2014 Fleet Service Discussion

[WeAAsles]

Listen to the LAX town hall meeting....Parker himself said that the AA folks would be a little diappointed about recall and that DOH seniority would come later as the unions work with each other. Pay seniority will stand when they come back. He concluded it was a done deal already worked out with the unions.

I only heard about the part where he said he didn't know how much the AA guys would like it? From what I know if nothing has changed it's completely understandable and people can rant and rave about it as much as they want but it doesn't violate anyone's contract and that is what has to be. And that goes for people on both sides.

 

[DFWFSC]

I've seen that. You ain't kidding. Joe was always cool by me. Don't know if it was because he knew I was pro union or if it was the fact that I never complained no matter where he sent me. But he took good care of me most of the time. Hope he has a good retirement. Gus Bell was a guy I had ZERO use for.

You want to know someone who really surprised me? Graham Clarke. The guy had the absolute worst reputation on the ramp. Then I bid with him once because he took a gate I liked. I was geared up for the worst and the guy wound up being one of the best CC's I ever had. I even had to tell him after awhile that I had no clue why he had such a bad rep?????? To this day I'll never understand it? After that bid he had shifts I didn't really care for but I absolutely would have worked with him again. Really good guy IMO.
 

I saw Graham yesterday on OT, I've never had a problem with him.  Some of the low seniority CCs on nights are pretty bad and lazy....POWs Peek Out the Window.

 

[WeAAsles]

I saw Graham yesterday on OT, I've never had a problem with him.  Some of the low seniority CCs on nights are pretty bad and lazy....POWs Peek Out the Window.

Hey great talking to you about this stuff. Don't want to hijack too much of the threat there. Even though it is FSC discussion I think people may want to talk about things other than my popcorn story?

 

[Kev3188]

F that. Talk about what you like. We all have a Graham Clarke in our (work) lives...

P.S. At NW, POW's were called "window chiefs." Not many worse things one could be called...

 

[WeAAsles]

F that. Talk about what you like. We all have a Graham Clarke in our (work) lives...

P.S. At NW, POW's were called "window chiefs." Not many worse things one could be called...

I'll tell you Kev. Out of all the threads you and I have contributed to this one has to be the most civilized and have the most informed members of the bunch. It's refreshing and appreciated.

 

[T5towbar]

Was it Rich Delaney who gave it up or was it your NC? And ultimately if the members ratified it was them who gave it up actually. (COLA right?)

If it was exchanged for retro though I can understand that. As much as I might not like it retro will help pass the TA and it's given to all rather than a select few in high cost areas. But I have always been and always will be an advocate of COLA's and that was even when I was living in DFW. I'm a NYer by birth first and always.

Can't stand signing bonus's BTW. Sure we all want and need money but I can't stand the carrot on the stick that sways members for a few sheckles. It taints our TA and is dirty pool, IMO.

We on the sCO side thought it made sense to keep it. Just add ORD and it would have worked. It was something that the company offered after the 2004-05 cuts.
Just like some of us thought we was going to go with the 2009 Agreement as a baseline. Just add IAH and everything would have been fine.
 
The "Red Circling" was part of the "harmonization"....... just like our Cargo. 
 
People took the money, and the two largest hubs sealed the deal.

 

[WeAAsles]

We on the sCO side thought it made sense to keep it. Just add ORD and it would have worked. It was something that the company offered after the 2004-05 cuts.
Just like some of us thought we was going to go with the 2009 Agreement as a baseline. Just add IAH and everything would have been fine.
 
The "Red Circling" was part of the "harmonization"....... just like our Cargo. 
 
People took the money, and the two largest hubs sealed the deal.

I'll tell you personally now since the voting is done I think your current contract is a good one and if I had been voting on it from where you guys were I would have passed it. But certainly not because of the $1500.00 signing bonus. Anyone who voted yes because of that is an idiot (Sorry) You do the math on a 3 year deal and it comes out to only .25 cents per hour before taxes for a full timer. And as a one time payment it's taxed at a higher rate also. Not getting retro I'll admit would have upset me but taken as a whole I would have been doing some shoulder shrugging as I hit that YES check anyway.

Leaders have to negotiate for what their members want but at the same time IMO they have to explain to those members why certain things are important and get that through to them. Otherwise why even bother to have and vote for leaders in the first place?

We'll have a lot of things to talk about on here when those Joint talks start to roll. Our leaders read the things we write here and if we keep it civilized we can have some good conversations and maybe pass along some positive input. We'll work together. 

 

[WeAAsles]

United Airlines Adopts the Walmart Welfare Model

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CJ_fI4OaSQ&feature=youtu.be

 

[Jester]

I saw Graham yesterday on OT, I've never had a problem with him.  Some of the low seniority CCs on nights are pretty bad and lazy....POWs Peek Out the Window.

