US Pilots Labor Thread 1/28 to 2/3

[UtterlyUdder]

Aren't you the person with the fake Aussie posting style?

Where did the "ah shucks", Double Bar B Ranch style come from?

I think you may have me confused with someone else. "Bet the ranch" is an expression that knows no particular region of the country. While we have no ranches where I live, we do have farms but I didn't want to go down that road. Too many farm animal jokes lay in wait. :blink:

 

[UtterlyUdder]

Guessin' you'll be handin' over them keys, partner.

Ok alright, I will bet my farm. How's that do ya?

 

[BoeingBoy]

You may separate me out from any others

Your posts put you in the group...or as we say down here, if the shoe fits....

It could be that B Boy spends a hunk of time at the Lagoon with nothing to do but post here. I knew there was more to B Boy's story.

He hides his bitterness in appearing oh so calm and rational and reasonable.

It has finally dawned on me that you have either a very big ax that needs grinding very much or...........you own this USAir forum. Since I don't think your problem is the latter.......weeeedoggies! It must be the former.

Jim has sided with the West and was a big man in ALPA before he retired.

I take it you are a solid ALPA man who flew for UAAir .....perhaps residing in their ALPA "upper echelons" before you retired?
<snip>
You seem to have a bitter attitude towards USAPA and hence, the East pilots.

What happened? Was your ox gored? You seem so bitter.

Should I continue....

Jim

 

[Hawkhunter]

Your posts put you in the group...or as we say down here, if the shoe fits....








Should I continue....

Jim

I think UU has you pretty much figured out Jim.

 

[usabusdriver]

Six east airplanes (and more) was a daily occurence in PHX LONG before this merger was announced. USAirways didn't "discover" PHX and LAS just because of the merger.

NYC,

That would be rather hard to do since Airways only had three gates in Termnal 2. :unsure:

 

[fodase]

Fellow America West pilots,

On Tuesday and Wednesday of this week, I attended my first Board of Pilot Representatives (BPR) meeting in Charlotte as your representative. I encourage you to read the meeting highlights that are currently posted on the USAPA website. With a few exceptions, I can personally vouch for the accuracy of the update. I would like to thank the Officers and other Board members for their hospitality at the meeting.

I would like to begin this update by congratulating Captain Mark Burdick (P-967) for his appointment to the Negotiating Advisory Committee. Captain Burdick is now one of three members of the NAC. Captain Burdick was confirmed by a majority of the Board, including myself. For those of you who don’t know Captain Burdick, he previously served as a Negotiating Committee Chairman under ALPA, and was a principal negotiator of the Transition Agreement. I look forward to having Captain Burdick keep the West informed about the progress (or lack thereof) of negotiations, and to ensuring that important West provisions are not conceded. I would also like to thank Captain Doug Dotter for interviewing for the position.

Speaking of negotiations, it has been theorized that USAPA’s complete lack of progress in negotiations is directly attributable to the West being disenfranchised. After this week’s meeting, I can now wholeheartedly confirm that theory. In fact, one of the East pilots who interviewed for the vacant NAC position mentioned that exact problem during his interview, and even strongly suggested that USAPA immediately withdraw the RICO suit.

My primary mission this week was to offer the Board the opportunity to change that direction, by presenting two no-cost, good faith opportunities to reach out to the West (i.e. watch what they do, not what they say). Unfortunately, I do not feel as if all of the other Board members properly seized that opportunity, either out of concern for their own political best interests, or because of a blatant disregard for the West pilots, or both. While I can’t honestly say that I feel that way about all of the individual Board members, I do believe that it applies to the Board’s decisions as a whole. Often resolutions are the result of compromise positions, and not necessarily the verbatim sentiment of all who voted for it. A recap of the issues:


1. Withdrawal from the NC RICO lawsuit

This case has already been dismissed with prejudice by a Federal Judge. Although there is almost no chance of an appeal ever being successful, an appeal was filed by USAPA and that appeal is currently awaiting a decision from the court. It is the opinion of a variety of legal counsel that this appeal will likely fail. Therefore, I thought that by providing the Board to voluntarily withdraw the litigation in advance of that failure, that it might save our union from further embarrassment, and begin to drive our focus back on the company instead of each other.

