August/September 2013 Fleet Discussion

[700UW]

You cant sue in court unless it is a major dispute, the language has a date, as did the M&R CBA had two 3% raises built in after the amendable date. Your CBA has a grievance procedure and that is what has to be utilized.

There is nothing to fight, the language is clear.

And they arent COLA raises.

 

[robbedagain]

700 i dont know if u have seen the fsa contract but if you did how would you interpet the language thats in there on pages 115 n 117?

 

[mike33]

700 i dont know if u have seen the fsa contract but if you did how would you interpet the language thats in there on pages 115 n 117?

Robbed / Freedom,,,,,,,,,,,,whats to understand? I can see how it could be misinterpreted but it has a date July1 2012....no other date and it doesnt say anything ( although i wish it did) about 2013/2014/2015 etc............

Look at the maint contract on the website and compare the two !!!!!! then you will get your answer!

Here it is....and compare the language !!!!!!

• 
  The parties will commence bargaining for a new collective
• 
  10 bargaining agreement no later than January 15, 2011. If the parties have not
• 
  11 reached a tentative agreement by July 1, 2011, they will, no later than July
• 
  12 10, 2011, jointly apply for mediation with the National Mediation Board. In
• 
  13 the event the parties have not reached a tentative agreement during the
• 
  14 status quo period following the amendable date, all base rates will be
• 
  15 increased by three percent (3%) on July 1, 2012, and three percent (3%) on
• 
  16 July 1, 2013 .

 

[robbedagain]

mike while i understand what your saying the thing of it is is that on both pages it clearly states beyond the amendable date.. then in the paragraph they give a date and i think its based on that is where the union reps in my station are actually going to grieve it and one of them used to be on that team that negogiated it back then

 

[mike33]

mike while i understand what your saying the thing of it is is that on both pages it clearly states beyond the amendable date.. then in the paragraph they give a date and i think its based on that is where the union reps in my station are actually going to grieve it and one of them used to be on that team that negogiated it back then

Well they better have proof if " intent" because the amendable language says increase...not increases and " all base rates will be increased by 2% for all employees ....... not all future dates.

If they negotiated it then is should have said " All succeeding July 1 dates till amended ".....

Hopefully the NC now will see that 2005 language as archaic and of no muscle unless it benefits the bargaining power by increases of 3/4/5% or more continuous till amended!


Education Education Education!

 

[Tim Nelson]

Cant hurt to grieve it. Your local rep was a part of those talks and has the notes. The current agcs ought to reference him. I dont personally see it myself

 

[psa8979]

The simple explanation is when the 2008 CBA was negotiated and approved under Transition ALL Parties thought their would be a New CBA by 7/1/12. The IAM Negotiation Team didn't have a CRYSTAL BALL. Unknown events. LCC /AH NOT Bargaining in Good Faith by 2012. Merger with AMR. Facts and Reality as RLA Airline Workers : No raises , No changes , and STATUS QUO until WE have a New CBA. Changing Unions , Union Leadership, or NC except for Dereliction of Duty is a bad idea and only delays CBA.

 

[mike33]

The simple explanation is when the 2008 CBA was negotiated and approved under Transition ALL Parties thought their would be a New CBA by 7/1/12. The IAM Negotiation Team didn't have a CRYSTAL BALL. Unknown events. LCC /AH NOT Bargaining in Good Faith by 2012. Merger with AMR. Facts and Reality as RLA Airline Workers : No raises , No changes , and STATUS QUO until WE have a New CBA. Changing Unions , Union Leadership, or NC except for Dereliction of Duty is a bad idea and only delays CBA.

Well as Bill Rainey ( remember him PSA8979 ? ) use to say....

" Always extend the terms somehow to your benefit, even when you can't see around the corner "

 

[psa8979]

I remember them ALL and learned from them . Marv G. Is spinning in his grave of what the IBT A/D is doing today and how it is helping a former member Al H. against US.

 

[robbedagain]

mike it was our union rep who had told us we would be getting it bec he personelly told me and a number of other folks in my sta that he was on the nc for the 08 contract but as tim said it does not hurt to grieve it.
psa8979 i agree with your assessment it makes more sense

the bottom line is it does state that the parties will commence bargaining for a new collective agreement no later than july 15 2011 (i do think it started before that but not 100% sure) in the event the parties have not reached an agreement during the status quo following the amendable date all base rates will increase by 2% for all employees effective the first pay day of the first pay period following july 1 2012

now with that section if the contract talks started by july 2011 knowing full well there would not be an agreement then the 2 % should have been provided per the contract and its that statement the way its written is where the grievance will be filed based on that...

 

[psa8979]

robbed it takes two to negotiate.

 

[mike33]

mike it was our union rep who had told us we would be getting it bec he personelly told me and a number of other folks in my sta that he was on the nc for the 08 contract but as tim said it does not hurt to grieve it.
psa8979 i agree with your assessment it makes more sense

the bottom line is it does state that the parties will commence bargaining for a new collective agreement no later than july 15 2011 (i do think it started before that but not 100% sure) in the event the parties have not reached an agreement during the status quo following the amendable date all base rates will increase by 2% for all employees effective the first pay day of the first pay period following july 1 2012

now with that section if the contract talks started by july 2011 knowing full well there would not be an agreement then the 2 % should have been provided per the contract and its that statement the way its written is where the grievance will be filed based on that...

I see it as a Moot point. When a new contract is voted on all grievences will become null and void im sure......its usually the way

 

[Tim Nelson]

First off, only a short sighted labor rep would assume that a new ta would have been reached before this date, and that is exactly why canale was replaced.
Second off, since you didnt get a 2% raise in 2013, this year is still on the table. Plus im assuming our nc is asking for retro like at united. So, dont assume you are behind the 8 ball.

 

[mike33]

Second off, since you didnt get a 2% raise in 2013, this year is still on the table. Plus im assuming our nc is asking for retro like at united. So, dont assume you are behind the 8 ball.

Point well taken.

 

[psa8979]

mike 33 if additional info about Al H . and his IBT Roots are needed I will let you being the Senior Union Member fill in the blanks for AF.com posters . Al was known in the Bay Area before being a Company Man as TEAMSTER AL .