Whats He Asking For?

[Bob Owens]

http://www.twu562.org/10-08/100708.pdf

Must be election time.

Why write a letter to the members telling the members what they already know? Why does he address a letter to us by saying "they" when referring to us? Shouldnt this be addressed to Little and other International officials?

I dont want more leadership from the International, and it troubles me to hear my representative calling for them to show more leadership. Look at where their leadership abilities have led us, do we really want more of the same?

I want them-the International, to step aside, remove themselves from "the process" and let our elected representatives lead us to "restore and more".

4000 maintenance jobs eliminated, hundreds of millions in additional revenue from contract work and 5 years of draconian concessions, enough is enough, we want it back. If our leaders cant see by now that the International has no intentions on getting us everything back, which they promised they would do by 2006, then they never will.

 

[TWU informer]

Maybe he should be further educated.

The call for direct election of international officers by ballot has been rejected in conventions since 1985, to include 1985, 1989, 1993, 1997, 2001, and 2005. The votes at conventions are munipulated with either promises of lifetime appointments to international positions, or flat out flagarant violations of roberts rules of order by using a quick rules of convention vote on the first day of the convention when delegates are unsuspecting of the rule intention to conquer calls for change. Have the local pay for a copy of the convention minutes/proceedings of all the past conventions, give this poor guy a copy and have him re-write his letter after he has read them all.

Surely this fool doesn't believe he can develope a plan that will outwit 20+ years of manipulated convention experience.

The TWU International will never change, and as long as fools roam the earth in charge of locals we may never see the day when everyone finally realizes their union sucks and needs to be replaced and that is the only answer to stop the madness. Why does some guy arise from the depths of brainwashed manipulation on regular basis and never listen to those that have the facts and have already previously emerged from the smoke and clouds of the dictators cloak? Like a dog chasing it's own tail, the process continues year to year, day to day, and we all remain stuck in the circle of worthless representation and contributors of the destruction of the profession.

 

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

OUTSTANDING


clap clap clap clap

 

[Bob Owens]

Maybe he should be further educated.
The votes at conventions are munipulated with either promises of lifetime appointments to international positions, or flat out flagarant violations of roberts rules of order by using a quick rules of convention vote on the first day of the convention when delegates are unsuspecting of the rule intention to conquer calls for change.

I was at the 2001 Convention and I recall Sonny calling for a vote by saying "All for say Aye! Followed by "Ayes" from the floor, then he said "All against say Aye!" Once again followed by "Ayes" from the floor, to which Sonny replied "The Ayes have it!"
When a large percentage of the convention yelled out in protest as to which "Ayes " have it Sonny said "Well, if you get up here, then you can decide, the day you get here".
Unbelievable!! What arrogance! What disregard for Democracy!!
And yes that was the first day of the Convention in response to a motion made to insure that the votes were accurate and not just the chair determining which group was the loudest.


As far as the letter I'm still unsure of what the message was. My suspicion is that he didnt even write the letter-my guess is Pete Corabi VP562 did. Basically,to me, it sounds like the letter is calling for the International to take charge "A growing number of our membership are angered with the International and its lack of leadership during the negotiations process,,,". What else could be meant by that? Like I said, I dont want the International to lead us, I want our Local officials, the people who we can vote for, the people who will be affected by the final outcome, to be given more control. I want the committees to be given the ability to lead. I want the International to remove themselves from the process. Let the committees choose their own chairmen and get those unelected, unaccountable appointed crooks out of there!

 

[Pete Corabi VP562]

http://www.twu562.org/10-08/100708.pdf

Must be election time.

Why write a letter to the members telling the members what they already know? Why does he address a letter to us by saying "they" when referring to us? Shouldnt this be addressed to Little and other International officials?

I dont want more leadership from the International, and it troubles me to hear my representative calling for them to show more leadership. Look at where their leadership abilities have led us, do we really want more of the same?

I want them-the International, to step aside, remove themselves from "the process" and let our elected representatives lead us to "restore and more".

4000 maintenance jobs eliminated, hundreds of millions in additional revenue from contract work and 5 years of draconian concessions, enough is enough, we want it back. If our leaders cant see by now that the International has no intentions on getting us everything back, which they promised they would do by 2006, then they never will.

