An Open Letter To G.w. From Michael Moore

[KCFlyer]

You think you've got Government interference now? Wait until JK gets elected and starts digging his hands DEEP into your pockets to pay for his gargantuan budget proposals. Or perhaps maybe you're an unemployed illegal alien, have 8 illegitimate children all here on welfare, and don't feel like trying to get work, in which case you'll be the eventual recipient of the hard earned dollars I'm making by working every day.

[post="174334"][/post]​

You know, I work in an area that provides health care for those without it...you know, welfare. YOu know where a lot of our clients come from? Walmart...provider of many of those "jobs" that Bush says he created. They don't make much to start, and don't qualify for benefits for 2 years, and even when they do, their insurance plan doesn't cover pre-natal care. I guess those that work at Walmart shouldn't have sex so they don't become pregnant. But...they don't have much else to do - and they exercised a good "pro life" stance by having the baby. Guess low income folks should have their babies but give them away if they can't afford them...I hear there's a good market for white babies out there. But the minority kids aren't so popular, but God works in funny ways....they all seem to love their babies. But those same folks are paying taxes too.

Other clients include former Sprint employees who no longer have health care (they haven't worked at Walmart long enough I guess). Because their jobs were shipped overseas in the name of "shareholder value"...and their former employer committing $64 million dollars for the naming rights to the newly approved arena in downtown. YOu know what happens when the largest private employer in town trims the staff by half? You have a lot of people who'd love to employ that ability to go to work every day...but there AREN'T ANY JOBS.

Still other clients ask us for help with their prescription drugs...they can't understand the new Medicare plan. We try to show them. But they are pretty confused (ever try to explain something complex to a 75-80 year old??) Most leave fairly disheartened when they find that the plan "saves" them about a buck ninety five. That's because the drug maker raised the price, so the "discount" amounted to pretty much the status quo.


FWIW, I think Bush's "plan" will alienate the US from the rest of the world. Not only will terrorists continue to grow, but our (former) friends will just watch as we flop around trying to get out of this mess that Bush got us into. Close our borders? Great. Go attack countries who "might" pose a threat - dead wrong. We are becoming the "evil empire" that we used to call Russia. World domination, in the name of "ending terrorism". I'm 47. I figure I've got another 30 to 35 years on this earth, God Willing. And I'll bet you that I go to my grave with the soldiers of my country dying in a war that should never have been started.

 

[Fly]

The best thing about our country is that we can let ignorant people like yourself speak such foolish things. Get American or get out.
BUSH/CHENEY '04
Four More Years, it's the only way we'll make it.

[post="174334"][/post]​

I am not an American because I refuse to blindly follow a "leader (?)" who's only motivation is the killing of America's youth in a war that was started because of a personal vendetta? I think the guy is a nut job and YES I do wish the pretzel would have done him in. Our country was built upon the belief that we all could choose and voice our opinions....this administration has done everything in their power to label anyone who doesn't agree as "anti-American". A wise man once said "The soul and substance of what customarily ranks as patriotism is moral cowardice--and always has been." - Mark Twain





__________________________________________________________________

"The big elephant sitting in the corner is that George W. Bush is simply unqualified for the job... What's his accomplishment? That he's no longer an obnoxious drunk?" - Ron Reagan Jr.

 

[sentrido]

I'm voting for the person who thinks we CAN win the war on terror. Kerry.

 

[delldude]

you guys all respectfully have your heads up your butt.....kerry is so full of bull and his poll numbers reflect it....if you don't like bush....vote for noodle....
ask youselves if kerry will keep up the fight to terrorisrs..if you answer 'yes' you are seduced by the silver tounged ones lies...he is a dyed in the wool military hating liberal.....hows this clowns record in senate??hell with the 'nam thing... any of you lib sucks look into that??what major legislation has kerry authored...duh...

 

[NWA/AMT]

you guys all respectfully have your heads up your butt...........if you answer 'yes' you are seduced by the silver tounged ones lies...... any of you lib sucks look into that??

[post="174704"][/post]​

A "Compassionate Conservative" speaks! I don't understand how you haven't won us all over to your side with your polished debating skills, you silver tongued devil you.

 

[USAir757]

Close our borders? Great. Go attack countries who "might" pose a threat - dead wrong.

The most significant intelligence in the world told us there was a threat. GB, Russia, our CIA, how can you argue with that? It wasn't just us! Can you seriously believe that we went to war for a "personal vendetta?" It is people like you that believe this stuff that really scares me about the future of our country.

I figure I've got another 30 to 35 years on this earth, God Willing. And I'll bet you that I go to my grave with the soldiers of my country dying in a war that should never have been started.

You may be right. But in case you've forgotten, we did not start this war. We would not be in this war if we weren't preemptively attacked.

I think the guy is a nut job and YES I do wish the pretzel would have done him in. Our country was built upon the belief that we all could choose and voice our opinions....this administration has done everything in their power to label anyone who doesn't agree as "anti-American".

