77D/2-cabin 772 enters service today

[AirLUVer]

AA's business class footprint is much larger than DL's.

 

[737823]

AA's business class footprint is much larger than DL's.

As it should be given that AA is a more premium focused airline serving a more premium centered network.

Josh

 

[WorldTraveler]

AA's business class footprint is much larger than DL's.

Since AA doesn't have an actual seat of the retrofit 777s on their website, I can't find it.

http://www.aa.com/i18n/aboutUs/ourPlanes/boeing-777-200-retrofit.jsp

the reconfigured AA 772s will have the same 37 lie flat business class seats as DL's .

DL's seat map is here

http://www.delta.com/content/www/en_US/traveling-with-us/airports-and-aircraft/Aircraft/boeing-777-200er-fb.html

with all due respect if AA takes up much more floor space than DL for seats that are very similar, then asking coach passengers to pay the price with a lot less room is not the way to win over the whole market.

and, you can say that AA is a more business focused airline but in the routes where AA and DL directly compete, DL gets as high as if not higher average fares.

so, if being more business focused is supposed to translate into higher revenue, then DL is the more business focused airline.

and regardless of what you want to call it, DL's 772s carry more passengers than AA's. and since DL's 777s are used to places like JNB, DXB, and SYD which AA doesn't serve, then it is even harder to say that AA is more business focused when it doesn't serve some of the same continents that DL and UA serve.

it doesn't take a whole lot of mental horsepower to figure out what advantage that provides to the bottom line.

 

[AdAstraPerAspera]

UNfortunately for Delta, their dated BusinessElite 777 seat awkwardly angles out towards the aisle rather than away from it, causing less privacy, comfort, and an inferior premium experience.

 

[737823]

UNfortunately for Delta, their dated BusinessElite 777 seat awkwardly angles out towards the aisle rather than away from it, causing less privacy, comfort, and an inferior premium experience.

And that's what they will be using JFK-TLV-my money is going to AC 787 or LX/LY.

Josh

 

[737823]

WT you are seriously going to challenge that the DL network is less premium focused than AA? Come on, just look the 16 seat premium cabins DL runs on JFK-LAX (that still go out full of non-revs). AA's network is centered around DFW/LAX/MIA/ORD/NYC with much if the international capacity delegated to EZE, GRU, HKG, LHR, and NRT all of which have significant paid F/J traffic. DL would kill to be in AA's position in regards to their position in the premium travel market. There's a reason AA is the only carrier offering 3-cabin service on transcons. What is DLs answer to Flagship Check-in? What is DLs answer to Concierge Keys? What is DLs answer to the Flagship Lounge?

Tell me this. Why are the new Amex Centurion lounges located adjacent to AA gate areas? Don't you think all the customer data Amex has collected from 2007-2014 when they allowed Admirals Club access shows Platinum/Centurion cardmembers largely fly AA? I mean seriously. We get you are emotionally attached to DL but the reality doesn't match your perception. I get my DL status from Amex (like many people), on AA people earn status the hard way they don't give it away like candy like over at DL.

Josh

 

[WorldTraveler]

UNfortunately for Delta, their dated BusinessElite 777 seat awkwardly angles out towards the aisle rather than away from it, causing less privacy, comfort, and an inferior premium experience.

yes, DL fixed the issue on the 330s but the issue is the amount of space that is used.

The 777 seat doesn't take up more space.

WT you are seriously going to challenge that the DL network is less premium focused than AA? Come on, just look the 16 seat premium cabins DL runs on JFK-LAX (that still go out full of non-revs). AA's network is centered around DFW/LAX/MIA/ORD/NYC with much if the international capacity delegated to EZE, GRU, HKG, LHR, and NRT all of which have significant paid F/J traffic. DL would kill to be in AA's position in regards to their position in the premium travel market. There's a reason AA is the only carrier offering 3-cabin service on transcons. What is DLs answer to Flagship Check-in? What is DLs answer to Concierge Keys? What is DLs answer to the Flagship Lounge?