Dear Bob;

Yes, it is election time. For me, for John Iuliano, and since you are running for President of Local 562, for you too. Bob, if you have questions about the intent of John Iuliano's letter, as a member of Local 562 you should ask him. Then fell free to post his response to you, so long as it is accurate. Offering suppositions about the meaning of his letter is misleading and simply put is not the truth. Also, please refrain from guessing who authored the letter, unless you have proof otherwise. I did not author it.
John Iuliano is doing the job he was elected to carry out. He has informed the membership of the state of negotiations and the structure of the International. As a former Treasurer of Local 562, you have first hand knowledge of the structure of the International, knowledge that some members may not have. Whether we agree or disagree on the structure of the International or the procedures of the convention are a discussion for another topic. Iuliano is informing the membership on how the International is structured, how those in charge get their positions, and why things are the way they are today. If you were to step back and listen to what is going on in negotiations, you would see that the current negotiationg committee and Iuliano agree that changes need to be made. But changes are only good if they are positive, and they can only be achieved through hard work, dilligence and unity. Rhetoric and mis-information will achieve nothing.
This negotiationg committe, unlike the one in 2003 has done something that should be recognized. By staying focused and unified, they turned back the International and the Company on a concessionary proposal. Give credit where it is due. In the future I will contuinue to post in order to promote differing viewpoints and a meaningfull exchange of ideas. Bob, you and I want the same thing. It is the path we choose to take that makes us all differenent.


Pete Corabi
VP Local 562

 

[Bob Owens]

Dear Bob;

Yes, it is election time. For me, for John Iuliano, and since you are running for President of Local 562, for you too. Bob, if you have questions about the intent of John Iuliano's letter, as a member of Local 562 you should ask him. Then fell free to post his response to you, so long as it is accurate.

Well he has the opportunity to answer right here and I dont think its up to you to tell anyone what they are free to post here, you're not part of the International, yet.

John Iuliano is doing the job he was elected to carry out. He has informed the membership of the state of negotiations and the structure of the International.

He has? I must have missed that. I see his somewhat incomplete description of the Convention but not much else. As far as negotiations few would agree that he has given us much info, in fact he wouldnt even tell us how he voted as far as releasing info.

As a former Treasurer of Local 562, you have first hand knowledge of the structure of the International, knowledge that some members may not have.

Well I've done my best to get the info out as a big chunk of the thousands of posts I've made here attest. In fact thats why I was removed by the International. Others have chosen to remain quiet, jump into vacancies created by the International and collect their pay.

This negotiationg committee, unlike the one in 2003 has done something that should be recognized. By staying focused and unified, they turned back the International and the Company on a concessionary proposal. Give credit where it is due.

Fair enough, sort of, but why was that concessionary proposal ever even presented to the company? Do we really want the International to demonstrate more such leadership? Or, if John wants them to step out of the way why doesnt he say so? Sometimes its good for a leader to be direct. You may say ask John, well I am as I'm sure you will let him know about this thread and he can even use his dues paid for laptop to answer. I wont bother to call because I'd rather have my answers in writing, thats the union way, besides others may have the same questions.

In the future I will contuinue to post in order to promote differing viewpoints and a meaningfull exchange of ideas. Bob, you and I want the same thing. It is the path we choose to take that makes us all differenent.
Pete Corabi
VP Local 562

I know what I want, what you want I'm not so sure. I want accountability, accessibility and transparency from my Local as well as the International union. I want recall, I want direct elections or an accountable voting system put in place for Conventions as well as Local E-board meetings. I want to know how those who vote in my name vote. I want open negotiations where the members are allowed to witness negotiations. I believe that these things are whats needed to change the TWU into a real union instead of simply a dues collection agency that employs cast out Local officials with phony college degrees. Are you for all those things Peter?

 

[Pete Corabi VP562]

Bob;

You certainly can post what you want. You must be afraid of asking John his opinion and posting his answer. Just as a suicide bomber can only spred misery and destruction, martyring yourself for a cause will change nothing. As an elected union officer I feel that if I do my job to protect the membership and stay focused on the membership that I was elected to serve, the changes that YOU seek may come about in a positive manner. You want many things, but wanting things to happen is one thing. Making it so requires hard work and dedication, without being side tracked by personal agendas that are not positive for the membership you were elected to serve.
I do not agree with many aspects of our Union. I do not like how negotiations were handled, and you are correct on your observations on the convention. But wonton destruction is not the answer. It will take hard work, and perserverance by the elected officers of each local to change things for the better. That will take skill, unity and positive dialogue. Not everyone will agree with all things at all times. In all fairness, when members of this local needed license protection, ASAP help or Kasher interpretation, the International reps that were assigned to me answered their calls and did their jobs well, for the benefit of our members.
I want those things that you want too. And I will try to get them done for the benefit of the members that I serve, I will not leave those members for my own personal agenda. If you thought that the members of Local 562 were better off with your leadership, then you should not have put your agenda before your Office. You might still have it.

