your VENOM sure doesn't win over
much confidence. Why do you care what I do as a Delta F/A anyway? There are a few voices
on here that I do respect. i.e. Luke, and NxNW. I do appreciate your information and time.
I have looked at both Delta and the AFA messages that are sent out and somewhere in between
I try to find the truth. I have talked to other F/A's at other carriers and I realized the grass isn't always
greener. I like the fact that there isn't a reserve at Delta. I like the fact that I can drop to zero hours or fly
as much as I want. I like the fact that we have productive trips. I like that fact that we work well with other department for a common goal. Our Customers.
History is important to me. For the past 19 years Delta has treated me
fairly. Yes I was quite angry with the recent treatment during BK. But what carrier in BK didn't cut pay?
Overall Delta has treated me and my fellow F/A's quite fair. Is it perfect? No, but as a group we work together for positive change.
There isn't an US vs THEM attitude at Delta, and I would like to keep it that way. Especially after reading this board and the hate from several posters. I don't need to be apart of that. Again we have been treated well for my 19 years here at Delta. I know many of you can't understand the work environment of a non union force. There is a cultural difference at Delta and there is a reason why Delta has been non union for this long.
emotions aside, the fact that Delta has kept their past promises of give backs, even though oil is over $100 a barrel. The fact is that we didn't need a union to get this back. The fact is that they are offering severance to
F/A's even though they don't need any Flight attendants to take it. This says a lot. So while your Union works well for you at your respective carriers, I feel that the non Union status at Delta is best for me.
What I don't understand is why many "outsiders" don't respect Delta's Flight Attendants decision to remain Union free for what? 68 years. Again, the easy thing would be to call me names, or call me a Management "plant".
That would be the easy thing to do, instead of asking yourselves why do many Delta f/a feel this way.
This is how I feel. Again I must say the VENOM on here from those who are pro union worried about what Delta F/A's do is a real turn off. Your constructive comments will be thoughtfully read.

 

[Come Fly with Me]

First of all I am a Delta employee here in LAX but the only difference is I am a union supporter. I don't understand why people think the Delta family still exist. If the F/A's elect a union it doesn't mean everything will change for the worst. The only difference is you have it in writing. If you like it the way it is then you can elect to have it on the contract you'll be voting for. That's the beauty about writing the first contract or you can add to it. Don't give up your voice........

 

[southwind]

First of all I am a Delta employee here in LAX but the only difference is I am a union supporter. I don't understand why people think the Delta family still exist. If the F/A's elect a union it doesn't mean everything will change for the worst. The only difference is you have it in writing. If you like it the way it is then you can elect to have it on the contract you'll be voting for. That's the beauty about writing the first contract or you can add to it. Don't give up your voice........

Voting a union in doesn't mean it will change for the better either !

 

[Nor'Easta]

First of all I am a Delta employee here in LAX but the only difference is I am a union supporter. I don't understand why people think the Delta family still exist. If the F/A's elect a union it doesn't mean everything will change for the worst. The only difference is you have it in writing. If you like it the way it is then you can elect to have it on the contract you'll be voting for. That's the beauty about writing the first contract or you can add to it. Don't give up your voice........

Glad to see Delta actually has flight attendants who don't drink the Kool-Aid/Delta-Aid! Good luck to you. All of the organized flight attendants at other carriers are on your side.

 

[700UW]

The AFA uses date of hire for seniority intergration, if both groups are AFA.

 

[North by Northwest]

My experience at NW does VERY much translate to what occurs at DL as my experience was partly woven by the same CEO that is now running DL.

So are you saying the culture is solely defined by the CEO? And out ouf curiosity, what was your experience with Anderson? The NW pilot remarks have supported what I have seen from him so far, and that is he tells it like it is. A refreshing change if you ask me. (I've stateed my position on RAnderson's bio)

Or, pending mergers where Delta will have NO SAY whatsoever in seniority integration.

Once again, how much say did the USAirways pilots have when they were subjected to binding arbitration? (I do not believe that is settled) I hardly think you would like to face a merger as a non union pilot in today's world, regardless of how you use US/HP as an example.

Delta is not, nor likely will to be, in the commanding position it was in when it controlled it's previous mergers...that is a fact of reality.

Really, why is that? Just trying to seperate facts from opinions here. There seems to be a thin line at times. Enlighten me as to why this is a "fact of reality"?

(the FACTS based on Delta's SEC 2007 10K are not personal opinions "disguised" as anything other than fact...Delta can not afford to "acquire" any airline as it did portions of Pan Am assets or Western based purely on it's balance sheet (yearly debt due/over $1.5 Billion due every year, over the next 5 years. It is NORTHWEST AIRLINES, based on the paycuts of ALL NWA employees that have allowed it to sport the best finances of the legacies, with cash reserves twice that of Delta, relative to size. That is a fact and hardly disguised, no matter how badly people pretend it isn't). The fact that the reason this proposed merger between NW and Delta keeps the Delta name is because of a $9.1 Billion NOL/net operating loss carried over from BK that must be used within two years/ AND may NOT be transferred to a change of ownership VS. NWA's NOL of $3.9 Billion. It's about money...and nothing to do with the "Delta" position or brand.

I think we can all agree on the importance of an informative and serious discussion needed regarding this matter.

Agreed.

This will be a major change for a large group of people. They are entitled to have as much factual information as possible.
I have no problems with facts. I don't really have a problem with opinions until people start try to disguise them as facts.

(I agree...especially when people refused to face the facts of reality)

 

[North by Northwest]

dupe

 

[JakesWorld]

Do you feel that other unionized employee groups have much regard for each other? What would you expect one unionized employee group to do in order to show their "regard" for another?

