Company's Latest Proposal To Cwa....garbage...
- Thread starter Robc98
- Start date
USA320Pilot
Veteran
- May 18, 2003
- 8,175
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TheLazarusman:
TheLazarusman said: "All this talk about getting an unemployment check is starting to sound like a broken record. I was furloughed for two years. I had to take a job making 7.50 an hour. And that's all I could find with a college education to back me up. The "real world" isn't as sweet as some of you paint it to be. 15.00 an hour top out sucks compared to what we once made; but it's better than nothing at all. What skills do you have that make you think you'll find something that will pay you more?
USA320Pilot comments: Nobody likes this siutation, but your comments are valid. Some people may be able to find alternative jobs, but the majority will not, especially in the hubs where thousands of workers could be thrust into the job market.
As I said before, it is better to have a job while looking for a new job than no job and only unemployment.
Respectfully,
USA320Pilot
TheLazarusman said: "All this talk about getting an unemployment check is starting to sound like a broken record. I was furloughed for two years. I had to take a job making 7.50 an hour. And that's all I could find with a college education to back me up. The "real world" isn't as sweet as some of you paint it to be. 15.00 an hour top out sucks compared to what we once made; but it's better than nothing at all. What skills do you have that make you think you'll find something that will pay you more?
USA320Pilot comments: Nobody likes this siutation, but your comments are valid. Some people may be able to find alternative jobs, but the majority will not, especially in the hubs where thousands of workers could be thrust into the job market.
As I said before, it is better to have a job while looking for a new job than no job and only unemployment.
Respectfully,
USA320Pilot
USA320Pilot said:
I am convinced anyone who wants to accept more abuse should seek counseling ASAP....
That said: I do agree that good jobs are not plentiful, but to take the abuse the employees are taking and continue to take is unconscionable, not even human yet here we are.
If you're a pilot and can only find a $7.50 an hour job, then better get some training cause the airlines in our life time are no longer the place to be, and putting up with what is happening and accepting it is a form of codependence.
The unions are powerless and only run their mouth while people are being slaughtered, union dues should be outlawed because it's a form of stealing since your return is a steady negative while union leaders retire off those dues.
Dog Wonder
Veteran
The voice of reason (as in I am the reason this company exists, respectfully do what is to my benefit) strikes again.
Given the turmoil surrounding the pilots having their pay cut under $100,000 a year do you really think you have any influence over people the company proposes working twice the hours at less than a third of your pay? Not to mention an additional pay cut if you are sick, or take vacation, or we can farm you out if it saves a nickel.
It may be to a certain pilot's benefit to have this happen, and it is apparent that is all that matters to you, but it is certainly not in interest of the company to throw this draconian proposal in the face of the people keeping it running through years of stumbling management.
Given the turmoil surrounding the pilots having their pay cut under $100,000 a year do you really think you have any influence over people the company proposes working twice the hours at less than a third of your pay? Not to mention an additional pay cut if you are sick, or take vacation, or we can farm you out if it saves a nickel.
It may be to a certain pilot's benefit to have this happen, and it is apparent that is all that matters to you, but it is certainly not in interest of the company to throw this draconian proposal in the face of the people keeping it running through years of stumbling management.
callgirlcindie
Member
- Sep 9, 2002
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bookmdano said:
Incredible. I took furlough, went to school, am in my last semster, already have a part time job (without my degree or credentials yet) starting at $12.00 an hour. This will increase quite a bit with my degree/credentials. AND this is starting out, entry level. This is not much less than what U wants to pay a 20 year agent. I was a 23 year res agent. There is NO way I would do res for this pay, vacation, etc. What an insult to the people that have kept this airline alive for the last years. There ARE other jobs. You CAN go back to school while drawing unemployment. There are scholarships available for displaced workers. I would rather work somewhere else starting out for 13.00 an hour than to give U one more minute of my life. I feel so sorry for all the agents that have worked so hard and given so much. Good luck to all.