Your opinions and your ability to voice them are embraced by the free speech provided by this nation. For one, I'm glad for the steps our president has taken to preserve not only that right, but the ability to stand on this ground and call ourselves a free nation... and to decrease the possibilities of a nuclear or chemical bomb from landing at our door. If that had happened, you'd all be screaming that he didn't take the proper precautions, just as you say he didn't for 9/11.

It's not your opinions that make you unamerican, it's your hatred of the country and your disdain to provide safety to the people within it.

 

[KCFlyer]

You may be right. But in case you've forgotten, we did not start this war. We would not be in this war if we weren't preemptively attacked.

no...not really. See, the folks who attacked us were not Iraqi's. And in the days following 9/11 Bush retaliated against those responsible. I supported him there. But THIS war...the one in Iraq...most certainly WAS started by us.

It's not your opinions that make you unamerican, it's your hatred of the country and your disdain to provide safety to the people within it.

You know, I don't get the impression that Fly "hates" this country. And since this war can't be won (Bush was right the first time), and since our actions in Iraq have resulted in an increase in the number of terrorists, I am afraid that within the next 5 years, a group WILL hit again in the US. IMHO, the actions in Iraq have only increased the threat to Americans. But please ponder these words:


"Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger."

The speaker of those words? Herman Goering at the Nuremberg trials.

Compare that to your words " it's your hatred of the country and your disdain to provide safety to the people within it."--

It sounds like you're buying the "party line".

 

[delldude]

i think you should look intto the libian thing....saddam was running a nuclear program way down in libia covertly of course.khaddafi got caught on phone intercepts between n. korea-syria-and saddam.its available on a search...look it up.
bush got wind of it and we went in after saddam.
thats why we are in iraq.
thats why khaddafi all of the sudden turned 'states evidence'.

 

[Fly]

Imperial President
Opposing Bush becomes unpatriotic.
By William Saletan
Updated Thursday, Sept. 2, 2004, at 1:16 AM PT


The 2004 election is becoming a referendum on your right to hold the president accountable.

That's the upshot of tonight's speeches by Vice President Dick Cheney and Zell Miller, the Republican National Convention's keynote speaker.

The case against President Bush is simple. He sold us his tax cuts as a boon for the economy, but more than three years later, he has driven the economy into the ground. He sold us a war in Iraq as a necessity to protect the United States against weapons of mass destruction, but after spending $200 billion and nearly 1,000 American lives, and after searching the country for more than a year, we've found no such weapons.


Tonight the Republicans had a chance to explain why they shouldn't be fired for these apparent screw-ups. Here's what Cheney said about the economic situation: "People are returning to work. Mortgage rates are low, and home ownership in this country is at an all-time high. The Bush tax cuts are working." But mortgage rates were low before Bush took office. Home ownership was already at an all-time high. And more than a million more people had jobs than have them today.

"In Iraq, we dealt with a gathering threat," Cheney said. What about the urgent, nukes-any-day threat to the United States that supposedly warranted our expense of so much blood and treasure? Cheney was silent.

"A senator can be wrong for 20 years without consequence to the nation," said Cheney. "But a president always casts the deciding vote." What America needs in this time of peril, he argued, is "a president we can count on to get it right."

You can't make the case against Bush more plainly than that.

If the convention speeches are any guide, Republicans have run out of excuses for blowing the economy, blowing the surplus, and blowing our military resources and moral capital in the wrong country. So they're going after the patriotism of their opponents. Here's what the convention keynoter, Miller, said tonight about Democrats and those who criticize the way President Bush has launched and conducted the Iraq war:

While young Americans are dying in the sands of Iraq and the mountains of Afghanistan, our nation is being torn apart and made weaker because of the Democrats' manic obsession to bring down our Commander-in-Chief.

Motivated more by partisan politics than by national security, today's Democratic leaders see America as an occupier, not a liberator.

In [Democratic leaders'] warped way of thinking, America is the problem, not the solution. They don't believe there is any real danger in the world except that which America brings upon itself.

Kerry would let Paris decide when America needs defending. I want Bush to decide.

Every one of these charges is demonstrably false. When Bush addressed Congress after 9/11, Democrats embraced and applauded him. In the Afghan war, they gave him everything he asked for. Most Democratic senators, including John Kerry and John Edwards, voted to give him the authority to use force in Iraq. During and after the war, they praised Iraq's liberation. Kerry has never said that any other country should decide when the United States is entitled to defend itself.

But the important thing isn't the falsity of the charges, which Republicans continue to repeat despite press reports debunking them. The important thing is that the GOP is trying to quash criticism of the president simply because it's criticism of the president. The election is becoming a referendum on democracy.

In a democracy, the commander in chief works for you. You hire him when you elect him. You watch him do the job. If he makes good decisions and serves your interests, you rehire him. If he doesn't, you fire him by voting for his opponent in the next election.

Not every country works this way. In some countries, the commander in chief builds a propaganda apparatus that equates him with the military and the nation. If you object that he's making bad decisions and disserving the national interest, you're accused of weakening the nation, undermining its security, sabotaging the commander in chief, and serving a foreign power—the very charges Miller leveled tonight against Bush's critics.

