operaations
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- Jul 31, 2003
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MJK Or Garfiled,
Can either of Yall bring in some extra lunch. I am on a double
Can either of Yall bring in some extra lunch. I am on a double
Commuter policy is broken
- Thread starter Garfield1966
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Garfield1966
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I think that 'logic' is flawed. If a storm is coming a commuter should know that flights will be canceled. Planning to fly on the first flight with the second as a back up is not going to work because if there are cancellations (which ALWAYS happen on OSO's) their flight could cancel or be over sold by DRX hoping to beat the storm, weight restrictions, last min travelers, mech on an earlier flight.
As galley mentioned above, at TWA you watched the WX channel. If you saw a storm you got your butt moving to base. If you had to go in the night before, so be it. The companies operational policy has no bearing on a commuter getting their butt to base. If they choose to live out of base, the onus is on them to make sure they get in. Expecting to get to base on an OSO day with one flight as a back up is foolish and another example of people not willing to accept responsibility of their own actions.
When I travel I always keep an eye on the weather. I cut a trip short by 2 days becasue I saw weather coming in and knew I had to be at work. It was a good thing too becasue the flights I had planned on taking all sold out or canceled and no non-revs got on. American was/is not responsible to get me to work. I am. It is up to me to get back home. I chose to travel so I have to get back in time.
If there were repercussions for not showing up for work, do you think more or less people would miss their sequences? Rewarding negative behavior encourages more negative behavior.
As galley mentioned above, at TWA you watched the WX channel. If you saw a storm you got your butt moving to base. If you had to go in the night before, so be it. The companies operational policy has no bearing on a commuter getting their butt to base. If they choose to live out of base, the onus is on them to make sure they get in. Expecting to get to base on an OSO day with one flight as a back up is foolish and another example of people not willing to accept responsibility of their own actions.
When I travel I always keep an eye on the weather. I cut a trip short by 2 days becasue I saw weather coming in and knew I had to be at work. It was a good thing too becasue the flights I had planned on taking all sold out or canceled and no non-revs got on. American was/is not responsible to get me to work. I am. It is up to me to get back home. I chose to travel so I have to get back in time.
If there were repercussions for not showing up for work, do you think more or less people would miss their sequences? Rewarding negative behavior encourages more negative behavior.
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Garfield1966
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You are SOL. I'm off and doing bathroom renovation.
I am sure someone will make a food run
operaations
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Nor'Easta
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That's what happens when you clog the toilet too often and it just snaps. Try using a litter box!
operaations
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too funnt Nor Esta...I wish i said it
BoeingBoy
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The key to it all - the company and union agreed to the rules.
So very true.....on both sides.
Or believes that the company, with it's vastly greater resources, has better info.....
Again - that is the crux. The commuter is abiding by the rules both the union and company agreed to. Who would be so quick to "demand" that the company go beyond the rules in the contract?
Garfield said "Weather reports were saying snow. Why was anyone to know that it would not materialize?" Turn that on it's head - weather reports are saying snow, why was anyone to know for sure it would materialize or (gasp) possibly be worse than forecast. Commuters, much like passengers, look to the company for the answer - if a flight is scheduled to operate, maybe AA knows something they don't. After all, it's AA that has professional weather people on the payroll, direct access to both the ATC command center and airport personnel, etc. The commuter (like the passenger) has the weather channel and what AA (or any airline) says it's flight schedule will be.
But by all means, let's blame the commuter for abiding by the policy that the company agreed to. How dare they follow the contract.....unthinkable......
And with that, I'm off to do some painting on a sunny Carolina day.
Jim
operaations
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And with that, I'm off to do some painting on a sunny Carolina day.
well dont paint too hard...wouldnt want you to use another horrible Union CCompany agreement. Fatigue or sick if needed.............
well dont paint too hard...wouldnt want you to use another horrible Union CCompany agreement. Fatigue or sick if needed.............
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Garfield1966
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ok
btw nice work on JFK last night
WTF did you expect me to do? Not like any of that crap could be paired up. TDY had 10-15 commuters no show. I had people bombing in left and right. At some point you just get in the life boat and watch the thing sink like a rock. I filled that 5 day trip carib trip 4 times before I busted 1 position down to a 3 day so I could use the 3 day RSV on the top of the RSV list. I had NRT in open time for 5 hous before someone finally took that on SK MU. People cry and beg for NRT and when I get it .. nothing. Go figure.
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Garfield1966
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That has got to be the most circular logic I have heard in a while.
Crew is expected to be in base and at the ATO 1 hr prior to SI. How one gets there is ones own problem and has nothing to do with "guidance from AA" (are you serious?).