Pete

 

[Observer]

Finally some sanity on this board. Pete, I could not agree more with your point of view. Too many take the time to criticize and keep beating the same drum. One having an agenda is admirable, one having an agenda that is put in front of our collective good is quite another.

 

[TWU informer]

Pete,

Until you have beat your head against the TWU wall without change, and until you have been removed from elected office by the dictatorship of the TWU, then you can claim to want, hope, and fight for the membership all you want. But you haven't experienced the truth of the TWU yet.

I too was like yourself in my younger days. I even admire your beliefs to this day that the union should be controlled by the membership and good officers should be allowed to shine through.

But my experience with the TWU indicates Bob is far more correct than you know.

Have you taken the time to read the Constitutional Convention Minutes as suggested in my earlier post? Or do have any other truthful and honest facts regarding previuos attempts to make this union democratic and a membership controlled union?

It appears to me that your position against Bob is an emotional defense of a friend of yours and really has nothing to do with facts regarding the inability of the membership to control or change the TWU.

 

[TWU informer]

Finally some sanity on this board. Pete, I could not agree more with your point of view. Too many take the time to criticize and keep beating the same drum. One having an agenda is admirable, one having an agenda that is put in front of our collective good is quite another.

I take it that you believe that an agenda to rid ourselves of the most docile, company lapdog, anti-democratic union in the industry is an agenda that is not for our collective good? I disagree 100% if that is the point of your post.

The folks that refuse to see the facts due to either emotional defense of friends or because they currently receive a paycheck from the TWU thus admitting things are wrong is likely impossible are not looking at the facts or debating the facts regarding the TWU.

 

[Pete Corabi VP562]

Pete,

Until you have beat your head against the TWU wall without change, and until you have been removed from elected office by the dictatorship of the TWU, then you can claim to want, hope, and fight for the membership all you want. But you haven't experienced the truth of the TWU yet.

I too was like yourself in my younger days. I even admire your beliefs to this day that the union should be controlled by the membership and good officers should be allowed to shine through.

But my experience with the TWU indicates Bob is far more correct than you know.

Have you taken the time to read the Constitutional Convention Minutes as suggested in my earlier post? Or do have any other truthful and honest facts regarding previuos attempts to make this union democratic and a membership controlled union?

It appears to me that your position against Bob is an emotional defense of a friend of yours and really has nothing to do with facts regarding the inability of the membership to control or change the TWU.

Informer;

I have been beating the drums for quite some time. 22 years at AA, and nine years in elected office, and I have watched the industry take a dive. But as easy as it is for some to scapegoat the International or others for their problems, Im afraid that the solutions are not that easy. I will not blame anyone for my choice of career, my lot in life, or the demise of organized labor. But I will do my part to make a better life, and better work environment for myself and my membership for as long as I am in elected office. Blaming others never fixed anything, although it may get an audience.
As for my position aginst Bob Owens, it is not emotional, it is philosophical. I want my wages and benefits restored just as much as anyone here. I just disagree with him in some, but not all ways on how to accomplish that goal. I do like the way Iuliano handles the job. I think that is is more effective than the way Bob would handle it. It has nothing to do with being freinds or not being freinds. Its just a different viewpoint.

Pete

 

[Bob Owens]

Bob;

You certainly can post what you want. You must be afraid of asking John his opinion and posting his answer. Just as a suicide bomber can only spred misery and destruction, martyring yourself for a cause will change nothing.

Afraid? Are you saying that I fear John will make me a martyr? Hardly. This is a public forum where all can see what he has to say, or he could have another letter clarifying what he meant by the letter on the website.

As an elected union officer I feel that if I do my job to protect the membership and stay focused on the membership that I was elected to serve, the changes that YOU seek may come about in a positive manner.

Protect your members from what? Information? In the five years that we have been out of office what have you done to bring about any positive changes?

You want many things, but wanting things to happen is one thing. Making it so requires hard work and dedication, without being side tracked by personal agendas that are not positive for the membership you were elected to serve.

I agree, you should try following your own advice.I've worked hard towards many of those things and I'm still working to meet those goals. In fact I do so without putting in for UB. Even when I was in office I met with leaders of other Locals on my own time who also wanted these things, if I recall I didnt see you at any of those meetings.

