AFA topic 11/2-

[NoMoreKoolAid]

Fine, back it up with facts not just name calling and accusations. You disagree fine but at least have something to refute.

 

[drrstrav]

Fine, back it up with facts not just name calling and accusations. You disagree fine but at least have something to refute.

I know the person an observed his behavior the last 2.5 years, since he is on the West side of US airways operation.

If you do need more , ask specific from the MEC AFA66. Each coin has two sides.

 

[HP2USFA]

I have to agree - this person is quite the troublemaker over here in the West operations. I'm not going to out and out use names here - but I would advise everyone takes what HeartAirbus posts with several grains of salt.

At least here on the boards you can just click a new link... not much fun sitting in the hot-room with him at all... h34r:

 

[iheartairbus]

I have to agree - this person is quite the troublemaker over here in the West operations. I'm not going to out and out use names here - but I would advise everyone takes what HeartAirbus posts with several grains of salt.

At least here on the boards you can just click a new link... not much fun sitting in the hot-room with him at all... h34r:

1st off... I'm hardly known as a trouble maker over a few stupid rant posts.... So I take it your reserve as well by your "Not much fun sitting in the hot-room with him at all" .... I NEVER EVER sit in that stupid room... I mind my own business down the hall in the lunch/break room on my laptop and talking to fa's and friends as they pass though... I've never had a very foul or "poor taste" conversation in that break to make it so unbareable/"not fun" as you describe. So OBVIOUSLY you have not "sat hot" with me to know this to be true or you'd be in the lunch/break room hanging out w/ me and some friends. Souuuuuunds like someone else is stirring right now and for once it aint me....LOL

But seriously I rant/rave a few times a month and it's not meant to be harmful just putting the sh*t out there as it is called.... I did apologize to lisa though via, cuz it wasn't meant like that.... but handing out all the personal attacks about me being a trouble maker,pot stirrer when and if you knew me at work I'm hardly a trouble maker..... but I will say that I did use this to vent like anyone else does and if it hurt or someone felt it was mis-spoken that I do very much apologize it was about getting it out there to have people opinons on what is BEING said but quite a few f/a's regarding this and I wanted input it was a little harsh yes and that I'am sorry and being it is a rant not all facts are always there, but it doesn't mean it's not a legitimate rant/rave, but it was to get topic going about something that many are legitimatley concerned with. I apologized to lisa via e-mail and I know the role she has is tough, but a pot stirrer and trouble maker wouldn't go through the trouble to apologize for misspoken rant/rave. We all have them and it shouldn't be meant to personally attack, just like I shouldn't be attacked for just posting some rumor/rant/whats being said out there about the cancelled meetings and the whoopla surrounding the whole things. It was a misguided step on mislead believings by what I thought were reliable people.

 

[theFLYonthewall]

What do you guys think about Lisa LeCarre (west mec pres.) holding up all the f/a negotiations by cancelling the last 3 east/west/company talks... I think it's complete crap and she's got alot of nerve.... I've heard from several f/a's that she doesn't want the contract to go through or make a whole lot of head way in talks because she wants to protect the "senior" ppl by stalling, thus preventing the transfer in of "more" senior f/a's into phx. She is a joke and I'm ebarrassed we voted her in. By the way her husband is a west pilot and so obviously influences her alot at home as with what to do/say about our negotiations. East and there mec/lec's need to know she is only out for herself and the top numbers on phx seniority list.

How will she explain to her members while trying to protect their "precious" PHX for the duration of their current contract, they will do without a pay raise, without better duty rigs, without a better livable reserve system and the list goes on. All of those things and more her members will do without until their current contract expires (3 MORE YEARS). This will happen, eventually. Why would she deny her members better wages, working conditions, work rules etc to protect PHX from being open to transfers? Does she think maybe some of her members would like to leave PHX and see more of the world? I realize to those in PHX you think its the mecca, but guess again. There is more flying opportunity in PHL and CLT then PHX will ever see. The majority of us on the East go where the flying is, sorry guys but its not PHX.

