AAL Stock

[MetalMover]

I have been told that we (TWU) will not be forced into the IAMPF but it may be made available as an option if you want it. If that occurs more than likely it would be at a cost somewhere else in your retirement options? Say no more match to your 401k. Some people are enamored with the word Pension and may feel that is something they would feel more comfortable being a part of? The IAM members I very much doubt will be given the option to convert to a 401k match against the pension? A multiemployer pension has to have and hopefully gain participants to continue the promised payouts. 

Our pension will more than likely never (And hopefully not) be unfrozen. The reason why I say that is because there are too many laws that assist a company in not having to keep that pension fully funded. And as we should all have been made aware ours was almost thrust on the PBGC due to that underfunding. Had that happened we would have not received our full vested payments when we went to collect. Ask others in our industry who are now at the mercy of the PBGC how much of their pensions were lost and it's quite an eye opener and quite sad.

This is why I am questioning who contributes to the IAMNPF. After JCBA, there will be those who have a PBGC pension plus IAMNPF and those of us who will have to rely on the frozen DB plus 401k. 
As for 401k in general, it is all fine and well for a younger worker who can weather the ups and downs of the market throughout his/her working life. But for those of us who are closer to retirement and older, the 401k will most likely not produce ample returns. that is why the word "pension" is more important to us.

 

[WeAAsles]

This is why I am questioning who contributes to the IAMNPF. After JCBA, there will be those who have a PBGC pension plus IAMNPF and those of us who will have to rely on the frozen DB plus 401k. 
As for 401k in general, it is all fine and well for a younger worker who can weather the ups and downs of the market throughout his/her working life. But for those of us who are closer to retirement and older, the 401k will most likely not produce ample returns. that is why the word "pension" is more important to us.

Unfortunately if you do your research and reading you will find that a Pension is no longer a promised panacea for a secure retirement. There are now far too many stories of those benefits being taken away or almost completely wiped out in both the Public and Private sector to mention.

Your best bet for the most secure retirement you can possibly muster has to exist as a multi pronged approach. IRA's. ROTH IRA's, 401K's, Pension, Property and Social Security. You should also consider WHERE you are willing to retire and modifying your lifestyle?

On the where. Just because you were born or live and like a certain place you are currently in does not mean you have to remain there. The most dramatic change would be considering a foreign Nation as a choice. I personally have been thinking Belize or Columbia but still have 13 years to make that decision. Don't forget you will be retiring from an airline and have the ability to fly anywhere in the world you want for free. You can always hop a flight to come home and hang with the Grandchildren if you like, or even come in to play a little golf with friends.

Here is a link though to get you started on researching the IAMPF if that becomes an option to you in the future. Remember to do some research outside of what you read just on their website though as that is usually wise.

http://mypension.iamnpf.org/

 

[Kev3188]

This is why I am questioning who contributes to the IAMNPF.

All participating employers.

If employees choose to no longer participate in the IAMNPF as part of a JCBA, then any current accruals will of course stand, and that amount will be almost akin to a frozen pension. That's what mine is like currently (from NW)...

 

After JCBA, there will be those who have a PBGC pension plus IAMNPF and those of us who will have to rely on the frozen DB plus 401k.

All the more reason that, IMO, a one-time choice on what you want to do going forward may be the best option.

As for those getting closer to retirement preferring a pension, I don't begrudge you guys one bit- that's a lot more years of deferred compensation than someone like me has (to say nothing of a 401k not even being available for a good part of your career)...

 

[NYer]

This is why I am questioning who contributes to the IAMNPF. After JCBA, there will be those who have a PBGC pension plus IAMNPF and those of us who will have to rely on the frozen DB plus 401k. 
As for 401k in general, it is all fine and well for a younger worker who can weather the ups and downs of the market throughout his/her working life. But for those of us who are closer to retirement and older, the 401k will most likely not produce ample returns. that is why the word "pension" is more important to us.

More accurately, there are over 1700 companies that contribute towards the IAMNPP.

To me, this is the troubling part of a multi-employer plan, "The maximum benefit that the PBGC guarantees is set by law. Under the multiemployer program, the PBGC guarantee equals a participant’s years of service multiplied by (1) 100% of the first $11 of the monthly benefit accrual and (2) 75% of the next $33. The PBGC’s maximum guarantee limit is $35.75 per month times a participant’s years of service. For example, the maximum annual guarantee for a retiree with 30 years of service is $12,870."

With a 401K, I can typically safeguard my investments, to a point, and would have a more hands on approach. The scary part of a multi-employer plan is not having the control over the funds above the guaranteed PBGC amount in the even the plan becomes insolvent without my current employer contributing towards it's demise.