At Delta different work groups do have respect for each other. Again, pilots are a breed of their own. DL pilots were more than willing to take the cabin jumpseat and did they offer the F/A's the cockpit jumpseat....no. At some carriers they have asked for a higher boarding priority over all non-revs and if a F/C or B/C seat is available when deadheading that they should be given that regardless of seniority or time of gate arrival. What would I expect of union groups? I expect that they work together.

 

[JakesWorld]

I writing this even though I know I will get flamed.
However I must say after much research on my own, as I stated on these boards before,
It is a choice between the lesser of two evils. I must say,at this point, with the ballots
on their way, I will most likely rip mine up. Luke I am sure your not surpised.
I know I will have detractors out there calling
me all sorts of names as some on here like to do (N'or Easta) Your VENOM sure doesn't win over
much confidence. Why do you care what I do as a Delta F/A anyway? There are a few voices
on here that I do respect. i.e. Luke, and NxNW. I do appreciate your information and time.
I have looked at both Delta and the AFA messages that are sent out and somewhere in between
I try to find the truth. I have talked to other F/A's at other carriers and I realized the grass isn't always
greener. I like the fact that there isn't a reserve at Delta. I like the fact that I can drop to zero hours or fly
as much as I want. I like the fact that we have productive trips. I like that fact that we work well with other department for a common goal. Our Customers.
History is important to me. For the past 19 years Delta has treated me
fairly. Yes I was quite angry with the recent treatment during BK. But what carrier in BK didn't cut pay?
Overall Delta has treated me and my fellow F/A's quite fair. Is it perfect? No, but as a group we work together for positive change.
There isn't an US vs THEM attitude at Delta, and I would like to keep it that way. Especially after reading this board and the hate from several posters. I don't need to be apart of that. Again we have been treated well for my 19 years here at Delta. I know many of you can't understand the work environment of a non union force. There is a cultural difference at Delta and there is a reason why Delta has been non union for this long.
emotions aside, the fact that Delta has kept their past promises of give backs, even though oil is over $100 a barrel. The fact is that we didn't need a union to get this back. The fact is that they are offering severance to
F/A's even though they don't need any Flight attendants to take it. This says a lot. So while your Union works well for you at your respective carriers, I feel that the non Union status at Delta is best for me.
What I don't understand is why many "outsiders" don't respect Delta's Flight Attendants decision to remain Union free for what? 68 years. Again, the easy thing would be to call me names, or call me a Management "plant".
That would be the easy thing to do, instead of asking yourselves why do many Delta f/a feel this way.
This is how I feel. Again I must say the VENOM on here from those who are pro union worried about what Delta F/A's do is a real turn off. Your constructive comments will be thoughtfully read.

You said it all. Looking at both the pros and cons of having a union, I am going to have to say no at this point. After over 20 years I have seen both the good and the bad. Even during the bad it was no worse and to some extent even better than at other airlines. I come to work on time, show up when I am scheduled to, call in sick when I am really sick, and do my job as required...I fly under the radar. We each have a choice with this vote and it is sad that some will attack those that don't support a union.

 

[North by Northwest]

I would expect pilots not to attempt to cut a side deal(for a merger) as if they were the only employee group to give BILLIONS in paycuts, for their own self-serving benefit, and theirs alone. Esp. when it appears to be an attempt to de-Unionize another carrier (dream on). Particularly if that money is coming from the paycuts of other employees (cause, so far, with oil at these prices, I certainly don't see either carrier producing enough revenue to sustain pilot raises from new revenue)

The attempt to cut a side deal for pilots (some NW/Delta) speaks volumes about them and their Unionism...or should I rephrase that to read "Me-ism".

 

[USAir757]

I want what's best for Unionized Delta FAs joining a Unionized industry...just as the Unionized pilots do of their profession.

Honest question - In the event that a union is voted down [again], will you still want what's best for Delta F/A's? Or is your good will towards them conditional?

There isn't an US vs THEM attitude at Delta. There is a cultural difference at Delta and there is a reason why Delta has been non union for this long.

Yes, there is. And if history is any indicator, that culture should continue into the future without organization. Look at the airlines on this board with unionization... they are all "Us vs. Them". If that's not the kind of environment you want, then unions aren't for you.

Glad to see Delta actually has flight attendants who don't drink the Kool-Aid/Delta-Aid! Good luck to you. All of the organized flight attendants at other carriers are on your side.

Delta (non-pilot employees) - people like this [Nor'easta] do not care about your well-being. They care about you being unionized. That's it. They want you on board so it makes them stronger. But as you've all said, it's up to you to make that very important decision. It's about you, not them.

NxNW... I hope you prove better than these kinds of people in your answer my first question.

Regards,
757

 

[Nor'Easta]

Honest question - In the event that a union is voted down [again], will you still want what's best for Delta F/A's? Or is your good will towards them conditional?



Yes, there is. And if history is any indicator, that culture should continue into the future without organization. Look at the airlines on this board with unionization... they are all "Us vs. Them". If that's not the kind of environment you want, then unions aren't for you.



Delta (non-pilot employees) - people like this [Nor'easta] do not care about your well-being. They care about you being unionized. That's it. They want you on board so it makes them stronger. But as you've all said, it's up to you to make that very important decision. It's about you, not them.

NxNW... I hope you prove better than these kinds of people in your answer my first question.

Regards,
757

Its not about making us stronger, its about making them stronger! UNITY PAYS! Something you don't understand since you are an EASTERN SCAB, USAir757. Like I said before...Once a SCAB always a SCAB!