Prior to my resolution hitting the floor, I was repeatedly encouraged to either withdraw or modify my resolution by Committee and/or other Board members. I listened to what they all said, but in the end I refused to consider their proposals. I was already suffering criticism from the West pilots for not demanding a public apology and restitution of attorney’s fees. I was told by several fellow Board members that the Board did want an exit strategy , but that it could not be done in the manner that I was proposing.

So, as maneuver to usurp my resolution, another domicile introduced a substitute resolution which is the one currently posted on the USAPA website. This resolution offers a settlement option instead of a good-faith withdrawal. This “settlement†offer, like previous “settlement†offers, requires the defendants to voluntarily admit to committing crimes that they did not commit, and to pay for damages that they did not cause. In fact, I completely object to use of the term “criminal activity†as it refers to these defendants. If the activity was criminal, why did USAPA not seek the assistance of law enforcement or the state government to press criminal charges? My guess is that this assistance was sought and denied.

I don’t believe that the defendants currently have any incentive to settle. Also, I believe that this settlement defeats the purpose of my resolution by requiring action on the part of the defendants instead of USAPA demonstrating a willingness to do the right thing for a change. Therefore, I voted against the substitute resolution. It is evident to me that the Board has clearly painted themselves in to a political corner with this ridiculous lawsuit, and none of them seem adult enough to do the right thing to correct it. If my refusal to support the “settlement†resolution seems unreasonable, I ask you to consider the following about that RICO suit:

• I believe that USAPA counsel has recommended terminating the case,

• Contrary to what’s in the USAPA update, there will likely not even be an oral argument – just another ruling in favor of the defendants,

• If the true purpose of the suit was to collect damages, the claims would have been filed in small claims court. The RICO case was created with the express purpose of maliciously burdening pilots with large legal bills (including one pilot who is now furloughed). It is very similar to the USA Today ad – a large publicity stunt that does not accomplish what it seeks to accomplish, and in the end only harms our credibility,

• USAPA has spent far more of your dues money on this suit than they could ever expect to collect in damages (if any).

Putting aside my advocacy of the West pilots for the moment, as a union member I would certainly want to know answers to the following questions:

• How much of our dues money has been spent on this litigation?

• How much of our dues money will be spent on this litigation if it continues to move forward?

• What sort of damages can USAPA realistically expect to recover from this litigation?

I have formally requested this information from the USAPA Officers, and will report to you my findings. How can we say that we’re a transparent union when this sort of information is not even being afforded the governing body? How can we blame management for making foolish business decisions when our own decisions seem to be extremely questionable? I’m no conspiracy theorist, but it sure seems as if there’s something rotten. Interestingly enough, I just read a USAPA Presidential campaign email written by an East pilot who seems to agree with my sentiment on this issue.


2. USAPA insurance reimbursement for furloughed pilots

The second resolution I introduced would provide the opportunity for pilots who were not in good standing at the time of furlough to resolve their accounts with USAPA and become eligible for the furlough medical insurance that we are currently all paying assessments for. Through my own fault, an incorrect version of the resolution was pasted into my update. The correct version is as follows:

BACKGROUND: After the NMB representational election of USAPA on April 17th 2008 the former America West pilots were emphatically opposed to our new legal collective bargaining agent. Emotions were running high and as a result many West pilots initially decided not to join or pay dues to our new Union. During the third quarter of 2008 management announced significant capacity reductions in our airline. Unfortunately, this resulted in furloughs from both the East and West pilot seniority lists. As a gesture of goodwill, USAPA membership approved financial assistance to all furloughed pilots in order to defray costly COBRA premiums. However, in order to receive this financial assistance, pilots were required to be members in good standing with USAPA prior to their furlough. As a consequence, most of the furloughed pilots and soon to be furloughed pilots from the West were not eligible for this assistance. Some of these pilots could greatly benefit by making the required dues payments in order to take advantage of this goodwill gesture.

RESOLUTION:

WHEREAS Phoenix now has a West based pilot domicile Chairman, and

WHEREAS the majority of the pilots furloughed from the West were not members in good standing at the time of their furlough, and

WHEREAS all furloughed pilots are facing enormous financial hardship due to circumstances beyond their control, and

WHEREAS a stated goal of USAPA is to foster unity amongst all members

THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that all furloughed and soon to be furloughed pilots (East and West) be afforded a one time opportunity to settle their accounts in order to become eligible for furlough assistance benefits, and

THEREFORE BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that the USAPA Secretary Treasurer work in coordination with the newly appointed Phoenix Domicile Chairman and the current Furlough Coordinator to give all West furloughed and soon to be furloughed pilots a final opportunity to take the required steps in order to have access to furlough assistance benefits.