I am not arguing contract (I believe its a LOA). I am arguing right /wrong and the commuter policy is BS down to it's core like so many other provisions of the contract. It is put together by people who have not been on a plane or worked the floor in their life and they are clueless.
The passengers responsibility is to get their ass to the air port on time. If there is weather do you think they still leave at the same time and get there on time? No, they have to leave earlier and if they do not get there in time AA says tough crap and pops them on stand by. If I see weather and I need to be somewhere at a certain time, I leave earlier so I can get there. I do not rely on others to give me guidance because I am responsible for my actions.
Like I said, if there were repercussions for peoples actions the results would be different but in todays society, holding one responsible is akin to a four letter word. If I am late, it is my fault, no one else's. There may have been contributing factors but the final responsibility is on me. Why is that so difficult to comprehend?
I moved back to Queens, NY after a year of commuting when I was laid off about 3 or 4 years ago. Let me tell you, that one year was enough of commuting! My commute was only from RDU-JFK and I was ALWAYS a wreck about missing a trip or even being late. So after a year, I moved back. Live right on Union Turnpike in Kew Gardens (only 3 stops to the airtrain at jamaica station). Since I've lived here the past 3 or 4 years I've had more late sign ins than I did back when I was commuting!!!! I always leave an hour before sign in and still with this crappy airtrain, I've gotten two late sign ins in the past 2 months. The first one I was not able to get taken off but the second thank goodness a purser manager was sitting next to me at the station while we both waited for the train for over 40 minutes. I hate to say it but I do think we who live here in NYC are penalized more because we do not have anything protecting us if Kew Gardens taxi company is late by an hour or the airtrain is having one of its 12 weekly breakdowns.
Why no comments about the pilot agreement about commuters? This agreement is mirrored after APA's. Commuters save the day in IOR all the time. Locals forget, run late or get stuck in traffic. Or my personal favorite, the cra$$y CTA runs on its' own schedule sometimes. Anyone remember the ORD storm some years ago, when the rain wouldn't stop and the underpasses and CTA tunnels were flooded? Guess who saved the day? COMMUTERS. So, everyone gets their day to shine. Let's stop the complaining and move on. Besides, as a commuter, I am more than happy when we go out short. It means understaffing pay for me. If we are short a few, think X-mas, then the service gets modified and life goes on and I have a little more money to spend on my layover. People need to start looking for the positives in life and stop looking at all the little inequities they encounter. Nobody's life is perfect.
By the way Bill, does your wife give you her jetnet and sabre password? It sounds like she does and that you do a lot of her work related activities on sabre. Do you go on sabre for her to trip trade and whatever else? Do you know if AA found out, your wife could be fired? We just had a commuting pilot quit instead of receiving corrective action for just the same. I think he was just acting like a baby a little too much, but that is just me.
By the way Bill, does your wife give you her jetnet and sabre password? It sounds like she does and that you do a lot of her work related activities on sabre. Do you go on sabre for her to trip trade and whatever else? Do you know if AA found out, your wife could be fired? We just had a commuting pilot quit instead of receiving corrective action for just the same. I think he was just acting like a baby a little too much, but that is just me.
eolesen
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Y'know, the two trip rule... wish it worked for those folks who nonrev somewhere and can't get back because of canceled flights, no seats, etc.
But if you're an agent or clerk, and don't get back to work because you were nonrevving (and yes, some do commute), you'd better suck up to the fact that you're going to have an occurence on your attendance for being a no-show at work. Or, you'd better find a way of arranging a CS at the last minute...
Sure, it's contractual. But it's a crock of shite just the same.
But if you're an agent or clerk, and don't get back to work because you were nonrevving (and yes, some do commute), you'd better suck up to the fact that you're going to have an occurence on your attendance for being a no-show at work. Or, you'd better find a way of arranging a CS at the last minute...
Sure, it's contractual. But it's a crock of shite just the same.
I have my own Jetnet password as a TWA retiree. No, my spouse is not very computer savy so I give her suggestions. She has a trip trader to do the work and bid for her.
More....
My spouse has been trying to figure out the Red/Green light system. She has only seen red lights. As I watch her pull up open time I see only turns. There is nothing to trade into and the lights are red. She has the trip trader drop trips and then she can pick up from HIBOARD. That seems to be the only way to get better trips. Trading seems rather futile if she does it on her own.
My spouse has been trying to figure out the Red/Green light system. She has only seen red lights. As I watch her pull up open time I see only turns. There is nothing to trade into and the lights are red. She has the trip trader drop trips and then she can pick up from HIBOARD. That seems to be the only way to get better trips. Trading seems rather futile if she does it on her own.
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