AA MD80s to be gone by end of 2017

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

That is correct. Crandall negotiated a great deal for the super80s. From the archives of the New York Times:


http://www.nytimes.com/1990/09/23/magazine/and-now-can-bob-crandall-have-it-all.html?pagewanted=3

That was written in 1990, and by the end of that decade, AA had acquired 260 of them. The purchase of TWA's assets in 2001 included another 100 of them and brought the total to 360 (minus the one hull loss at Little Rock).

An amazing airplane and key to AA's growth in the 1980s and 1990s.

 
I thought that maybe Carty was involved too.  Wasn't it Carty that said something along the lines of "you can't rape a willing soul" in reference to Douglas giving AA the sweet deal on the first 20 or so of the planes?

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

sound a lot like the deal Airbus gave Eastern to get the A300s. 

 
Right, I think Eastern got to use the A300s for free for half a year - or something like that.
But also while the A300 order was a winner for EA, I think the B757 was the new fuel efficient planes EA ordered just as fuel prices dropped and PeoplExpress & New York air were happy to fly old, cheap, fuel inefficient planes up and down the east coast.

 

[eolesen]

Don Carty negotiated the walkaway lease return deal with Douglas. Don't remember if he was just the VP of Planning at the time or if he was already the CFO.

That deal convinced Boeing to offer similar terms on the first batch of 762's.

 

[BigMac]

If I remember right..Crandall was all about the Fokkers and Carty was the 80 guy?

 

[topDawg]

 
Right, I think Eastern got to use the A300s for free for half a year - or something like that.
But also while the A300 order was a winner for EA, I think the B757 was the new fuel efficient planes EA ordered just as fuel prices dropped and PeoplExpress & New York air were happy to fly old, cheap, fuel inefficient planes up and down the east coast.

I believe that is correct. 

 

[OldGuy@AA]

If I remember right..Crandall was all about the Fokkers and Carty was the 80 guy?

Crandall did love the Fokkers (Pieces of crap) but he made a deal with Douglas for the MD80s.  He got "Favorable terms" by agreeing for AA maintenance to take the blame for the DC10 crash.  He threw all those mechanics and inspectors under the bus so he could save some money while taking Douglas off the hook for the crash.  There was a mechanic that committed suicide after AA took the blame.  

 

[commavia]

And while we're on the subject of hated former CEOs who negotiated insane aircraft deals for AA, let's not forget the massive 737/A320 order that Arpey and Horton engineered back in 2011.  Say what you will about both of them, but this might actually be the most impressive of them all - pulling off what was reported by the company and the press to be insanely attractive financing, delivery and support terms for essentially an entirely new fleet of airplanes at a time when AA's creditworthiness and access to the capital markets was probably at its lowest point in the entire deregulated era.  As someone commented at the time - they played Airbus off against Boeing to get each manufacturer's best possible deal, and then they took both deals.  That was some trick.  And, today, AA is reaping the benefits of those deals on a weekly basis:
 
"... [in 2014] we took delivery of 132 new aircraft ... that's larger than the vast majority of airlines in the world, that we took delivery of in a single year ... most of these are replacing aircraft ... we're retiring older MD80s and 767s ... and replacing them with a much better product, that not only is a much better product for our customers, it's much more economic for us ... the traditional ways you look at a fleet refresh is fuel and maintenance savings [and] while we have those, the thing that we didn't account for was lower interest rates ... we did a[n] EETC yesterday at under 350 basis points, that's less than half the cost we'd assumed for financing aircraft when we originally bought the airplanes, so we're saving a bunch of money just on financing cost for these aircraft ..." (Scott Kirby, American Airlines President, 3 March 2015)

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

And while we're on the subject of hated former CEOs who negotiated insane aircraft deals for AA, let's not forget the massive 737/A320 order that Arpey and Horton engineered back in 2011.  Say what you will about both of them, but this might actually be the most impressive of them all - pulling off what was reported by the company and the press to be insanely attractive financing, delivery and support terms for essentially an entirely new fleet of airplanes at a time when AA's creditworthiness and access to the capital markets was probably at its lowest point in the entire deregulated era.  As someone commented at the time - they played Airbus off against Boeing to get each manufacturer's best possible deal, and then they took both deals.  That was some trick.  And, today, AA is reaping the benefits of those deals on a weekly basis:
 
"... [in 2014] we took delivery of 132 new aircraft ... that's larger than the vast majority of airlines in the world, that we took delivery of in a single year ... most of these are replacing aircraft ... we're retiring older MD80s and 767s ... and replacing them with a much better product, that not only is a much better product for our customers, it's much more economic for us ... the traditional ways you look at a fleet refresh is fuel and maintenance savings [and] while we have those, the thing that we didn't account for was lower interest rates ... we did a[n] EETC yesterday at under 350 basis points, that's less than half the cost we'd assumed for financing aircraft when we originally bought the airplanes, so we're saving a bunch of money just on financing cost for these aircraft ..." (Scott Kirby, American Airlines President, 3 March 2015)

Those aircraft are being paid for by TWU "GIVE"backs (concessions). Never forget that.
 
When you see one of those shiny new aircraft take off don't forget your watching part of your pension (since it is frozen now), pay, and benefits float away for someone else's benefit.

 

[WorldTraveler]

you sure it is his pension or concessions at stake?

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

you sure it is his pension or concessions at stake?

I don't understand the intent of the question. Can you clarify?

 

[WorldTraveler]

this was your statement (emphasis mine) in response to Commavia's post
 

When you see one of those shiny new aircraft take off don't forget your watching part of your pension (since it is frozen now), pay, and benefits float away for someone else's benefit.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

this was your statement (emphasis mine) in response to Commavia's post

Yes, if he is an employee at American Airlines that was vested before the pensions were frozen.

 

[WorldTraveler]

is he?

 

[commavia]

He is not, not that it's in any way relevant.  But thanks for diverting yet another thread with meaningless red herrings.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I was pretty sure you weren't.

so YOU personally have incurred no personal cost for AA to obtain all of these new aircraft and YOU don't pay any price for AA's grandiose expansion plans.

OTOH, a lot of AA employees absolutely have taken concessions in order for AA to expand and buy aircraft well beyond its peers.