American looking to "right-size" the company and staffing levels for the Fall and 2021

[D7571987]

Well at the UAL almost all of us mechanics got a rif notice, Im 1987 so in top 20% and I got one. They are saying since a station they are closing has a 1977 hire mechanic that everyone below him in seniority get rif. We have to select which stations we want in preference order, if not selected then youll be laid off regardless of senoirity.

 

[dfw gen]

Well at the UAL almost all of us mechanics got a rif notice, Im 1987 so in top 20% and I got one. They are saying since a station they are closing has a 1977 hire mechanic that everyone below him in seniority get rif. We have to select which stations we want in preference order, if not selected then youll be laid off regardless of senoirity.

Sorry to hear that, over at aa we wait for the mess to start

 

[Kev3188]

Well at the UAL almost all of us mechanics got a rif notice, Im 1987 so in top 20% and I got one. They are saying since a station they are closing has a 1977 hire mechanic that everyone below him in seniority get rif. We have to select which stations we want in preference order, if not selected then youll be laid off regardless of senoirity.

Sorry to hear that! What station(s) are closing?

 

[swamt]

Well at the UAL almost all of us mechanics got a rif notice, Im 1987 so in top 20% and I got one. They are saying since a station they are closing has a 1977 hire mechanic that everyone below him in seniority get rif. We have to select which stations we want in preference order, if not selected then youll be laid off regardless of senoirity.

Hate to hear this D. Your not at the station closing, are you?
A station is closing with a 1977 hire date mechanic? So meaning he too will have to bid another location? Hard to believe that a 43 year man/woman would have to be worried about bidding somewhere else. Is the 43 year person not taking the buyout offer?
Seems to me all the mechs at the station closing should be able to bid to wherever their seniority would take them and then let the trickle bidding begin. Maybe it's written different in the UAL contract.
I'm afraid it is going to get ugly come this fall IF the congress does not get on the ball and extend the assistance going into spring next year.
Keep us posted D...

 

[Real tired]

Cobra rates for LUS, BCBS of Texas, 80/20 plan, single, dental, vision:
$500-600per month.

 

[jimntx]

Think they will use any of that pre funding money for the $100,000?

I suggest a wait and see posture. I don't think any airline would offer a package that would bankrupt the airline. Sorta defeats the purpose of an early out package, don't you think? If a $100,000 package is offered, I think there will be a limitation stipulated in the offer before a dime changes hands. Something like $100,000 to the first 1000--either seniority or first come first served to decide who gets the package. Then a "less generous" offer for others. This would get people to decide quicker on go or stay question because even if it's done by seniority there will still have to be a certain amount of first come, first served if you have 1001 with the same seniority.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

I'm afraid it is going to get ugly come this fall IF the congress does not get on the ball and extend the assistance going into spring next year.

I don't understand why people have an expectation of Congress to cover payroll for employees an airline said it does not need.

 

[jimntx]

I don't understand why people have an expectation of Congress to cover payroll for employees an airline said it does not need.

Good Point!

 

[swamt]

I don't understand why people have an expectation of Congress to cover payroll for employees an airline said it does not need.

Which airline said, "they don't need assistance?" Or even, "they don't want assistance?" Only quotes I have read and seen are from the A4A group where the airlines said they would support more assistance from the gov as long as they didn't attach any new restrictions tied to them. Airlines do want another round of assistance because when they play by the rules and regs for getting said assistance they are usually turned into grants as long as they stay away from the layoffs, furloughs and pay cuts.
Now if you are referring to SWA saying it, I don't recall that. I do recall that it was stated that SWA has enough cash to last 2 years with the current amount of losses, but that's not saying they don't want the assistance. Matter fact SWA has spoken up in support of the unions asking for further assistance and an extension.
I could also see AA and possibly UAL not accepting that assistance IF it is voted to extend it, as they know that they would have to layoff and/or furlough and cut wages and benefits to still get the airlines "right sized". AA has already said no matter how many take the outs and leaves that they will still be 20,000 employees too heavy and that is most likely due to the merger with US Airways that they never did shed. Just not sure about UAL's intentions, but with almost all of their mechanics getting notices as D757 said, it does look like they are CYAing and are preparing to do what AA is going to do come Oct. 1st.
Here's more from our CEO. Nowhere in this memo does it say anything about not wanting assistance or an extension...

https://www.yahoo.com/news/southwest-ceo-says-airline-intensive-183927566.html

 

[Ground Interrupt]

Which airline said, "they don't need assistance?" Or even, "they don't want assistance?" Only quotes I have read and seen are from the A4A group where the airlines said they would support more assistance from the gov as long as they didn't attach any new restrictions tied to them. Airlines do want another round of assistance because when they play by the rules and regs for getting said assistance they are usually turned into grants as long as they stay away from the layoffs, furloughs and pay cuts.
Now if you are referring to SWA saying it, I don't recall that. I do recall that it was stated that SWA has enough cash to last 2 years with the current amount of losses, but that's not saying they don't want the assistance. Matter fact SWA has spoken up in support of the unions asking for further assistance and an extension.
I could also see AA and possibly UAL not accepting that assistance IF it is voted to extend it, as they know that they would have to layoff and/or furlough and cut wages and benefits to still get the airlines "right sized". AA has already said no matter how many take the outs and leaves that they will still be 20,000 employees too heavy and that is most likely due to the merger with US Airways that they never did shed. Just not sure about UAL's intentions, but with almost all of their mechanics getting notices as D757 said, it does look like they are CYAing and are preparing to do what AA is going to do come Oct. 1st.
Here's more from our CEO. Nowhere in this memo does it say anything about not wanting assistance or an extension...

https://www.yahoo.com/news/southwest-ceo-says-airline-intensive-183927566.html

SWA
Don’t believe he said the airlines don’t need assistance, he said employees an airline says it doesn’t need. Layoffs I believe is what he I said talking about.

 

[Ground Interrupt]

I believe his point is why should taxpayers flip the bill for airline payrolls when they are now over staffed.

 

[Talos]

Could be the govt waits till after layoffs and then addresses the airline situation. The covid problem has proven to be so severe and damaging the govt may have to look at handling airlines in a different way.

 

[robbedagain]

With the situation in airlines n pax drop off fall n winter approaching not to mention upticks in virus I have to wonder if the bankruptcy card are in the next round for airlines

 

[Talos]

With the situation in airlines n pax drop off fall n winter approaching not to mention upticks in virus I have to wonder if the bankruptcy card are in the next round for airlines

Moderna has a stage 3 trial for their vaccine started. This would take time and October will be here before a vaccine I would think. This could force the govt to act if the present trend continues in pax levels. I doubt they want bankruptcy as they have built up their liquidity as well as mgmt would most likely be out of a job. Maybe just keep laying people off till they stop the bleeding. It's as ugly as it gets.

 

[V.O. Reason]

Moderna has a stage 3 trial for their vaccine started. This would take time and October will be here before a vaccine I would think. This could force the govt to act if the present trend continues in pax levels. I doubt they want bankruptcy as they have built up their liquidity as well as mgmt would most likely be out of a job. Maybe just keep laying people off till they stop the bleeding. It's as ugly as it gets.

I don’t see the bankruptcy option coming for at least a year.
Yes as you say that is not something the government wants because they too would be losers with all the money they pumped into them.
I think we will see creative ways to help the airlines hopefully to avoid more layoffs but then who knows.
This is completely unknown territory for all the airlines