 
I am not sure as to the US title of "CC" (Crew Chief?), but as we have "leads" who are assigned with a single team (assists) to actually work the flights, so hanging behind a window would be pretty much impossible.  However, we have more than enough supervisors who would serve the Company better if they just stayed in an office, and come out when we have a problem.  Instead we in PHX get micro-managers to walk around looking for excuses to write-up people for any minor infraction real or imagined.

 

[DFWFSC]

I am not sure as to the US title of "CC" (Crew Chief?), but as we have "leads" who are assigned with a single team (assists) to actually work the flights, so hanging behind a window would be pretty much impossible.  However, we have more than enough supervisors who would serve the Company better if they just stayed in an office, and come out when we have a problem.  Instead we in PHX get micro-managers to walk around looking for excuses to write-up people for any minor infraction real or imagined.

At DFW each gate has 1 Crew Chief--2 belly guys--2 transfer bag drivers and 1 local bag driver. Plus, there is a 1030am-1900pm person assigned to each gate and will help where needed. Most gates are up to 6 or 7 turns in a 8hr shift with very high loads. The widebody gates are high seniority as they usually do 2 or 3 turns or less. There is also LTS-Line Transfer Support where they send out drivers to help run bags when the two gate guys cant handle a large volume off a trip. So, sometimes we have as many as 8 or 9 guys working a flight, but most are around 45min turns these days and heavy.

 

[ograc]

At DFW each gate has 1 Crew Chief--2 belly guys--2 transfer bag drivers and 1 local bag driver. Plus, there is a 1030am-1900pm person assigned to each gate and will help where needed. Most gates are up to 6 or 7 turns in a 8hr shift with very high loads. The widebody gates are high seniority as they usually do 2 or 3 turns or less. There is also LTS-Line Transfer Support where they send out drivers to help run bags when the two gate guys cant handle a large volume off a trip. So, sometimes we have as many as 8 or 9 guys working a flight, but most are around 45min turns these days and heavy.

There seems to be quite a difference in manpower assigned to flights between sUS and sAA. 6 man teams with an extra at each gate and additional drivers assigned to flights with large volumes of bags. Much less manpower assigned per flight at sUS stations. 

 

[WeAAsles]

There seems to be quite a difference in manpower assigned to flights between sUS and sAA. 6 man teams with an extra at each gate and additional drivers assigned to flights with large volumes of bags. Much less manpower assigned per flight at sUS stations. 

Cargo that depends on the stations and the individual needs of each of them. DFW for instance has lots of connections and the size of the airport also makes it very likely that transfer drivers cannot make it back in time to assist on the outbound. In small stations they usually only assign 3 to a flight. Here in MIA I am part of a 5 man crew. Transfer drivers are usually sent out to run the connections unless the flight is light and everything is possibly in one belly.

I would have to guess that it's similar in CLT or PHX also? 3 people couldn't possibly perform all the work.

 

[ograc]

As we move toward JCBA talks I thought it would be beneficial to do some in depth comparisons of specific Articles of each CBA. Let's start with job protection and scope. What work is ours at US and AA? How many stations are represented at AA and US? Let's review, compare and have some meaningful discussion on this issue. Afterwards we can move on to other Articles such as vacation, sick time accrual and policies, pension / 401K and so on. The floor is open  to factual information.

 

[WeAAsles]

As we move toward JCBA talks I thought it would be beneficial to do some in depth comparisons of specific Articles of each CBA. Let's start with job protection and scope. What work is ours at US and AA? How many stations are represented at AA and US? Let's review, compare and have some meaningful discussion on this issue. Afterwards we can move on to other Articles such as vacation, sick time accrual and policies, pension / 401K and so on. The floor is open  to factual information.

The first way for people to become involved and aware in this conversation is to read, understand and ask questions about each others particular contracts. Knowledge is empowerment.

http://twu.org/Portals/0/AirContracts/aa_FleetServiceAgreement.pdf

http://www.iam141.org/docs/IAM-FS_2008_Contract_Final_to_Print_102808.pdf

http://www.iam141.org/us/docs/USAirwaystermsheet063014.pdf

Have fun reading people.

 

[cltrat]

At DFW each gate has 1 Crew Chief--2 belly guys--2 transfer bag drivers and 1 local bag driver. Plus, there is a 1030am-1900pm person assigned to each gate and will help where needed. Most gates are up to 6 or 7 turns in a 8hr shift with very high loads. The widebody gates are high seniority as they usually do 2 or 3 turns or less. There is also LTS-Line Transfer Support where they send out drivers to help run bags when the two gate guys cant handle a large volume off a trip. So, sometimes we have as many as 8 or 9 guys working a flight, but most are around 45min turns these days and heavy.

on the wide bodies are the team building the cans or are they coming from the bagroom?