I would have thought that this would be a no-brainer. It seemed to me that there was a consensus with the Board among the following principles:
• That we should do whatever is necessary to assist our furloughed pilots care for their families during this time of record unemployment
• That we should do whatever we can to encourage West membership in USAPA
• That this proposal would do nothing to increase the current assessment

Unfortunately, I learned some things about this issue that truly disturb me.

First, the assessment figure was based on what the Board believed the pilots would be willing to pay, not based on the number of potential furloughs. The furlough assessment was therefore only ever designed to be a token gesture to make USAPA look as if we cared about furloughed pilots. Therefore, many of the Board members were not willing to increase participation in the program.

Second, the Board intends to push this resolution to membership ratification (although that is not necessary), which I was told that it would be voted down because it primarily benefits West pilots. Of course it does – we had the most furloughs! I wonder if the Board members who made those statements really believe that the East USAPA members really that malicious, or was it a statement made to pressure me to withdraw the resolution? I will research the legality of this disturbing news.

The Board decided to table the resolution for the time being, which was primarily a politically-expedient maneuver in my opinion. It is my hope that those Board members who oppose this resolution take a moment to think of how it must feel to try and care for a family during this trying economic time.

Another important issue

One important topic discussed at the meeting was the definition of “member†as it applies to the number of elected representatives that each domicile is permitted. The USAPA Constitution provides for a number of elected representatives for each domicile based upon the number of “members†based at that domicile. The Board has decided that “member†as it is written in the Constitution actually means “member in good standingâ€. I’m not sure that I agree with that interpretation, as that essentially means that Domiciles with approximately 100 pilots can repeatedly lose or add a representative as a result of a single member falling from or returning to good standing. That interpretation provides a minority of pilots within some domiciles the ability to control the number of representatives they have, instead of having that be controlled primarily by the number of pilots based at that domicile. For example, if a Domicile with about 100 members (like LGA) has some members who dislike their Domicile Vice-Chairman, a few of them would just need to fall into bad standing, which would immediately cause the Vice-Chairman position to dissolve due to the “good standing†membership at that base falling below 100.

That interpretation also happens to negatively affect the PHX Domicile in this election. We have several hundred (but less than a thousand) USAPA members here in PHX, however there are only 60 or so who are currently in good standing. According to the USAPA Constitution, domiciles with less than 100 members can only elect 1 representative to the BPR. Interpreting use of the term “member†as it is written would mean that we would be provided 2 representatives in this election, which the Officers had originally intended to provide. However, because of this new interpretation, this upcoming election will only be for one representative position for PHX if by Feb 24th at 5pm Eastern time there are still less than 100 members in good standing. As soon as we have 100 or more members in good standing, an election will be triggered to fill the newly created position.

The majority of the PHX members are not in good standing due to a disagreement as to when membership actually became available to the West pilots. Only those who have paid USAPA dues in full plus a $100 reinstatement fee will be considered in good standing for this election.

It is important that we maximize our participation in this election. There are West nominees for several positions. Please become familiar with the election materials to ensure that you are able to properly exercise your vote.

SUMMARY

After spending a couple of days watching what they do not what they say, it’s fairly evident to me that the Board as a whole is fairly firm in continuing it’s current self-defeating direction by not even responding to the smallest needs of the West. I can’t say with confidence whether this will continue or not, but I imagine that at some point, the rank-and-file will become frustrated with the lack of overall progress of the union and demand change. It is important that I note that I don’t believe that all of the current Board members and Officers necessarily disagree with my sentiment.

Many of you might now be convinced that our participation in USAPA is an exercise in futility. While we may certainly continue to encounter hostile decisions by the majority, I don’t think that our presence has been futile. I believe there are many pilots back East who agree with my sentiment about the Board’s current direction as being largely self-defeating. Also, because of my federal right to use USAPA resources to communicate with you, the current leadership will no longer enjoy the benefit of being able to so tightly control the message.

