US Pilots Labor Discussion 3/26- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[cleardirect]

It doesn't matter whether USAPA, ALPA, IAM, Teamsters, or whoever is still around.

The REAL question is whether you and I and the rest of the SAME pilots are still around. THAT IS THE QUESTION!!

Agent means nothing.

It's just US!

Well, Well, well. I guess emotion has finally gotten to you. You have gotten so emotional that you forgot the main argument that the east pilots have been using to avoid your obligations. FINAL AND BINDING.


This is exactly what the west pilots have said and what the court found to be true. AGENT MEANS NOTHING. It is the pilots that are the same therefore the agreements are the same the agent means nothing.

The east pilots agreed to final and binding arbitration under ALPA. The east pilots are still bound to that arbitration under usapa. The agent means nothing.

So after two years and millions of wasted dollars you finally admit the truth. The east pilots are bound and obligated to abide by the Nicolau award. So drop the appeal, drop the SCOTUS, drop the pretense that seniority was going to be anything else and let’s move on to a better contract.

 

[luvn737s]

What other tricks does the east pony know besides bullying and being obstinate?

 

[end_of_alpa]

Well, Well, well. I guess emotion has finally gotten to you. You have gotten so emotional that you forgot the main argument that the east pilots have been using to avoid your obligations. FINAL AND BINDING.


This is exactly what the west pilots have said and what the court found to be true. AGENT MEANS NOTHING. It is the pilots that are the same therefore the agreements are the same the agent means nothing.

The east pilots agreed to final and binding arbitration under ALPA. The east pilots are still bound to that arbitration under usapa. The agent means nothing.

So after two years and millions of wasted dollars you final admit the truth. The east pilots are bound and obligated to abide by the Nicolau award. So drop the appeal, drop the SCOTUS, drop the pretense that seniority was going to be anything else and let’s move on to a better contract.

I guess, ultimately, will find, now. Won't we???

No AGENT, no AGREEMENT.

Read the AFA flow chart.

http://www.unitedafa.org/contract/negotiations/rla/default.aspx#anc_RlaChart

Either you're crossing the picket line or I am. If you are, then I am. I know the majority of West will cross if THEY don't get their way, therefore I'm not supporting a CBA or a strike.

Good luck.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Being that you did not respond to my last challenge to this statement I looked at it from a different perspective. The most junior east pilot with a 1981 hire date (24 years DOH on "merger day") has a west pilot with a 1997 DOH. That's 8 years, not five.

If you are meaning to say you have 24 years as of now, your DOH would be 1986. The junior most east pilot with that DOH has a west pilot with a DOH of 2000 above him - that's 10 years.

Try to avoid running amok with your facts.

Didn't see your question, actually.

I have 24 years.

That's fourteen years difference.

Doesn't matter.

I'm not "jerking the gear" for a guy fourteen yeaars my junior.

Instead, I'm competing on the open market and undercutting you guys.

Period. I'm encouraging every junior pilot, as well as pilot on the street to do so as well.

See you the fight line.

 

[cleardirect]

I guess, ultimately, will find, now. Won't we???

No AGENT, no AGREEMENT.

Read the AFA flow chart.

http://www.unitedafa.org/contract/negotiations/rla/default.aspx#anc_RlaChart

Either you're crossing the picket line or I am. If you are, then I am. I know the majority of West will cross if THEY don't get their way, therefore I'm not supporting a CBA or a strike.

Good luck.

Are you under some illusion that we are going to be released to self help anytime in the near or distant future?

There has not even been the first meeting with all three parties. Speaking of a strike is nothing but a distraction to the real issues. I guess your running out arguments.

Beside, if the usapa supporters thought that you were going to win in the ninth there would be no need for all of this wild speculation and fantasies of ways to get around the award.

You all know that it is coming admit it to yourself or not you know it to be true.

 

[cleardirect]

Didn't see your question, actually.

I have 24 years.

That's fourteen years difference.

Doesn't matter.

I'm not "jerking the gear" for a guy fourteen yeaars my junior.

Instead, I'm competing on the open market and undercutting you guys.

Period. I'm encouraging every junior pilot, as well as pilot on the street to do so as well.

See you the fight line.

You assume that you would get a job. Anger shows at the interview. Let's review, some angry old guy vs. a younger pilot without the attitude problem. Let me think!!!!

 

[cubfan]

Well, Well, well. I guess emotion has finally gotten to you. You have gotten so emotional that you forgot the main argument that the east pilots have been using to avoid your obligations. FINAL AND BINDING.


This is exactly what the west pilots have said and what the court found to be true. AGENT MEANS NOTHING. It is the pilots that are the same therefore the agreements are the same the agent means nothing.

