US Pilots Labor Discussion 3/11- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[boeingplt]

Agreed!

Taken a step further into reality, can you imagine 15 years ago that your long suffering career would have finally ended if the "likes" of America West had not been crazy/generous enough to attempt such an ill-advised merger?....honestly?

I'm sure the investors and BOD are all about Doug running the airline based on the generosity of his kind heart.
You guys are smoking some good shizel!

 

[Tiger 1050]

What is this "change of control" you guys are talking about? Can you fill in an outsider...?

 

[cleardirect]

Clear,

The east is going to get the MONEY! Take a look at LOA 84 and go down to WAIVER. It will talk about a change of control. BOOK RATES! Section 1 Scope will also have your head spinning 4.5% raises year over year until it gets put together. I wish you guys would have bought us, because we would have been kicking butt on the money issue. Obviously, AWA didn't acquire US! Look, we don't really care what guys or girls like you think. We are protected by our Scope clause. How about yourselves? It is just a matter of time.

Now back to the other stuff. LOA 93 pay restoration is going to happen. The Desert Judge's law school project is about to get tanked by the 9th. The judge really should have paid attention to the RLA. Internal Union Dispute. Nothing concrete! Premature Adjudication. Wilder got this one right on the money....he spanked Vasin on his blog.

Back to the CHANGE of CONTROL thing............it will happen! Team Tempe, just like your desert judge has taken this thing as far as they could.

Hate

the Association shall, in addition to all other rights, thereupon have the right in
1©
Scope
Successorship and
Labor Protection
Section Page
24
1 its sole discretion, upon written notice to the Company within 60 days of written notice of
2 such transaction, to extend the duration of the Agreement for one, two or three years at
3 the Association's option, past the amendable date of the Agreement with across-the-board
4 wage increases of four and one half percent (4.5%) on January 2, 2003 and each annual
5 anniversary of the amendable date thereafter (i.e., on January 2, 2004, January 2, 2005,
6 January 2, 2006).

Is this the paragraph that you are pointing to with glee and wonder?

Interesting how you just tanked your case before you got started.

I wish you guys would have bought us, because we would have been kicking butt on the money issue. Obviously, AWA didn't acquire US!

That defines change of control. So are you going to argue that AWA did buy US Air and therefore make a liar of all that have said for 5 years that we did not or are you going to now change positions and say that we did but US Air?

You guys might want to find someone else other that some Cracker Jack box lawyer to read this section. You all do know what 60 days means right?

, upon written notice to the Company within 60 days of written notice of such transaction

The transaction took place in 2005 WAY, WAY , WAY past your 60 days SOL. Yes SOL stands for statute of limitations or in this case So out of luck. Your grievance is not ripe is has past ripe it has past stale and it has past rotted. This change of control is dead buried and turned to dust in the grave.

You guys need to face reality. There is no way around the Nicolau, there is no other money coming except through a new contract that includes the Nicolau. Once you guys get that idea through concrete skulls we will finally be able to move on.

This is just one of those lame brained ideas meant to distract the easily distractible.

Riddle me this. Where were the other unions that were promised to come out to the ninth with friend of the court briefs in support of USAPA? How is that Title VII and EEOC age discrimination suit working for you.

To even attempt to get anyone’s hopes up that a change of control will work is absolutely and completely irresponsible if this is coming from anyone in any sort of leadership position at the union. It is complete waste of resources and a misappropriation of funds to go any further.

What is it going to take to make you guys understand reality? The company is done playing with USAPA. What do you think that letter was all about? USAPA has crossed over from being a bother to frivolously dangerous. They put up with an expensive arbitration once do not expect them to do it again. The RICO suit was way out of line and USAPA had pushed it beyond reasonable. Expect pushback.

This union and some of it's supporters are acting like spoiled little rich kids demanding their way and an absent parent allowing them to terrorise those around them.
This will end badly for the current leaders of this association.

 

[Hate2fly]

What is this "change of control" you guys are talking about? Can you fill in an outsider...?

Tiger,

It is one of those gems in our East contract. If there is a change of control {UAL/AA/CO}we in the east go back to our Book Rates and until there is a new contract we will receive 4.5% increases year over year. In our present situation if AWA had acquired US, the east would have gone to book rates plus 4.5% per year for the last 4/5 years.

Hate

 

[CallawayGolf]

Clear,

The east is going to get the MONEY! Take a look at LOA 84 and go down to WAIVER. It will talk about a change of control. BOOK RATES! Section 1 Scope will also have your head spinning 4.5% raises year over year until it gets put together. I wish you guys would have bought us, because we would have been kicking butt on the money issue. Obviously, AWA didn't acquire US! Look, we don't really care what guys or girls like you think. We are protected by our Scope clause. How about yourselves? It is just a matter of time.

Now back to the other stuff. LOA 93 pay restoration is going to happen. The Desert Judge's law school project is about to get tanked by the 9th. The judge really should have paid attention to the RLA. Internal Union Dispute. Nothing concrete! Premature Adjudication. Wilder got this one right on the money....he spanked Vasin on his blog.

