Aircraft maint issues

[AA89]

Maybe start a TWU card drive down there when the hangar is finished.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

I agree with you that SCOPE will be somewhere between LAA and LUS. That’s where the job loss will come from. (Or job movement in companyspeak)
Who does the line work overseas for LUS? Is it not outsourced?

It was a combination of Monarch, AA , LH, and UA, not sure who else.

I believe AA does it now.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

The TWU can’t do a card drive, one because of the Association agreement and second it’s an Article 12 Violation of the AFL-CIO Constitution.

 

[swamt]

SWAMT lets face it Tom has no credibility on this board. He has been caught in several lies so why would anyone believe anything that he has to say. He has done the same things that 700 did(the same person). He is one of those brain dead individuals (Industrial unionist) that wants someone else thinking for him. When I mentioned the fact that the iam only gave the members at usair 1 day to vote he said that was lie but he provided a link that proved him wrong and then when he was caught lying he said that is the way they always do it. I believe you and your coworkers have caught him in several lies also.

I know he doesn't. He is just a plant that came here in Nov for a reason. We will see more added once a T/A really does get presented, they too will be planted for the same mission. And just after you post this he adds a couple post that just proves all your statements above are correct. You just can't get a better verification then that, LOL...

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

Five years and rising.

Guess you have to criticize others since you want to hide AMFA’s failure in over five years in Section 6 Negotiations a WN, with no talks scheduled and no end in sight.

How’s that glass house?

Guess it’s built on ice like your Negotiations

 

[B737 driver]

So if I get this straight what you are saying is that your Leadership knows even if they don’t like a deal given from the Company if they send it out it will pass? So does that mean in reality they are holding the will of the Membership hostage by not releasing?

Also I recall you saying that the results of that poll would not be released publicly?

So let me ask you this. If your Leadership knows and has told you that whatever they put out to the Membership it would pass, does that mean that maybe the “REAL” results of that poll is the Membership wants to accept the deal from SWA Management?

It just means the scope will not be as bad, as the company originally wanted, little more money, and a bigger signing bonus.

 

[B737 driver]

The TWU can’t do a card drive, one because of the Association agreement and second it’s an Article 12 Violation of the AFL-CIO Constitution.

No but the membership could always sue forcing a vote they were promised, and then you have the TWU representing all of the mechanics.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

No but the membership could always sue forcing a vote they were promised, and then you have the TWU representing all of the mechanics.

Been tried and can’t happen.

Both documents are legal and binding.

Thanks for playing.

 

[swamt]

Yes I agree that at some point the membership should have the right to make the decision. From what it sounds like they are happy enough with the contract they have to wait the company out and had the looming ETOPS issue to use as leverage. I believe their leadership sent out a poll to the memebers to see where they stood on the issues too?
The SWA guys can straighten me out if those aren’t the facts but if true might explain their patience.

No correction needed, your correct. Our current contract is good enough where we are today. You know the other 3 top carriers all passed us in pay which our company was waiting for as they have admitted to us. Scope is the biggest issue, especially in Dallas as Dallas will be the most affected station for the company wants or must haves within scope. ETOPS is not the only leverage, as time goes on and gets closer and closer to maint time for the new birds entering our fleet, our leverages increases more and more as our current contract owns all the maint of all the new birds coming in. The co. has to have relief in certain areas in order to avoid a grievance nightmare imploding. AMFA has offered some relief in areas they need but refuses to give away the farm. I also think you guys will have a very sticky time with your scope as well, and may go longer than even what GP thinks.

 

[WeAAsles]

It just means the scope will not be as bad, as the company originally wanted, little more money, and a bigger signing bonus.

Well if you say so I guess?

You know driver if the Association at AA finishes up in the next few months if I’m right your group over there will be the last man standing?

I don’t think except for you there will be any open Negotiations going on at AA, UAL, DL or SWA?

Just you left out.

 

[WeAAsles]

Been tried and can’t happen.

Both documents are legal and binding.

Thanks for playing.