Yes you will see some former PSA flight attendants who are in their final few years of flying want to go to PHX to lessen their commute time, a few who already live there who have commuted for years to the East coast. Maybe a few will pack up and move for a better climate. There cannot be a bump and flush, PHX will only be open for transfers when they have a need for additional flight attendants. If 50 people transfer out, then 50 people will be able to transfer in.

What is really going to hit the fan is when the East membership realizes "she" is holding up "our" negotiations as well. I have NO intensions of working under this current contract any longer then necessary. I want a contract and I want it NOW. She is really going to tick off 5000+ flight attendants by holding up these negotiations. I am involved enough in the union to understand she is fighting for her membership, but she is fighting a lost cause. While protecting PHX she is denying them a pay increase, along with everything else a single agreement will provide them. I cannot believe the members of Council 66 would want to continue to work under their current contract for 3 more years, just to protect PHX from a few transfers. I would tend to think if she brought to their attention the benefits they will gain from a single agreement they would want her to get in there and negotiate for them. If I was a Council 66 flight attendant I would gladly give up a few slots of seniority for a pay raise, better duty rigs, better reserve system etc etc etc. I would be sorely upset to know that she is allowing the East to control the talks because she isn't there.

 

[safety stud]

While I am disappointed in 3 canceled sessions I completely understand what a mother hen would do to protect her own which is the entire West. Lisa was elected with the direction of not allowing anyone to cross into the Arizona property and it's what she ran on.

Baja,

You must look at the bigger picture. Stalling the negotiations hurts both sides. With the USAPA DOH, and the 10 year fence, the Me-Too Clause has done it to us again. Regardless of when we sign our contract, The pilots have made their choice and elected to put up an unrealistic fence that hinders both sides. The East/West operations won't run under the present contracts for us until Both AFA and USAPA have similar or different duty rigs and limitations. You won't be able to see a West Cockpit and an East Backend crew work together. And vissa verssa. Neither will you be able to see our contract change to parting to the relationship with the cockpit unless we change it on East side. We control the numbers for a joint contract. 50% plus one....

On the West, you also control the talks by negotiating. Should AFA reach a contract and the same with the pilot group, and the Me-Too clause sticks around in the language... We will still have a 10 year fence on the property because of the pilot group. The present language of the contract won't allow the synergy the company wants unless the pilot group drops the fence and allows a realistic timeline for transfer to SANDCASTLE. And by the way, I would be willing to bet the more senior F/A's at the west are dying to do EUROPE. Why would any LEC president limit its group on the ability to fly internationally? If you figure the pay alone, the PHX president is stifelling its members. Shame....

Just my opinion...

 

[HP_JACK]

Oh NO he didn't! Iheartairbus is a total liar. He is a junior reserve who continues to act like he came from mainline US Airways east when he came from a regional. Everything out of his mouth is the same "The way we did it back East...." Blah Blah Blah.
I do think it was pointed out that a negotiator had a family medical issue or emergency that they needed to tend to and thats why those sessions were cancelled. Which I'm sure IHeart could've called the local Office if he was so concerned about those sessions. No, IHeart YOU choose to come on here and spread false notions and as usual STIR THE POT!
Lisa Lecarre was voted in overwelmingly and so were the other 2 officers on the platform they would bring change into the office. I think they have done a remarkable job considering the lack of ... I mean NO transition that the previous officers gave them. Whatever reasons you don't support Lisa she's your president of your local council. You need to communicate your issues with her and not come on here and stir the pot. Hiding behind a screen name making statements such as yours will always be "stirring the pot" ,and trouble. Which I think is cowardly! No worries IHeart those of us who post on the local board on AFA66 know who you are and you know that, you realize you have no captive audience anymore so you come over here. Please don't waist their time either Child!

 

[Sustantivo]

I am reserve on the West Side who took a VLOA for November because I could not pay my bills on the amount of company time that is presently available to us. I tried to pick up as much time as possible from the ETB but you would check and check and practically nothing would be available. I was driving into the airport to do AUTOS that would total between 2:30 and 3:30 hours of credit per day. Tying up an entire day for that amount of credit didn't work it so I VLOA and moved home with the parents. It was a sad but good decision. I was making so little that I going under fast.

Plus the toxic attitudes the flight attendants, the name calling is so Mean Girls Jr. High School, so it was somewhat of a relief to take a break even though I love flying.

