American looking to "right-size" the company and staffing levels for the Fall and 2021

[eolesen]

UA's Kirby was on "Face The Nation" this weekend and reading between the lines, it seems that UA might not be interested in aid with strings attached. DL also came out and said no more loans with strings, so I wouldn't be betting on layoffs in Tech Ops being avoided unless the union and company come together like the pilots at UA just did last week.

 

[swamt]

We should all say a prayer for those Souls whose lives will be disrupted;
God, we pray for all those who have suddenly lost employment. There are many. We ask you to first give them peace and a settled confidence. Their natural response is to shock and then fear, and to begin questioning their abilities, the past accomplishments and their future prospects. Give them your encouragement today, and do so through surprising ways, both directly from your Spirit and through other people who come across their path. Build them up, as this situation has torn them down. Remind them of past victories, and awaken new dreams for their future. Give them – today – divine appointments with people who may be key in opening a new future for them. Give them hope; lighten their step; lift the anxiety from their body; give them sleep and an unexpected joy. God, you intend us to have a purposeful life. You give us work assignments to accomplish because you designed us to help you create and sustain your creation. We are not made for idleness or sloth. We need meaningful work. So for all those who have lost a job, today bring them one step closer to a new direction. Show them any areas in their own character that need to change in order for their destiny to be realized. Then give them the wisdom and power to make those changes, by your Spirit. Today is a new day with new possibilities. Let nothing stand in the way of your purposes in the lives of those who, without your assistance, cannot find their next course. We pray this in Jesus name Amen

AMEN brother, and thank you...

 

[swamt]

UA's Kirby was on "Face The Nation" this weekend and reading between the lines, it seems that UA might not be interested in aid with strings attached. DL also came out and said no more loans with strings, so I wouldn't be betting on layoffs in Tech Ops being avoided unless the union and company come together like the pilots at UA just did last week.

I do believe ALL the airlines said not interested if there were new strings attached to it. I am also thinking AA will not accept an offer of extending so they can still reduce as they need to with no more control from the gov. I did not know if UAL would follow that same boat, but as you say now, looks like they too may reject any future help and start the rifs too. I was expecting Delta to work thru it with their employees with agreements and still avoid rifs.
According to D757's post, it will get ugly come Oct 1st if UAL rejects any further help and the same at AA if they reject any future help.
FYI, SWA also said they wouldn't do it with new strings attached, so the gov would be stupid to try and go that route as it will just fail and all the rifs, layoffs and furloughs will get huge in the aviation industry if no airlines accept any future assistance for payroll. It's a no brainer to leave the strings out, otherwise they are just wasting their time and will still see massive job losses.

 

[1AA]

UA's Kirby was on "Face The Nation" this weekend and reading between the lines, it seems that UA might not be interested in aid with strings attached. DL also came out and said no more loans with strings, so I wouldn't be betting on layoffs in Tech Ops being avoided unless the union and company come together like the pilots at UA just did last week.

That's what I am afraid of that 2003 will repeat again. Concessions to avoid layoffs and BK. It didn't work out well for the TWU members then and I hope we don't go down that path again.

 

[robbedagain]

That's what I am afraid of that 2003 will repeat again. Concessions to avoid layoffs and BK. It didn't work out well for the TWU members then and I hope we don't go down that path again.

I hope for no CH11. But if people think bout this for a second....SW said their not taking the govt money. AA asks for it plus they want some of what SWA doesn't. The original loan alone is roughly just over 20.5 billion in debt. add in other debt. Scarce business travelers. Hefty losses. In my own personal opinion I believe CH11 bankruptcy is probably closer than ever. Esp when our raises are supposed to kick in in march on the DOS anniversary. n provided no more govt loan unless strings are gone.... any thoughts?

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

I hope for no CH11. But if people think bout this for a second....SW said their not taking the govt money. AA asks for it plus they want some of what SWA doesn't. The original loan alone is roughly just over 20.5 billion in debt. add in other debt. Scarce business travelers. Hefty losses. In my own personal opinion I believe CH11 bankruptcy is probably closer than ever. Esp when our raises are supposed to kick in in march on the DOS anniversary. n provided no more govt loan unless strings are gone.... any thoughts?

RobbedAgain;

SWA has a different structure than we do, 1 type aircraft and limited bases for maintenance so overhead is less. If your going to compare what we have then do it with DL & UAL. Global Carriers NOT Domestic/Regional carries. We got the $$ we were supposed to get due to current contract when the US Government aid was in place so why are you worried about next time? AA has or will have reduced the total number of employees across the board with all the union/nonunion members. So you are so worried that AA is going to Violate the new contract? Or is it that you don't TRUST this ASSociation going forward and you believe that they TWU/IAM will make yet another DEAL that will keep you from getting your next pay raise.

