A letrer from USAPA's Law Firm (EAST THREAD 8/17-24)

[nostradamus]

AWA320 quote

"Your ideas are not in the companies nor the entire professions best interest. You place yourselves ahead of the whole. I bet none of you have given any thought at all to the precidence that would be set in dealing away an arbitrated decision have you???"

Nostradamus thoughts

I guarantee you because of the results of this Nicolau award no other pilot groups will ever, ever go to arbitration again.

I guarantee you the company's ideas, any company, are not in the best interests of any pilot group.

ALPA will not last the rest of the decade, pilot groups will each have their own union.

 

[AWA320]

AWA320 quote

"Your ideas are not in the companies nor the entire professions best interest. You place yourselves ahead of the whole. I bet none of you have given any thought at all to the precidence that would be set in dealing away an arbitrated decision have you???"

Nostradamus thoughts

I guarantee you because of the results of this Nicolau award no other pilot groups will ever, ever go to arbitration again.

And are you advocating that this is a bad thing?? Never put your fate in someone else's hands if you can help it...

I guarantee you the company's ideas, any company, are not in the best interests of any pilot group.

You missed the point there nos! My point was this, say you get fired for whatever reason and you go to arb to get your job back. The arbitrator awards you your job but the company doesn't want to honor the binding arbitration and wishes to just pay you 4 months salary instead to go away. You claim that you went to binding arbitration but the company sites a case where a binding award was negotiated away. This is a road much larger than our two pilot groups Nos and a road that I don't want to ever travel!!!

ALPA will not last the rest of the decade, pilot groups will each have their own union.

That remains to be seen however I have a feeling that ALPA will survive our little rift. Much bigger fish to fry brother...

 

[nostradamus]

I am sticking my toe in the water about getting fired all the time. Your threat does not intimidate me.

 

[nostradamus]

I can not find the add as signature spot.

 

[EastUS]

however what ain't fun is an MEC that fails it's membership.

Concur, but I feel that the entire "union" has miserably failed it's membership. Note the mess that we're all in at present.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

I want to be perfectly clear to you and I want you to save this post as proof. You can not win this decert, this is not just wishful thinking or some head game but truth. You can not and will not win.

You may be right, personally I hope your wrong. The only way to know for certain is to let it play out. You try your best to keep ALPA. I'll do mine to see it's removed.

 

[exB717Flyer]

I think what he meant was that even if you win (a decert), you'll still lose because the next union won't undue anything. The Transition Agreement is still in effect and a joint contract is still needed no matter which union is in place. It just seem so obvious to us Westies that you're shooting yourself in the nose to spite your face. But hey, have it your way.

 

[ussnark]

"About 640 so what's your point????"

Um, I show you at 314 hours. I guess that is "about" something, ain't it?

 

[ussnark]

I think what he meant was that even if you win (a decert), you'll still lose because the next union won't undue anything. The Transition Agreement is still in effect and a joint contract is still needed no matter which union is in place. It just seem so obvious to us Westies that you're shooting yourself in the nose to spite your face. But hey, have it your way.

Yes, the joint contract is, indeed, needed.

With a different "merger policy" from a different union, admittedly imposed on the westies, the "award" becomes moot and you get to thank the new union that they do not put all the westies at the bottom.

Have a good day, chump!

 

[AAA73Pilot]

I think what he meant was that even if you win (a decert), you'll still lose because the next union won't undue anything. The Transition Agreement is still in effect and a joint contract is still needed no matter which union is in place. It just seem so obvious to us Westies that you're shooting yourself in the nose to spite your face. But hey, have it your way.

That's still to be determined. Shooting myself? I doubt it. All I want is ALPA off the property, period. Then I'll take whatever happens. In previous posts I said I would even vote for the Dishwashers of America if it meant removing ALPA. But right now my only alternative is USAPA and they have my full support.

 

[hp_fa]

In my opinion, if the West does not want to negotiate a "realistic solution" to the Nicolau Award then it appears that ALPA is on the way to being thrown off both the East and West property and replaced with USAPA.

You don't get it. The Nicolau Award was the solution. The time for negotiations was before the Award and because East seemingly would not budge from DOH or Longevity and that position was unacceptable to West an arbitration panel decided the issue under ALPA guidelines and with East's concurrance.

 

[FWAAA]

You don't get it. The Nicolau Award was the solution. The time for negotiations was before the Award and because East seemingly would not budge from DOH or Longevity and that position was unacceptable to West an arbitration panel decided the issue under ALPA guidelines and with East's concurrance.

Agreed. What I find facsinating is that he seems to believe that he and the other East pilots can call the shots and somehow prevent the integration decision from ever being implemented. Further, he's operating under the delusion that switching unions will allow he and his colleagues to avoid the Nicolau award forever.

They don't seem to grasp the finality of "binding arbitration."

I wonder if Lee Seham has provided their group with a primer on binding arbitration.

 

[AWA320]

"About 640 so what's your point????"

Um, I show you at 314 hours. I guess that is "about" something, ain't it?

No you have me confused with someone else maybe someone on your property!!

 

[luvn737s]

AWA320,


I agree with Parker's thoughts and he happens "to believe that if we could get everyone together at the negotiating table, we could work something out that meets everyone's needs - though both sides would need to move some from their increasingly hardening positions.

I don't. The east can't be trusted to live up to their obligations, therefore they give up the right to be a party to negotiations. You must have the credible expectation that each party will live up to what they agreed to , or bargaining is meaningless.

 

[EastUS]

I don't. The east can't be trusted to live up to their obligations, therefore they give up the right to be a party to negotiations. You must have the credible expectation that each party will live up to what they agreed to , or bargaining is meaningless.

I guess that you're left with nothing but a crying towel and a fantasy based sense of self righteousness then.....sigh.