In the long hours of the Hot Room we looked at the East Contract online and compared the pay their with the pay on the West. If I was on the East I would have made $370 more per month in my last 2 months flying using their pay scale and their 73 hour guarantee. I move up in longevity with in 2 more years the difference is $505 more per month. We were surprised.

If their ever are Furloughs it will be the reserves who go. The East contract has Furlough pay, at least enough to get you through a month or 2. The West furloughs will get nothing. So your typical reserve here can't save anything and won't get anything if the worst happens.

The contact is very important to those of us on the bottom.

Everyone talks about everyone else lying. What is the truth? Both the East and West Negotiation updates say that in both September and October that the MEC met with each other but not the company. Is this normal?

I pay my dues when on VLOA as it is my responsibility to do so. Isn't equal pay for equal work one of the basic responsibilities of the Union? I don't want to feel resentment against people I don't even know but it feels bad to wear the same uniform and yet be paid so much less.

I understand that the senior people do not have the same pressures as the reserves, their quality of life is something they want to preserve. I understand that the Unions want us to be patient so they can get the very best of both, But for the reserves time is running out at our present rate of flying time available and take home pay.

Happy Holidays to you all.

 

[theFLYonthewall]

I am reserve on the West Side who took a VLOA for November because I could not pay my bills on the amount of company time that is presently available to us. I tried to pick up as much time as possible from the ETB but you would check and check and practically nothing would be available. I was driving into the airport to do AUTOS that would total between 2:30 and 3:30 hours of credit per day. Tying up an entire day for that amount of credit didn't work it so I VLOA and moved home with the parents. It was a sad but good decision. I was making so little that I going under fast.

Plus the toxic attitudes the flight attendants, the name calling is so Mean Girls Jr. High School, so it was somewhat of a relief to take a break even though I love flying.

In the long hours of the Hot Room we looked at the East Contract online and compared the pay their with the pay on the West. If I was on the East I would have made $370 more per month in my last 2 months flying using their pay scale and their 73 hour guarantee. I move up in longevity with in 2 more years the difference is $505 more per month. We were surprised.

If their ever are Furloughs it will be the reserves who go. The East contract has Furlough pay, at least enough to get you through a month or 2. The West furloughs will get nothing. So your typical reserve here can't save anything and won't get anything if the worst happens.

The contact is very important to those of us on the bottom.

Everyone talks about everyone else lying. What is the truth? Both the East and West Negotiation updates say that in both September and October that the MEC met with each other but not the company. Is this normal?

I pay my dues when on VLOA as it is my responsibility to do so. Isn't equal pay for equal work one of the basic responsibilities of the Union? I don't want to feel resentment against people I don't even know but it feels bad to wear the same uniform and yet be paid so much less.

I understand that the senior people do not have the same pressures as the reserves, their quality of life is something they want to preserve. I understand that the Unions want us to be patient so they can get the very best of both, But for the reserves time is running out at our present rate of flying time available and take home pay.

Happy Holidays to you all.

You shouldn't resent those of us on the East at all! WE didn't negotiate the contract you work under. Turn around and look at "our" management, they are they ones that we should all be turning our resentment too. Equal pay for Equal work is what the union is trying to do in a single agreement. Think of how much faster that could be done IF the East and West could find common ground and organize ourselves to stand behind our negotiating teams and get this finished. As long as there is a continues to be a line seperating us at the AZ border the company is in complete control. As long as Council 66 has a President who wants to patrol that border you will not get a pay raise. Both contracts remain in effect until Dec. 2011, that is 3 more years. Do you want to wait a mininum of 3 more years, do you want to work under your current contract for 3 more years?

For the record, we have reserves living on dog food because thats all they can afford. They may make $300-500 dollars more a month, thats nothing being based in NYC or PHL for that matter. We certainly feel your pain, thankfully you have family that can help you out. I'm sure that wasn't an easy decision to make. Hang in there, call your President, organize your members.

United we will STAND
Divided we will FALL-proof of that is its been 3 years since this merger and it doesn't take 3 years to negotiate a contract.

