American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[WeAAsles]

I guess it's ok for pilots to concerned ONLY about pilots, but when mechanics seek to do the same, all we get from you is ridicule.


I agree, but not much we could do about it.


They love being self insured. Money makes money.


Not sure of any bridges in FLA that can compete with the BB as far as character goes.



Where in my post did bring up wages and what anyone makes????????????????????


You said it yourself...."Raise your wages, get some of it back in higher medical or productivity"


OUR negotiations are being held hostage by LUS medical...
Their concern is MEDICAL.....Ours is SCOPE....They already have higher outsourcing than we do while we have higher medical costs!

# 1 Pilots are barely on here. Just 3 guys that post weird stuff. And Pilots also aren’t jumping in all over and LIEING about the Union I also belong to. And you know why I’m doing that let’s not play dumb man. (swamt)

# 2 I was answering your question about the IAM keeping their Medical to us not getting it. That’s a part of Compensation. Although I extremely doubt that would happen, “I” could care less. But I also know “I” would be in the extreme minority with that thought. (People have to compare because it’s their nature)

# 3 THEIR Negotiations are being held hostage by LAA Scope. We already have higher Medical costs than they do while they have higher outsourcing!

It’s not really hard to view the narrative through a prism if you think of putting on those glasses.

BTW Economically the SCOPE costs a hell of a lot more to the Company than the Medical so which one do you think they would relish getting more?

 

[WeAAsles]

Nothing a trip to a bankruptcy court couldn't fix.
Do you truly believe we will ALL get the LUS medical?

BTW, your post should include SMF! Not SMH.

The IAM LUS Medical costs that they pay right now? Frankly no I don’t think that’s what will ultimately be negotiated. But I expect “something” to be negotiated?

Hell we could negotiate to have completely free Medical but I doubt the Company is going to keep that wage offer on the table.

We could also (Don’t know if they can Legally) negotiate to have no Medical coverage at all but I want a much higher wage than what’s on the table right now.

Let me ask you this way Metal.

Do you think we HAVE to pay what we (LAA) currently are paying and what my “rumor” says we’re going to pay next year?

 

[MetalMover]

The IAM LUS Medical costs that they pay right now? Frankly no I don’t think that’s what will ultimately be negotiated. But I expect “something” to be negotiated?

Hell we could negotiate to have completely free Medical but I doubt the Company is going to keep that wage offer on the table.

We could also (Don’t know if they can Legally) negotiate to have no Medical coverage at all but I want a much higher wage than what’s on the table right now.

Let me ask you this way Metal.

Do you think we HAVE to pay what we (LAA) currently are paying and what my “rumor” says we’re going to pay next year?

WeAAz, you seem to think I enjoy paying the higher medical......I assure you I do not!
I do not see the current management reversing course on the medical. Not being spineless here, just realistic.
In all fairness, our out of control medical costs started to rise under previous management. At one point we had an annual cap.
They love being self insured.

 

[MetalMover]

# 1 Pilots are barely on here. Just 3 guys that post weird stuff. And Pilots also aren’t jumping in all over and LIEING about the Union I also belong to. And you know why I’m doing that let’s not play dumb man. (swamt)

# 2 I was answering your question about the IAM keeping their Medical to us not getting it. That’s a part of Compensation. Although I extremely doubt that would happen, “I” could care less. But I also know “I” would be in the extreme minority with that thought. (People have to compare because it’s their nature)

# 3 THEIR Negotiations are being held hostage by LAA Scope. We already have higher Medical costs than they do while they have higher outsourcing!

It’s not really hard to view the narrative through a prism if you think of putting on those glasses.

BTW Economically the SCOPE costs a hell of a lot more to the Company than the Medical so which one do you think they would relish getting more?

I would have to see hard numbers comparing scope vs medical.

 

[WeAAsles]

WeAAz, you seem to think I enjoy paying the higher medical......I assure you I do not!
I do not see the current management reversing course on the medical. Not being spineless here, just realistic.
In all fairness, our out of control medical costs started to rise under previous management. At one point we had an annual cap.
They love being self insured.

Of course I don’t think anyone enjoys paying more for Medical. What bothers me though is that I think many people have convinced themselves that they have to pay more no matter what.