If you think AA will violate the contract file BK then all the employees will be in trouble. But if you think the ASSociation is going to make a deal to benefit them and screw you out of what is negotiated in our current contract then if you are part of the M&R workgroup YOU should be doing all you can to get AMFA cards signed so we can get rid of this Industrial Union Mess.

 

[robbedagain]

I'm not trying to compare SW as I know their structure is different. I'm more or less comparing us to DL n ual. I myself not too concerned bout CH11 but more so point out that things are more bleak n I find it quite interesting how AA wants not just another loan but wants more ....from what SWA has turned down. I've been telling my coworkers esp the young ones that now is time to prepare for the worst n hope for best. As for changing unions. I cannot help u or any maintenance as I'm fleet. I'm just simply voicing my opinion that this situation is far far worse than 9/11 n I want peeps to be prepared. I may have 23 yrs n at 42 yrs old I'm prepared for a furlough notice or transfer if I must. But til I get it if I get I just simply get prepped. Btw. Congratulations on ur retirement. Hope u enjoy it

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

I'm not trying to compare SW as I know their structure is different. I'm more or less comparing us to DL n ual. I myself not too concerned bout CH11 but more so point out that things are more bleak n I find it quite interesting how AA wants not just another loan but wants more ....from what SWA has turned down. I've been telling my coworkers esp the young ones that now is time to prepare for the worst n hope for best. As for changing unions. I cannot help u or any maintenance as I'm fleet. I'm just simply voicing my opinion that this situation is far far worse than 9/11 n I want peeps to be prepared. I may have 23 yrs n at 42 yrs old I'm prepared for a furlough notice or transfer if I must. But til I get it if I get I just simply get prepped. Btw. Congratulations on ur retirement. Hope u enjoy it

Robbed;

I for one hope that what ever happens to you and all the others in ramp/fleet does not seriously affect your families. Good Luck to you and all the ramp workers at AA.

I do plan on enjoying my time after AA, It will be nice NOT to say "Sorry I can't I have to work" Any longer. All the Holidays, Weddings, Graduations, and so much more we all missed during our time working in the airline industry.

 

[robbedagain]

Thank you for your kind words sir.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

Thank you for your kind words sir.

robbed'.
With 23 years, my guess is, UR not going anywhere. I thought you are in BWI. If you are, DCA is just down I-95, and PHL, up I-95 !

 

[robbedagain]

robbed'.
With 23 years, my guess is, UR not going anywhere. I thought you are in BWI. If you are, DCA is just down I-95, and PHL, up I-95 !

I'm currently in DCA. Although I do not believe I will be furloughed now. I always keep it in back of my mind because I feel there's always that chance. If things don't get better then I would fully expect furlough...or transfer to another hub. This is what I tell people at work is to prepare for worst n hope for best. I tell them to put down cities to go to to try keep job.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

The original loan alone is roughly just over 20.5 billion in debt. add in other debt.

no. to my knowledge, aa has applied for and borrowed apprx. $6.5 billion from the treasury dept.

the company had said that the payroll grants they received - covered 76% of payroll in the 2nd quarter. the grants don't have to be paid back.

 

[robbedagain]

No not hysterical at all. Just looking beyond oct bec the original loan ends sept 30. I actually did see an article online couple days ago the specifically mentioned AA n the debt. I'll try to find it again. I know all the airlines are hurting. Dl just yesterday began the same type program using their mileage program that AA did recently I'm surprised UA hasn't done that just yet. Or if they did I haven't heard

 

[eolesen]

...the gov would be stupid to try and go that route as it will just fail and all the rifs, layoffs and furloughs will get huge in the aviation industry if no airlines accept any future assistance for payroll. It's a no brainer to leave the strings out, otherwise they are just wasting their time and will still see massive job losses.

Here's the problem, though.

If the airlines go ahead and lay people off and/or reduce services, exactly what public interest is served by giving the airlines more money?

Congress does tend to give money away without thinking at times, but the fact that they had strings defined in the original legislation says to me they won't just give it away this time, and there's a good chance that if you have UA, WN, and DL saying no more federal funds, there's a good chance they'd be able to successfully lobby against a bailout that keeps AA alive at their expense.

Also, do remember that Doug Parker was the guy who skipped Trump's forum with airline executives back in 2017... DL, UA, WN, AS, and B6 all showed up. Parker chose to stay behind for internal meetings... Trump tends to have a long memory for snubs.

 

[swamt]

Parker just announced in press release after meeting with trump that starting Oct 1st layoffs will happen if no action by congress is taken. All airline CEO's were there...