 

[WCT]

You have it all wrong!! Our contract at Union 66 expired in 2004!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not 2011! We are on a very stale contract, HELLO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?????????????????????? You on the East are getting some of your money back UNTIL 2011, America West employees NOTHING! Our Senior folks have been Topped out for 10yrs at 38 dollars!! Give me a break! PHL, CLT, BOS , whatever???! Cry me a River, we still make LESS!!!!
Negotiate and get US pay Parity on the West, NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

 

[theFLYonthewall]

You have it all wrong!! Our contract at Union 66 expired in 2004!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not 2011! We are on a very stale contract, HELLO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?????????????????????? You are getting some of your money back UNTIL 2011, America West employees NOTHING! Topped out folks for 10yrs at 38 dollars!! Give me a break! Negotiate and get US pay Parity on the West NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

I beg your pardon, but this is the EAST flight attendants fault, why? We can't give you a pay raise. Its your management running this dog and pony show.

We do have yearly pay increases that has been negotiated into our current contract, again its not our fault that the West is in the position you are in.

As I said get yourselves organized and get your negotiators at the bargaining table and get it done! We would all like to see a new contract, yesterday. Can we at least agree on that?

 

[aredeeyou22]

Relax! I don't see anywhere in Sustantivo's post where he/ she is blaming the East or resenting the East. He/ she is just presenting the hard facts, and saying we need a joint contract! Sheesh....

Well said, Sust. We on the East are with you: Our contract may look better $ wise, but it lacks in other places too, and reserve life is not much better.

 

[Sustantivo]

You shouldn't resent those of us on the East at all! WE didn't negotiate the contract you work under. Turn around and look at "our" management, they are they ones that we should all be turning our resentment too. Equal pay for Equal work is what the union is trying to do in a single agreement. Think of how much faster that could be done IF the East and West could find common ground and organize ourselves to stand behind our negotiating teams and get this finished. As long as there is a continues to be a line seperating us at the AZ border the company is in complete control. As long as Council 66 has a President who wants to patrol that border you will not get a pay raise. Both contracts remain in effect until Dec. 2011, that is 3 more years. Do you want to wait a mininum of 3 more years, do you want to work under your current contract for 3 more years?

For the record, we have reserves living on dog food because thats all they can afford. They may make $300-500 dollars more a month, thats nothing being based in NYC or PHL for that matter. We certainly feel your pain, thankfully you have family that can help you out. I'm sure that wasn't an easy decision to make. Hang in there, call your President, organize your members.

United we will STAND
Divided we will FALL-proof of that is its been 3 years since this merger and it doesn't take 3 years to negotiate a contract.

I did not write it correctly. I did not mean that I resent the East Flight Attendants, I meant that the situation feels bad as a whole.
Because I have not been here many years I may see myself differently than other west flight attendants. The recriuters presented the job to us as having the opportunity to transfer to other bases, doing International flying is something I want to do. I once had a expectation of that happening but it seems to be still far away.

The best I can do with the present situation is the VLOA and when I do fly I try to talk to as many flight attendants as I can, East, West, Deltas, Americans and all to get information as to what to expect from here.

Sorry if I sounded like a resentful of the any one group. That is exactly what I do not want and don't like being around.

 

[USCREW]

You have it all wrong!! Our contract at Union 66 expired in 2004!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not 2011! We are on a very stale contract, HELLO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?????????????????????? You on the East are getting some of your money back UNTIL 2011, America West employees NOTHING! Our Senior folks have been Topped out for 10yrs at 38 dollars!! Give me a break! PHL, CLT, BOS , whatever???! Cry me a River, we still make LESS!!!!
Negotiate and get US pay Parity on the West, NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

It is really sad that the West wants parity with the East considering how we have lost so much. Many on the East do not consider this contract livable. It's a far, far cry from what it once was. I can't imagine being on the Wests' pay, it's insulting.

 

[FlyGuyBWI]

It is really sad that the West wants parity with the East considering how we have lost so much. Many on the East do not consider this contract livable. It's a far, far cry from what it once was. I can't imagine being on the Wests' pay, it's insulting.

So true. Even with it's faults, I expect most of us would like to have the East 2000 agreement back the way it was before BK1&2.