2015 Fleet Service Discussion

[bob@las-AA]

Ok I will try this one more time.
This is a link to the exact contract language.
 
 
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7qadFaPIn_uUWgtZXNGQlhva1k/view?usp=sharing
 
MBPR=Max Base Pay Rate (AAL With longevity )
BPR   =Base Pay Rate (AAL With/Out longevity )
 
Plug-In any numbers that will make you feel good
 
(1 / 3 ( DL + UA + US ) - MBPR ) / BPR
 
And why is Southwest Excluded From the Industry Average?

 

[WeAAsles]

Ok I will try this one more time.
This is a link to the exact contract language.
 
 
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7qadFaPIn_uUWgtZXNGQlhva1k/view?usp=sharing

Thanks Bob. That's easier than perusing the contract down to get to the page. That is the example I looked at.

 

[WeAAsles]

Alright it looks like I was WRONG on my first equation. The rate for DL that I posted was for Tech Ops and not Fleet. I'm waiting for confirmation but it looks like I have to roll DL back to $24.81 rather than $25.28? So basically we're subtracting 50 cents from my original totals.

 

[WeAAsles]

And why is Southwest Excluded From the Industry Average?

Because they didn't want their rates included in the averaging formula.

 

[bob@las-AA]

BTW if we are to add all the top rates and simply divide by 4 we get a figure of $24.47. That's ALL the top rates including longevity with both the AA and US 2.1% included which equals $97.89/4 = $24.47

Note the formula on page 24 Example: $24.64 $24.11 $22.48 which equals when divided by 3, $23.74. The formula does not include AA into the averaging rather it takes the $23.74 and subtracts from the rate quoted after our raise at the time to $22.82 (Base plus .30)

OK though as I look at it the divide was by 3 and not adding AA in the equation BUT they do have the longevity as a separate line item which changes my total just a little by incorporating it into the rates. At the time in the formula they averaged longevity to be .13. UAL has a max of .75 and AA a max of .30 which makes that average 52.5 cents.

  http://twu.org/Portals/0/AirContracts/aa_FleetServiceAgreement.pdf

Using the example in the Red Book 
AA is left out ....or not included in the "divide by" to get a average, to get a increase we want to know the average of everyone else.
Including AA would lower the average.
 
Average With AA =$ 23.51
Average W/O AA =$ 23.74
 
Any Questions?
 
But until we know exactly what the other airlines have, this is just an exercise!

 

[bob@las-AA]

Because they didn't want their rates included in the averaging formula.

Thats not an answer. Do we know what the get paid?

 

[WeAAsles]

Using the example in the Red Book 
AA is left out ....or not included in the "divide by" to get a average, to get a increase we want to know the average of everyone else.
Including AA would lower the average.
 
Average With AA =$ 23.51
Average W/O AA =$ 23.74
 
Any Questions?
 
But until we know exactly what the other airlines have, this is just an exercise!

This was a formula I did with the help of a few friends months ago who didn't argue about it at the time.
 
AA - $23.78 (not added) UA - $25.35 US - $23.48 DL - $24.81
$73.64/3 = $24.54
$24.54 - $23.78 = 0.76
0.76/$23.48 = 3.1%

 

[WeAAsles]

Thats not an answer. Do we know what the get paid?

Page 58 down. And that is a good answer because all of our respective companies want to only utilize the SWA conversation when it's something that bolsters their arguments.

http://www.twu.org/Portals/0/AirContracts/sw_RampCBA.pdf

 

[bob@las-AA]

This was a formula I did with the help of a few friends months ago who didn't argue about it at the time.
 
AA - $23.78 (not added) UA - $25.35 US - $23.48 DL - $24.81
$73.64/3 = $24.54
$24.54 - $23.78 = 0.76
0.76/$23.48 = 3.1%

If they Include WN in the avg.
You could see a base wage of $24.60
W/Out $24.25
 
If I had understood WN CBA.

 

[WeAAsles]

If they Include WN in the avg.
You could see a base wage of $24.60
W/Out $24.25
 
If I had understood WN CBA.

You see this is why I wanted to discuss the topic. I got people out there saying $1.05 or $24.05. You're saying $24.25 and I'm getting $24.54?

I'm rolling back the $25.31 because I believe that was my mistake not catching on it was a different title group.

They're not including WN in the equation. That's written in the contract.

 

[bob@las-AA]

 

To add more fuel to the bonfire, Lets reflect on what we already got as a function of bankruptcy.
To date the base rate wages have increased % 10.964 from $21.16 to $23.48
Add the % 5.5 company match (401K as an agreement to the merger ) 
And the % 4.0 at the finish line.
Thats % 14.964
If anything else comes our way I will be VERY surprised.  

 

[WeAAsles]

To add more fuel to the bonfire, Lets reflect on what we already got as a function of bankruptcy.
To date the base rate wages have increased % 10.964 from $21.16 to $23.48
Add the % 5.5 company match (401K as an agreement to the merger ) 
And the % 4.0 at the finish line.
Thats % 14.964
If anything else comes our way I will be VERY surprised.

You shouldn't be surprised since the BASE at both DL and UAL are higher than we are right now. I'm just talking BASE of course and not concentrating at the moment at the middle of the pie.

UAL goes to $25.22 next January not counting longevity. Yes I know they're getting stations chopped and pay cuts though so I do think about that. And I think they're also getting killed on their medical and lots of downgrading.

Our negotiators MAY have their work cut out for them? We'll have to see what managements behavior or mood is going to be?

 

[saywhat]

This was a formula I did with the help of a few friends months ago who didn't argue about it at the time.
 
AA - $23.78 (not added) UA - $25.35 US - $23.48 DL - $24.81
$73.64/3 = $24.54
$24.54 - $23.78 = 0.76
0.76/$23.48 = 3.1%

US is at $23 not $23.48. The language states 2.1% or the average of US. DL and UA. Your number would be closer to $24.07 plus $.30 longevity for $24.37 at AA.

 

[WeAAsles]

US is at $23 not $23.48. The language states 2.1% or the average of US. DL and UA. Your number would be closer to $24.07 plus $.30 longevity for $24.37 at AA.

You have to look at how the example formula is shown on the TWU contract that I linked to.

 

[bob@las-AA]

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