Metal as a single comparing my wages to what I would pay in out of pocket maximums isn’t going to Bankrupt me and frankly it’s a shrugging of my shoulders to be honest.

I DO though think about the guy with a Family who maybe his wife got Cancer and he has to take off a lot and how much it’s all costing him. And no I don’t think about the cost to the Multi Billion Dollar Corporation who’s bought back over 10 Billion Dollars in Stock honestly.

And to be honest I have zero clue about current management nor do I really care too much what they think as long as they generate revenue for the business and “continue” to compensate me well.

I would have to see hard numbers comparing scope vs medical.

No you don’t. All you have to look at is BLS statistics that state what the averages are for people who perform our work and then imagine if they could replace all 30,000 of us and pay out those wages and benefits to others.

They’re offering me $69,000 in wages and 401k. Meanwhile the average Baggage Handler is making around $24,000.

No way the Company is paying out $45,000 (Yearly) for any of my Medical expenses when before the Heart Attack I barely even used the benefit.

Edit: AMT’s

https://www.bls.gov/ooh/installatio...onics-equipment-mechanics-and-technicians.htm

 

[Tim Nelson]

We all know costs ALWAYS go up. Should we roll over and accept it? NO!
But I will say it again. I doubt very much the company will NOT reverse course and give 120,000 + people the cheaper LUS medical.
I'm not saying I enjoy paying higher premiums, but I'm being realistic here.
Sorry, WeAAz, If you think that will happen, well you know about that bridge in NY that might be up for sale!

And how do you feel with that 2020 guarantee that LUS keeps the cheaper medical while LAA people continually get screwed?

And how would you feel if we were to get a T/A tomorrow which, if voted in, would result in LAA medical for everyone but guaranteed LUS people the cheaper medical for the life of the contract?
How would you react?

Once again, being held hostage by the minority!

While I appreciate Weez blowing smoke up your As by having the back of lus health care, the reality of the situation is that you are correct. Yes, you guys are being held hostage but dont blame us because we are only going to keep our wonderful health care and catering if we keep kicking the can.

If I were twu i would be absolutely furious with the twu Garcia and peterson. Both of which keep getting promoted but staunchly supporting Sito. Maintenance will continue to be miserable in a fleet service union.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Are you a member???

I screenshotted your response. My attorney will be reviewing and and make any necessary calls. As a dues objector you sir still have to represent me and i plan on being very vigilant about this.

Now carry on boy.

 

[Tim Nelson]

You might be asking that to thousands before this is over.

he has no idea. Dude cant even be honest so i rooted him out. It was a pretty easy question but him and the other management shills dont have the decency to let those they represent who is exactly on the executive negotiation team.

Al, i have been really really kind to the association but i think i have to now mobilize a force against it. Im not the only one who is disappointed in this dictatorship. Watch.

 

[WeAAsles]

While I appreciate Weez blowing smoke up your As by having the back of lus health care, the reality of the situation is that you are correct. Yes, you guys are being held hostage but dont blame us because we are only going to keep our wonderful health care and catering if we keep kicking the can.

If I were twu i would be absolutely furious with the twu Garcia and peterson. Both of which keep getting promoted but staunchly supporting Sito. Maintenance will continue to be miserable in a fleet service union.

I don’t have the “back” of your LUS Healthcare. I merely support a lowering of the Healthcare costs for those that are in the LAA Family Plans. Particularly the Family Plans although I wouldn’t mind any percentage drop also being included to singles and spouse as well.

Otherwise how are you doing Tim? Are you ready to sign that TWU Local 512 dues check off card?

I’m hearing that the IAM is looking to charge you as an Association Member if you sign that card and join the TWU? Maybe you can set precedent?

What’s the max they can fine you if or when they find you guilty?

 

[charlie Brown]

I screenshotted your response. My attorney will be reviewing and and make any necessary calls. As a dues objector you sir still have to represent me and i plan on being very vigilant about this.

Now carry on boy.

Oooh, how about screenshotting your post 6150 when you stated you were no longer
A member of the IAM. Don’t worry I have it. It doesn’t state a dues objector. So I was just asking for clarification. Where does my post state your not represented. So one more time? Do you call yourself a non member? Or a dues objector? There is a big difference you know. Maybe you dont know!!