Once the Negotiations have finished and everyone has a good JCBA in place no one will care anymore.

 

[swamt]

Five years and rising.

Guess you have to criticize others since you want to hide AMFA’s failure in over five years in Section 6 Negotiations a WN, with no talks scheduled and no end in sight.

How’s that glass house?

Guess it’s built on ice like your Negotiations

Oh no Tom. The exact opposite. AMFA is standing up for the membership. It actually shows how bad AMFA will put up a fight for the members and not just agree to and cave to the company's wants. I know you are use to that type of negotiations of getting it done so quickly but look where that has gotten you over the years past. Even the TWU was successful in agreeing to huge concessions in 2003 by coming to an agreement with the company in less than one freakin month. No thanks to getting the quick contract thru, I'd much rather take our time and get it better in line with what the "membership" wants and not what the company "claims" they need to stay profitable. Again Tom, we will not just sit back and allow the company to gut our scope language, just as the Pilots stood up for in their contract. AMFA is willing to offer some relief but not all relief. If our company really wants to get to a deal then they must be willing to move on scope. Time is on our side. We will keep the current contract we have in place.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

Your Union is scared of two things:

1. A repeat of NW.
2. Members voting in a bad contract.

Must be nice not earning more and your buying power being diminished as costs goes up and your wages aren’t even staying in line with cost of living.

 

[topDawg]

# 1 I didn’t defend anything so pay attention and get off your high horse. All I did was give you the rest of the story that you seem to have gone on immediate defense for.

# 2 So far MetalMover seems to be the only one who got where I was going in my conversation on overseas vendors. Others like yourself may be a little bit more Cult-ured (Rah Rah Company) than you knew. When I become a Corporate Executive then I’ll start waving my Pom Poms.

1) I knew the rest of the story. As I said, you even bringing it up is a joke. It is even more of a joke when you are pissing and moaning about ACTUAL American employees doing aircraft maintenance. Fact is, your beloved industrial union screwed them. They did a **** job at United. The did a **** job at US air. The TWU has done a **** job at American and the only union that has actually had the balls to stand up to outsourcing, AMFA, your beloved **** unions got so butt hurt about AMFA not doing what the company wanted, they sold them out too. Fact of the matter is the only two airlines that have brought any meaningful amount of work in-house in the post 9/11 world is Southwest (AMFA) and Delta (non-union). United and American have done nothing but continue to send work out.

2) No I am just not economically stupid and I also actually work on the airplanes when they come back from a vendor vs company employees. That's not being rah rah company it is simply understanding how the business actually works.
Its a stupid hill to even walk up, much less try to die on.

If your union is worth a damn then they will keep track of the work done at the new hangar and will take the appropriate action if needed. Everything else you are talking about is just FUD.

Sounds like you think some of us are on the company’s side on outsourcing? If your position is that AA should keep all work in house, no one should disagree. We probably all also agree that that will never happen.
So we farm out 35% of overhaul to wherever management decides. Nothing we can do about that right now. I’m only saying as topDawg said that work done by AA employees, no matter what country, is going to be better than work done by a 3rd party MRO. I would say even a 3rd party MRO in the States.

exactly. Anyone who actually sees the work being done would be a fool to "not care". I'm one of the biggest scope hawks here.
Its not being a pro management person, its simply understanding that work is going to be done on the line out of the states and understanding that American (or Delta or United) employees are going to do better work than a vendor. TWU or no TWU.

but the no TWU is the real issue nothing WeAAsles. Not the other crap. If they were on the TWU list he wouldn't care about any of the other crap posted.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

DAWG,

Really?

AMFA has the highest amount of outsourcing at WN and AS farms out all heavy.

WN has under 3,000 mechanics for over 700 planes.

http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/amp/Alaska-Air-shuts-Oakland-base-340-maintenance-2726556.php

Great fight at AS, not.

AMFA has been at WN for around 15 years and only brought in one line in exchange for foreign outsourcing.

And I’m getting the numbers from flight safety committee