That's a bit scary.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Exactly my point. I find it hard to believe that US is contributing on workers' behalf AFTER terminating their pensions being the sole contributor.

external pension funding is no different than the notion that lower health care premiums are a success for represented employees on the VERY SAME basis that airlines have to pay someone else for health care benefits; whatever is diverted for outside benefits (ie beyond vacation and time off policies which are "internal" costs is money that is not available for the employee.

 

[MetalMover]

external pension funding is no different than the notion that lower health care premiums are a success for represented employees on the VERY SAME basis that airlines have to pay someone else for health care benefits; whatever is diverted for outside benefits (ie beyond vacation and time off policies which are "internal" costs is money that is not available for the employee.

If $$ is coming out of my check to fund my pension, then I am, in fact, funding my own pension. Same with medical, $$$ comes out of my check for medical. I am funding, in part, my own medical.

 

[700UW]

If $$ is coming out of my check to fund my pension, then I am, in fact, funding my own pension. Same with medical, $$$ comes out of my check for medical. I am funding, in part, my own medical.

Lets see, Federal and State taxes comes out of your check.
 
Yet you dont have the power to tell either government on how to spend that money, now do you?

 

[robbedagain]

or better yet  we don't have the power to say to the govt or states that we do not want to have them taxes come out

 

[WorldTraveler]

If $$ is coming out of my check to fund my pension, then I am, in fact, funding my own pension. Same with medical, $$$ comes out of my check for medical. I am funding, in part, my own medical.

that is correct and precisely my point.

the difference is that with a DC pension plan and medical is that the company assumes part of the costs.

A in-house DB plan was entirely funded by the company; an external DB plan is purely an expense to the company for which they have no responsibility beyond making the deposit on your behalf.

or better yet we don't have the power to say to the govt or states that we do not want to have them taxes come out

that is correct

 

Lets see, Federal and State taxes comes out of your check.
 
Yet you dont have the power to tell either government on how to spend that money, now do you?

 
that is not.

If you are a US citizen, you have the right to vote and you have a representative in the House who is directly responsible to you for how the government spends its money.

 

[MetalMover]

Unfortunately if you do your research and reading you will find that a Pension is no longer a promised panacea for a secure retirement. There are now far too many stories of those benefits being taken away or almost completely wiped out in both the Public and Private sector to mention.

 

Yes, but it affects the workers  more than those at the top. They usually get to keep what they have, even in BK.....You know,,,they had "agreements" with their employer. Well, so did we, but our agreements mean squat compared to those at the top.

 

[jimntx]

Evidently, I'm not looking in the right place. Does anyone know what the new stock was valued at on the day it was first distributed to employees. I got 264 shares. I transferred the stock from JP Morgan to my financial advisor's system, but none of the "history" information transferred--such as the distribution price. I know you will be shocked, but JP Morgan is not interested in providing me the information since I moved my stock.

My financial advisor tells me that "around $40/share" is not sufficient for the IRS if I decide to sell the stock.

Thanks.

 

[MetalMover]

Evidently, I'm not looking in the right place. Does anyone know what the new stock was valued at on the day it was first distributed to employees. I got 264 shares. I transferred the stock from JP Morgan to my financial advisor's system, but none of the "history" information transferred--such as the distribution price. I know you will be shocked, but JP Morgan is not interested in providing me the information since I moved my stock.

My financial advisor tells me that "around $40/share" is not sufficient for the IRS if I decide to sell the stock.

Thanks.

$22.55
 
If you back into Compushare under Grants And Awards, you will see each distribution broken down after clicking on each transaction.
Why dies he/she mention $40 a share as not being sufficient?  I thought the more important factor would be long term vs short term for tax purposes.
Also remember the larger earnings are on the 12/9/13 distribution. 

 

[WeAAsles]

Evidently, I'm not looking in the right place. Does anyone know what the new stock was valued at on the day it was first distributed to employees. I got 264 shares. I transferred the stock from JP Morgan to my financial advisor's system, but none of the "history" information transferred--such as the distribution price. I know you will be shocked, but JP Morgan is not interested in providing me the information since I moved my stock.

My financial advisor tells me that "around $40/share" is not sufficient for the IRS if I decide to sell the stock.

Thanks.

I moved mine as well over to my Scottrade account. As Metal said though, the information is still there in your computershare (Yuck) account information.

 

[MetalMover]

For those who would like to locate and print each transaction..here are the steps...
 
1. Go to JP Morgan supersaver account
2. Select AMR Stock Options
3. Then Employee Grants and Awards . Click "VIEW ACCOUNT" to the right. 
4. Then GRANTS AND AWARDS from top menu,
5. You will see all the distributions under"RESTRICTED AWARDS AND UNITS
6. Click SELECT for each transaction. 
You will need these for the tax man.

 

[eolesen]

Nothing quite like making it easy to follow, eh?...