 

[bob@las-AA]

Take a break for chit sakes and visit my website, my portfolio is almost done. Y’all need a hobby.
www.rlbrooksphotography.com

 

[MetalMover]

Of course I don’t think anyone enjoys paying more for Medical. What bothers me though is that I think many people have convinced themselves that they have to pay more no matter what.

Metal as a single comparing my wages to what I would pay in out of pocket maximums isn’t going to Bankrupt me and frankly it’s a shrugging of my shoulders to be honest.

I DO though think about the guy with a Family who maybe his wife got Cancer and he has to take off a lot and how much it’s all costing him. And no I don’t think about the cost to the Multi Billion Dollar Corporation who’s bought back over 10 Billion Dollars in Stock honestly.

And to be honest I have zero clue about current management nor do I really care too much what they think as long as they generate revenue for the business and “continue” to compensate me well.

Many multi billion dollar corporations answer to their boards of directors and shareholders NOT their employees.
Can they afford the cheaper medical for all....YES!!!!
Will they? NO!

No you don’t. All you have to look at is BLS statistics that state what the averages are for people who perform our work and then imagine if they could replace all 30,000 of us and pay out those wages and benefits to others.

They’re offering me $69,000 in wages and 401k. Meanwhile the average Baggage Handler is making around $24,000.

No way the Company is paying out $45,000 (Yearly) for any of my Medical expenses when before the Heart Attack I barely even used the benefit.

Edit: AMT’s

https://www.bls.gov/ooh/installatio...onics-equipment-mechanics-and-technicians.htm

I would like to see what the company pays per employee medical and what dollar value scope costs them

 

[737823]

Incorrect:

April 7, 2009

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers (IAM) District 141 today exchanged opening contract proposals in Chicago with United Airlines for the carrier's 16,000 Ramp & Stores, Public Contact, Food Service, Maintenance Instructor, Fleet Technical Instructor and Security Guard employees. The current IAM agreements become amendable on Dec. 31, 2009.

"It has been nearly a decade since our members had an opportunity to propose changes to their collective bargaining agreements," says IAM District 141 President Rich Delaney. "Since our last negotiations, United abused the bankruptcy laws to extract $4.6 billion from our members. The challenge we face in these negotiations is bridging a canyon of distrust."

IAM District 141 conducted a pre-bargaining membership survey and received more than 50,000 proposals and recommendations from members. "The three main areas of focus during these negotiations will be job security, improved wages and improved benefits," says Delaney. IAM District 141's opening contract proposals and frequent negotiation updates will be available on the District 141 website, www.iam141.org.

IAM members were forced during United's three-year bankruptcy to accept a 13 percent wage reduction in 2003, as well as another 5.5 percent cut in 2005. Additionally, United terminated its employee pension plans in bankruptcy, although IAM members are the airline's only employees to successfully negotiate a replacement defined benefit pension plan, the IAM National Pension Plan.

Wow Weez you couldn’t be more off base. UA didn’t complete section six they went straight into JCBA negotiations once the IAM got to collect dues from sCO (administering IBT ageeement for ramp; no dues from unorganized passenger service until TA ratification)

That’s the opener of UA after bankruptcy. The CO merger wasn’t announced til early May 2010 and didn’t close until September 2010. The representation election was in July 2011, first April 2013 T/A was resoundingly defeated by membership, thanks to Tim’s education and outreach as today there would only be seven stations in scope. T/A 2 had some slight improvements and got ratified in November 2013, Oscar didn’t come until late 2015 and the agreement wasn’t opened until 2016.

Josh

 

[737823]

Roach getting excited about new dues payers at the NMB offices when the UA-CO vote was tallied:



Josh

 

[ALUS78]

he has no idea. Dude cant even be honest so i rooted him out. It was a pretty easy question but him and the other management shills dont have the decency to let those they represent who is exactly on the executive negotiation team.

Al, i have been really really kind to the association but i think i have to now mobilize a force against it. Im not the only one who is disappointed in this dictatorship. Watch.

Tim you should come out with your video after we vote on an agreement.Appeal to those IAM members who's medical is going up drastically. Ill probably do it because at 59 this might be my last contract so what am I gonna pay dues if I'm not going to vote on anything.