The east pilots agreed to final and binding arbitration under ALPA. The east pilots are still bound to that arbitration under usapa. The agent means nothing.

So after two years and millions of wasted dollars you finally admit the truth. The east pilots are bound and obligated to abide by the Nicolau award. So drop the appeal, drop the SCOTUS, drop the pretense that seniority was going to be anything else and let’s move on to a better contract.

are you dropping damages if awarded.

 

[cleardirect]

are you dropping damages if awarded.

WHY???? Why would we drop damages? E-O-A just admitted fault. It is the east pilots that caused this, it is the east pilots that will pay the damages. It is the east pilots that have caused the delay.

usapa could end the suit today but the damages have been done.

 

[hp_fa]

Man do you have time on your hands. with all you've said about yourself, all the time on this forum, the only thing I can think of is that, contrary to assertions, you are either a pilot and don't want to admit it OR you've got some other reason to pay so much attention to the outcome that's a pilot only issue.

I have told you the truth and if you choose not to believe it than I am not going to change your mind.

Have fun with those conspiracy theories.

 

[Coach Cabin]

Tell me again why you're so interested in this case, HP_FA.

YOu know why I'm here. I'm a pilot for US Airways. Explain it again???

You think your refusal to honor your agreement doesn't affect anyone other than pilots? I can name about 7,000 flight attendants who would disagree.

 

[Hope777]

You think your refusal to honor your agreement doesn't affect anyone other than pilots? I can name about 7,000 flight attendants who would disagree.

7000 F/A's ????

What about 30,000+ Employees That are going to be out of a Job if we dont get this Airline together and Fast.

 

[Coach Cabin]

7000 F/A's ????

What about 30,000+ Employees That are going to be out of a Job if we dont get this Airline together and Fast.

Agreed, the survival of the company is everyone's business. The flight attendants have been directly affected by the east pilot's temper tantrums. Our contract negotiations have been held hostage for two years because of this. Not trying to say that the rest of the 30,000 employees are not important, just that the f/a group is DIRECTLY affected due to things such as scheduling issues that have kept 7,000 of us from moving forward on our contract. Every other work group has a new contract.

 

[pilot]

Agreed, the survival of the company is everyone's business. The flight attendants have been directly affected by the east pilot's temper tantrums. Our contract negotiations have been held hostage for two years because of this. Not trying to say that the rest of the 30,000 employees are not important, just that the f/a group is DIRECTLY affected due to things such as scheduling issues that have kept 7,000 of us from moving forward on our contract. Every other work group has a new contract.

The company's survival is not the east pilots business. Those that think that it is don't fully grasp just how bad this is. Especially these west pilot posters who think a contract vote will pass the east group.

The same group trumpeted the foolishness of attempting to dump alpa.

Believe what you want for sure. But I'm telling you that there is no concern among the vast majority of the east pilot group for the survival of this company should this nic thing go the wrong way.

 

[Poug Darker]

Even though you consider a 15% raise a low ball offer the point being made here is the VNIIMN crowd deserves to get the vote they so proudly proclaim would fail. I am willing to bet that usapa will not put Kirby to a vote because they know, in their black little hearts, that it most likely would pass.

Another concessionary contract will pass??!! Maybe out west, but I don't think so....it's only what, a 3% raise for the westies. What a slap in the face for being such loyal company doobies. I'd be insulted with that offer.
The 15% raise figure for the east is misleading. Really, it's parity + 3%, and parity is what everyone on the east side should have had from the time this deal was done. Thanks again , ALPA (insert scarcasm here).
What do the pilots have to give up for this small raise? THAT is the question. Look beyond the $$ rate, grasshopper, and you will find the real reason the management shills on this board want us to pass Kirby.
Sorry, but when all the facts are displayed, Kirby is a stinker, and needs to be flushed, and forgotten. They can do much better than that.
Cheers.

 

[cleardirect]

The company's survival is not the east pilots business. Those that think that it is don't fully grasp just how bad this is. Especially these west pilot posters who think a contract vote will pass the east group.

The same group trumpeted the foolishness of attempting to dump alpa.

Believe what you want for sure. But I'm telling you that there is no concern among the vast majority of the east pilot group for the survival of this company should this nic thing go the wrong way.

That could be the most selfish statement ever. If the east pilots don't get what they want, what they could not convince an arbitrator or a court to give them. You all are willing to destroy peoples lives for your own selfish interest.

I suggest that the F/A's and other employees of this company make it clear to your work groups just who and why they may lose their job and career. The finger gets pointed directly at the east pilots.