Are you prepared to become one of those countries?

When patriotism is impugned, the facts go out the window. You're not allowed to point out that Bush shifted the rationale for the Iraq war further and further from U.S. national security—from complicity in 9/11 to weapons of mass destruction to building democracy to relieving Iraqis of their dictator—without explaining why American troops and taxpayers should bear the burden. You're not allowed to point out that the longer a liberator stays, the more he looks like an occupier. You're not allowed to propose that the enormous postwar expenses Bush failed to budget for be covered by repealing his tax cuts for the wealthy instead of further indebting every American child.

If you dare to say these things, you're accused—as Kerry now stands accused by Cheney and Miller—of defaming America and refusing "to support American troops in combat." You're contrasted to a president who "is unashamed of his belief that God is not indifferent to America." You're derided, in Cheney's words, for trying to show al-Qaida "our softer side." Your Silver Star, Bronze Star, and three Purple Hearts are no match for the vice president's five draft deferments.

In his remarks, Miller praised Wendell Wilkie, the 1940 Republican presidential nominee, who "made it clear that he would rather lose the election than make national security a partisan campaign issue." But there are three ways to make national security a campaign issue. One is to argue the facts of a particular question, as Kerry has done in Iraq. The second is to sweep aside all factual questions, as Cheney and Miller did tonight, with a categorical charge that the other party is indifferent or hostile to the country's safety. The third is to create a handy political fight, as Republicans did two years ago on the question of labor rights in the Department of Homeland Security, and frame it falsely as a national security issue in order to win an election.

So now you have two reasons to show up at the polls in November. One is to stop Bush from screwing up economic and foreign policy more than he already has. The other is to remind him and his propagandists that even after 9/11, you still have that right.


William Saletan is Slate's chief political correspondent and author of Bearing Right: How Conservatives Won the Abortion War.

Photograph of Zell Miller on Slate's home page by Tim Sloan/AFP/Getty Images.

here

 

[FredF]

I'm voting for the person who thinks we CAN win the war on terror.

[post="174636"][/post]​

I am glad to see you came to your senses and are going to do the right thing by voting for Bush.

I am sure it will make you family a lot safer in the years to come.

 

[KCFlyer]

I am glad to see you came to your senses and are going to do the right thing by voting for Bush.

I am sure it will make you family a lot safer in the years to come.

[post="175244"][/post]​

Bush, when speaking without a script, said this war can't be won. He was doing something rare these days...saying what he feels. He was unfortunatly correct. Only when the handlers put a script that had been put thru the spin cycle in front of him did the "truth" come out.

 

[sentrido]

I am glad to see you came to your senses and are going to do the right thing by voting for Bush.

I am sure it will make you family a lot safer in the years to come.

[post="175244"][/post]​

Um, NO. I heard Bush on tv saying he can't win the war on terror. Didn't hannity tell you?

 

[NeedForSpeedNFS]

People wonder why our gas prices are so high?

[post="174309"][/post]​

AAAHHHHH, Yes!!!! The old trick that we are in Iraq because of the OIL!!! Oh yea, it's ALL bush/cheneys' fault!! Educate yourself, Man!! Did you ever hear of OPEC??? Or what about the way THEY control production, which in turn affects SUPPLIES, which in turn affects PRICES AT THE PUMP!!!!!! Hmmmmmm......that seems pretty easy for me to understand, but then again, the people of this nation who just simply HATE bush, either refuse to present a rational/TRUTHFUL explanation of their thinking for the purposes of a MEANINGFUL debate, OR, and this is what I believe, simply do not understand the basic principals of how our Government is structured, and is SUPPOSED to operate. Does Bush/Cheney get straight As in relation to this?? Absolutely... NOT!!! But, in the grand scheme of operating our government, this team is much better qualified!!! (in my opimion, of course). My biggest concern is when people "vote their EMOTIONS". (As in hating Bush). This, my friend is DANGEROUS!!! GOOD DAY!!!!!

 

[diogenes]

IIRC, OPEC was alive and well under Clinton.

How does Exxon post record profits?

http://www.detnews.com/2004/business/0407/30/b03-227323.htm


I understand that, as the cost per barrel increases, consumer prices increase - the business must pass its increased costs on to the customer.

But how do profits increase in that scenario?

Assume Acme Oil bought oil for $ 10 a barrel last year, and sold refined gas for $1 a gallon. Assume Acme posted a million dollar profit.

Assume this year, oil costs Acme $20 per barrel. It would stand to reason refined gas would also double to $2 a gallon. Assuming Acme approximated the same volume of sales, their profits would still be one million dollars, right?

The ONLY way ACME could post a higher profit this year would be if they charged $2.50 or $3 for the refined product.

If ACME were to do such a thing, a friend in the White House would be a good thing. No need to sweat any DOJ or SEC investigations. Or war-profiteering charges.

 

[Seatacus]

what major legislation has kerry authored...duh...

[post="174704"][/post]​

I believe he co-authored an anti-gun bill that would have banned the shotgun he was waving around yesterday..............