I do not agree with many aspects of our Union. I do not like how negotiations were handled, and you are correct on your observations on the convention. But wonton destruction is not the answer.

Wow, now you sound just like Sonny Hall! Calling for democratic reform is wonton destruction?

It will take hard work, and perserverance by the elected officers of each local to change things for the better. That will take skill, unity and positive dialogue. Not everyone will agree with all things at all times. In all fairness, when members of this local needed license protection, ASAP help or Kasher interpretation, the International reps that were assigned to me answered their calls and did their jobs well, for the benefit of our members.

So you say. And what have they done for the other 90%? Other than massive pay and benifit cuts what has the International done for them? They take a third of the dues and they handle a few ASAP reports, big deal! I havent filed an ASAP in years so where did my, and the other 90% who havent filed an ASAP report, money go?

The fact is we need democratic reform at every level in the union, but first we must clean up the Local first. How can you ask for recall at the International level when you dont have it at the Local level? How can you ask for transparency from the Internatioanl when individuals on E-boards say that everything that comes out of an E-borad meeting was unanimous when it wasnt?

I want those things that you want too.

Oh really? You want the members to know how their representatives vote? Do you believe that we the members have the right to know how each individual on the board votes? Dont forget that I served on the same board as you and I know first hand about how you feel about the individual accountability of borad members.

You want the members to have accountability? You want recall?

If you thought that the members of Local 562 were better off with your leadership, then you should not have put your agenda before your Office. You might still have it.

Well in less than two months there's a good chance I'll be saying that you.

My agenda was, is and always will be getting us the contract we deserve. The members didnt remove me, the International did, I was doing what they elected me to do and when I get back in I will pick up where I left off.

 

[WeAAsles]

Mr Corabi:

Your defense of your local is admirable, but being someone who's on the ramp and in the thick of most conversations it just seems like theres no faith in our International. Being as how the TWU is by far the largest union on the AA premises why don't we hear more from our Intl reps? I really do believe that our local reps are doing the best they can for all of us in there negotiations with the company. Look we all know what the economy looks like right now and it's pretty bleak but there was a promise made by Jim Little to restore our pay and even though we know AA is not going to do that, wheres the indignation from the Int'l? Wheres there anger? Wheres there fight?

Sure the TWU, APA, and APFA said they were going to combine there efforts on October 1st, but what's the plan? When do we start hearing something? Local 513 has been proactive as of late and I'm very happy about that but I just think most of us would like to hear from our Int'l reps more often? At least maybe for some reassurance and solidarity that they are fighting for us?

We all know that the Int'l reads this website but they never respond to all the accusations against them? Why? Even Barrack Obama has responded against the Bill Ayers and other scandalous accusations. There silence on all the accusations brought forth on this website alone just speaks volumes.

I love being in a union and everything that that means and stands for, I just want to hold my head up high like I did when my Grandfather used to tell me stories about The Teamsters and how they were when he was a trucker and they represented him in the 50's. I've never thought that was too much to ask?

In Solidarity and Brotherhood to you.

 

[Pete Corabi VP562]

Thanks WeAAsles;

I could not agree with you more that the current negotiations process has been frustratingly inefffective, at the very least. As I had stated in past posts, I disagree with the way that negotiations have been handled. But I am also aware of the economic constraints that we face. Jim Little put himself out there when he made a promise that could not be kept, but as long as the negotiation process is still active, I hold out hope. I know that my local President will be doing the right thing. I hope that all others follow suit.
As to why the International reps dont answer the accusations leveled against them, you will have to ask them. Some of the accusations against them are true, but not all of them.
It will be difficult to restore the power that Unions once held in the country. When we vote, how many of us look to see what a candidates stance is on labor? How many people in this country that are not in unions actually care?

In Solidarity;

Pete

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Pete,


You write that some make a scapegoat of the Intl. But makeing someone else a scapegoat is placing blame where it doesn't belong. If the Intl. owns our contract and accepts a contract without membership voting on said contract isn't this a problem? If the Intl. says that they are democratic but yet appoints people into the Intl. without a membership vote isn't this a problem? Removing elected officials from office for doing what their respective membership wanted isn't a problem to you?

I see no scapegoats here. I see facts. I do not see personal agendas here either. Well maybe one. The agenda I see was the Itnl. removing two democratically elected officers because they were perceived as a threat. The mebership is becoming better informed and more aware of the shortcomings of the actions of the TWU Intl. Perhaps change is in the air. After all, the membership controls the union, not the other way around.