Let me put my spin on what is going on. First, if accepted we will become the 2nd to the bottom paid as it pertains to the LCCs that we compete with excluding Independence Air. We will make more than HP at there current rates but less based on seniority than FL, B6 and WN. With the so called profit sharing...do not trust the company on this one at all. After all, who signs off on the books???? Lets also take a cold hard look at the facts. RSA. Bronner bought into the airline not to keep the employees employed, but to manage to bring tons of dollars into the RSA's funds. Nothing more than rape of the company to fill the coffers of RSA. One thing that the company just does not get is you get what you pay for. If you get rid of the experianced agents who know how to handle each and every situation and these agents have the knack and the knowledge on how to do their jobs to BENEFIT the company is something that is simply the greatest asset to the company will cause lost revenue. PERIOD. The company has a choice and it appears that they would rather have the revolving door when it comes to BRINGING IN THE DOLLARS which IMO will not work. But then again that is the choice that the brainless wonders are looking at...how to make money without spending money to make it. I personally think the business plan will not work and it is not because the plan is flawed, it has to be tested to see if it works. It is because those who came up with this plan LACK VISION. As I have said b4, you can address the problem or you can look beyond the problem to fix what is wrong. These clowns have not even looked beyond. Addressing what benefits them....not the company. But alas there is some good news for all labor groups...all should know now where they stand with the company and for this agent....no doubt they do not want me and that is fine. U does not own the job market and yes even though some say it is tough out there, I have the solid believe that once one door closes another opens and I prefer to take my talents elsewhere. The company is no longer worthy of my talents. So I can honestly say I will test the free agent market. What I will lose is the honor of working with the best damn group in the industry and will be hard when the time comes to leave. You guys and gals out there who work for this company just AMAZE me day in and day out with your dedication working through this mess. On the other hand I will gain employement with another company down the road that will RESPECT me and my talent. That is another work CCY needs to look up in the dictionary...RESPECT.
WestCoastGuy
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- Jun 27, 2004
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Not possible, Tailspin...Has to be agreed to by company and union before put out to vote. They can propose that again, but the company isnt interested in any type negotiations now. It's just what they demand, take it or leave it. Unfortunantly Jerry Glass has all the cards in his favor now, thanks to BK filing.
BoeingBoy
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- Nov 9, 2003
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- #54
TailSpin said:Question?
Is it not possible for the CWA to put out to vote the first porposal they received from the company over the summer?
If it is possible, let's vote on it so we can get out of here with a little cash and lifetime passes.
[post="194059"][/post]
Interesting you should mention that - similiar to something I wondered about with all the "it'll only be worse in 1113c" talk before the vote on the ALPA TA.
Wonder what the judge would do in any 1113c proceeding if the union just laid one of the company proposals on his bench and said "we'll take this"? He's faced with two proposals, both made by the company, and both said to meet the company's needs.
Obviously, the other unions don't have as many proposals to choose from as ALPA did. But as a worst case, you could at least pick the best from among unpleasant alternatives.
Jim
WestCoastGuy
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- Jun 27, 2004
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Boeing Boy...that is an interesting concept. I wonder if that has ever been tested in court before? Given a choice of two proposals that give the company the same amount of savings is very interesting. I wonder if the unions have considered that, given it is the company wanting to impose the changes immediately.
Can anyone help me here?...I see the "Pre-65" retirement for those retiring 1/1/05....and the "Post-65" retirement for those retiring 1/1/05...But I am missing the "Pre-65, currently retired as a CWA member"...or have they not addressed what their proposal is for those already retired?..Think I answered my own question..."Pre-1/1/05" are on their own, as this is just the changes they are making to the future contract...and those retired have no present OR future contract...so we'll just have to stay in suspense, waiting to see what they do with us...Maybe retiring wasn't such a good idea, after all...
BoeingBoy
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- Nov 9, 2003
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wizzz,
The new ALPA agreement has similiar language - retire before 1/1/05 and get retirement medical, retire later and you're on your own (can cash in unused sick time to offset cost).
It'll be interesting to see if the company attempts to undo this in the 1114 hearing on retiree benefits for "past and future retirees".
Stay tuned.....and hold on tight,
Jim
The new ALPA agreement has similiar language - retire before 1/1/05 and get retirement medical, retire later and you're on your own (can cash in unused sick time to offset cost).
It'll be interesting to see if the company attempts to undo this in the 1114 hearing on retiree benefits for "past and future retirees".
Stay tuned.....and hold on tight,
Jim
I don't think that would work. It is basic contract law-- one side offers a proposal; once the other side turns it down, it is basically dead.BoeingBoy said:
I suppose it could be tried but U could very easily say that offer is no longer on the table.
Plus they would go into the schpiel they gave ALPA that we keep hearing from USE170copilot that "The numbers have gotten worse since that proposal so now we need more..."
No, Cav...not a sadist...but I must admit I have been a lifelong idealist...and Oh, So Naive..and a little slow...it only took me from 1967 until the last year or so to process the fact that the only thing one can count on in life is oneself...too bad I learned as late as I did...is it still "Better late than never"...?
And, Jim..thanks for the input...and I AM holding on..altho not much left to hold on to...The one thing that I will pass on to my children, is the old "Do as I say, not as I did..." The present world and the glimpses of the future are so scary...I only hope they toss my rose colored glasses in the dumpster...
And, Jim..thanks for the input...and I AM holding on..altho not much left to hold on to...The one thing that I will pass on to my children, is the old "Do as I say, not as I did..." The present world and the glimpses of the future are so scary...I only hope they toss my rose colored glasses in the dumpster...