Yet, apparently others see our participation in USAPA as a threat to certain self-righteous goals. In fact, one of the PHL representatives recently suggested to the Board that PHX/LAS be placed in trusteeship as a result of my first update. Apparently the salutation “Fellow America West pilots†was too much for some to handle. I was particularly surprised to hear a trusteeship threat from a PHL pilot who knows first hand how it feels to have his elected representative stripped of his authority. I can certainly understand the frustration that these pilots must have felt when their representatives, who were trying nothing more than to represent the interests of their pilots, were removed from their positions because their thoughts didn’t conform to those of the “national unionâ€. I believe the mention of “trusteeship†to be nothing more than a hollow threat.

It’s time for us to begin focusing on the things that we can control – i.e. our domicile affairs. One of the most important things that I plan to do at our first domicile meetings is establish and staff domicile committees. These committees will consist of America West pilots directly serving the needs of America West pilots. For the first time in 10 months, we will once again regain the control we once had over many of our own affairs. It’s important that I be fair in saying that at least some of those who did come from the East to handle our affairs over the past several months did exercise due diligence in ensuring that our issues were properly attended to. I do sincerely thank them for that.

So long as USAPA remains our bargaining agent, it behooves all of us to work within that structure to not only attend to our own issues, but also protect the collective interests of the entire group against a management that is clearly taking advantage of our current weakened state. However, I believe that this will only materialize when pilots perceive management as a greater threat to them than their own union. I have done what I can to help change that, but until such time the majority of the Board decides to take action (not words) to make that change, we can expect a lot more of the same.

Thank you for staying informed.

 

[BoeingBoy]

I think UU has you pretty much figured out Jim.

Several people claim they have me figured out, but they're only fooling themselves.

Jim

 

[Tiger 1050]

Fellow America West pilots,

On Tuesday and Wednesday of this week, I attended my first Board of Pilot Representatives (BPR) meeting in Charlotte as your representative. I encourage you to read the meeting highlights that are currently posted on the USAPA website. With a few exceptions, I can personally vouch for the accuracy of the update. I would like to thank the Officers and other Board members for their hospitality at the meeting...

Thank you for staying informed.

Wow! Absolutely disgusting! While I'll concede it is one man's point of view, one man's opinion, it is nothing short of what was expected. Certainly not hoped for but nonetheless expected. How sad...

 

[Phoenix]

Wow! Absolutely disgusting! While I'll concede it is one man's point of view, one man's opinion, it is nothing short of what was expected. Certainly not hoped for but nonetheless expected. How sad...

He represents 60 members who can vote.

 

[fodase]

Wow! Absolutely disgusting! While I'll concede it is one man's point of view, one man's opinion, it is nothing short of what was expected. Certainly not hoped for but nonetheless expected. How sad...

They are who we thought they were. Scum.

 

[Pi brat]

He represents 60 members who can vote.
[/quote

His updates will be read by several hundred who can vote.

 

[Tiger 1050]

With all due respect here I believe this illustrates the childish, spiteful attitude of USAPA!

Trying to get the C18 to admit to "criminal" activity? Just couldn't let it go could you...? As Brice suggests, show the evidence to law enforcement. Oh... You already did. Let it go. You are wasting money.

Furlough insurance just window dressing! Never any real intention of following through...? Sick. All because they would, in the end, be supporting more west than east. They're human beings with families! Petty.

Trusteeship suggestion from our friends in PHL! Yeah this is gonna work out just fine...

Guys, USAPA will never be a union as long as this continues. USAPA is where the majority lives. You need to get over yourselves and man up. Be the adult. Until then this will be nothing more than an experiment gone horribly wrong...

 

[Metroyet]

Great Update Brice!!!

I can heard the Eastie BPR blood pressure skyrocketing from here. They'll find a "constitutional" way to silence this kind of dissent soon enough, but for now, It's refreshing to hear the truth. Nothing surprising, but refreshing non the less.

USAPA is a two legged neutered dog, chasing it's own tail.

Time for the C-18 to counter sue.

 

[Phoenix]

.. USAPA is where the majority lives. ..

Was that an objection? :blink:

 

[Phoenix]

He represents 60 members who can vote.

His updates will be read by several hundred who can vote.

Thats about "several hundred" more dissenters than ALPA allowed.