Tell me this. Why are the new Amex Centurion lounges located adjacent to AA gate areas? Don't you think all the customer data Amex has collected from 2007-2014 when they allowed Admirals Club access shows Platinum/Centurion cardmembers largely fly AA? I mean seriously. We get you are emotionally attached to DL but the reality doesn't match your perception. I get my DL status from Amex (like many people), on AA people earn status the hard way they don't give it away like candy like over at DL.

Josh

You can tell yourself all day long how much more business-focused AA's network is but if they don't get more revenue, then it matters little.

The reason why AA's network doesn't deliver the revenue that reflects the business nature of the market is because AA's major business markets are far more competitive and AA has far less pricing power.
In both NYC and CHI, AA is one of several carriers. While AA is the largest of the two airlines at UA on the DOMESTIC system, it is smaller than UA in the LOCAL international market - and AA's underperformance on many of its int'l routes from ORD is no surprise. IN NYC, AA is number 3 behind DL and UA in the domestic market and behnd UA and DL in the international market.

AA's pricing dominance comes at DFW and MIA, but in BOTH hubs AA is facing more and more competition than any other carrier is seeing in their largest markets.

So, yes, AA is in bigger business markets but they do not get near the revenue premium as DL does.

 

[topDawg]

AA's business class footprint is much larger than DL's.

really? I don't understand how that is cause I believe the seats are about the same size. 
 

UNfortunately for Delta, their dated BusinessElite 777 seat awkwardly angles out towards the aisle rather than away from it, causing less privacy, comfort, and an inferior premium experience.

it isn't a terrible seat. I like it over the 767 seat. It is however getting a bit old and I have been hopeful that it gets replaced with the same seat on the 330. 
 
But it sounds like the 777 will get the new seats coming on from the RFP order. Just a rumor though. 
 

And that's what they will be using JFK-TLV-my money is going to AC 787 or LX/LY.

Josh

FWIW i am going to bet that it is one of the first routes that goes 242t A333. 
 
So i hope you come back when the 333 gets on it. 

 

[MAH4546]

Tell me this. Why are the new Amex Centurion lounges located adjacent to AA gate areas? Don't you think all the customer data Amex has collected from 2007-2014 when they allowed Admirals Club access shows Platinum/Centurion cardmembers largely fly AA? 

 
It is definitely no coincidence, and I bet it has to do partly with AA ending the deal with AmEx. Even at LAS, the lounge is at the AA gates. 

 

[CLTRob]

Just heard today that AA is going to be sending 4 777's for retrofit at a time starting sometime this year. In April, they will start the higher density version. Also, they stated that the Board is going to hear a proposal to retrofit 25 757's with lie flat seats in Business and international wifi. No word on if they will have nose to tail AVOD and in seat entertainment in coach. We can hope. These will be used in Europe and Latin America. Maybe they will add wifi to the AA E175's. Along with some F/C food!

Does anyone know where I can find a seat-map of the "high density" version of the 777's?

 

[WorldTraveler]

It is definitely no coincidence, and I bet it has to do partly with AA ending the deal with AmEx. Even at LAS, the lounge is at the AA gates.

so are you saying that Amex was sleeping with the enemy?

 

[eolesen]

so are you saying that Amex was sleeping with the enemy?

Maybe they just pulled a DL -- partnered with someone in good faith, and then decided to poach customers based on the customer data they built up during the partnership.

 

[737823]

Maybe they just pulled a DL -- partnered with someone in good faith, and then decided to poach customers based on the customer data they built up during the partnership.

Good one!

Josh

 

[WorldTraveler]

Maybe they just pulled a DL -- partnered with someone in good faith, and then decided to poach customers based on the customer data they built up during the partnership.

we'll see who gets hurt worse... Amex is one of the best run companies in the world. I doubt it will be them.

 

[jcw]

How again is AA hurting by Amex setting up clubs near AA gates - I would think AA would like high spenders with Amex flying their airline- if the amex card member never bought an admirals club membership before nothing lost

WT you logic is deft defying

Hail to DL

How are the meds holding up do you live in a state with legalized marijuana