Back to the CHANGE of CONTROL thing............it will happen! Team Tempe, just like your desert judge has taken this thing as far as they could.

Hate

Another perfect example of the pathological delusions of grandeur that keep the USAPA supporters content, even hopeful, as they blindly follow their failed leadership. The parallels between the USAPA devotees and the Hale-Boppers at Heaven’s Gate are truly mindboggling. “Don’t worry friends; the answer to all your hopes and dreams is right there in the tail of that big object in the sky heading right for us. All you have to do is follow me and I’ll take you on your journey to the Next Level. â€￾

 

[Hate2fly]

Is this the paragraph that you are pointing to with glee and wonder?

Interesting how you just tanked your case before you got started.

That defines change of control. So are you going to argue that AWA did buy US Air and therefore make a liar of all that have said for 5 years that we did not or are you going to now change positions and say that we did but US Air?

You guys might want to find someone else other that some Cracker Jack box lawyer to read this section. You all do know what 60 days means right?

The transaction took place in 2005 WAY, WAY , WAY past your 60 days SOL. Yes SOL stands for statute of limitations or in this case So out of luck. Your grievance is not ripe is has past ripe it has past stale and it has past rotted. This change of control is dead buried and turned to dust in the grave.

You guys need to face reality. There is no way around the Nicolau, there is no other money coming except through a new contract that includes the Nicolau. Once you guys get that idea through concrete skulls we will finally be able to move on.

This is just one of those lame brained ideas meant to distract the easily distractible.

Riddle me this. Where were the other unions that were promised to come out to the ninth with friend of the court briefs in support of USAPA? How is that Title VII and EEOC age discrimination suit working for you.

To even attempt to get anyone’s hopes up that a change of control will work is absolutely and completely irresponsible if this is coming from anyone in any sort of leadership position at the union. It is complete waste of resources and a misappropriation of funds to go any further.

What is it going to take to make you guys understand reality? The company is done playing with USAPA. What do you think that letter was all about? USAPA has crossed over from being a bother to frivolously dangerous. They put up with an expensive arbitration once do not expect them to do it again. The RICO suit was way out of line and USAPA had pushed it beyond reasonable. Expect pushback.

This union and some of it's supporters are acting like spoiled little rich kids demanding their way and an absent parent allowing them to terrorise those around them.
This will end badly for the current leaders of this association.

Clear,

What are you talking about? I am talking about a future transaction. Not some screwed up merger that took place 5 years ago. The present AWA/US merger did not have a change of control. I think everyone understands this. US Airways is the surviving carrier in our merger.
Hate

 

[malikie]

Change of control was contested by fleet services or maint and I believe it failed....if you check their repsective threads you might find the information.

If the pilot group wants to waste more money beating a dead horse I am sure your lawyers will gladly take it.

 

[CallawayGolf]

Change of control was contested by fleet services or maint and I believe it failed....if you check their repsective threads you might find the information.

If the pilot group wants to waste more money beating a dead horse I am sure your lawyers will gladly take it.

I think he may be confusing his alternate reality universe with the one the rest of us live in.

 

[CallawayGolf]

Clear,

The east is going to get the MONEY! Take a look at LOA 84 and go down to WAIVER. It will talk about a change of control. BOOK RATES! Section 1 Scope will also have your head spinning 4.5% raises year over year until it gets put together. I wish you guys would have bought us, because we would have been kicking butt on the money issue. Obviously, AWA didn't acquire US! Look, we don't really care what guys or girls like you think. We are protected by our Scope clause. How about yourselves? It is just a matter of time.

Now back to the other stuff. LOA 93 pay restoration is going to happen. The Desert Judge's law school project is about to get tanked by the 9th. The judge really should have paid attention to the RLA. Internal Union Dispute. Nothing concrete! Premature Adjudication. Wilder got this one right on the money....he spanked Vasin on his blog.

Back to the CHANGE of CONTROL thing............it will happen! Team Tempe, just like your desert judge has taken this thing as far as they could.

Hate

Ah - this just made my day. Thanks for the great belly laugh!

 

[Tiger 1050]

Clear,

What are you talking about? I am talking about a future transaction. Not some screwed up merger that took place 5 years ago. The present AWA/US merger did not have a change of control. I think everyone understands this. US Airways is the surviving carrier in our merger.
Hate

Hate,

In an earlier post you said "Back to the CHANGE of CONTROL thing............it will happen!" So taking this in addition to what I have quoted above, do you know something others don't? Are you suggesting that you know a "transaction" WILL take place?

 

[cleardirect]

So now this is some mythical future transaction.

I guess because the boat load of lawyers that both companies hire during M&A would somehow miss that little ditty. Or perhaps they would be so willing to add an ever increasing 4.5% every year for stellar service for the east pilots.

I said it before why do you think that Parker went to great pains to convolute this merger and say the both sides needed each other? To avoid the COC. The next merger will do the same thing. some sort of mutual admiration deal. Every think that it would be US Airways doing the aquireing? How would that work in your little play?

Still no money with out the Nicolau seniority.

 

[ChuckBewFarley]

"Seems that the company has a very different take......" They do?..Well, Duh!...THERE'S a big surprise! Are you being even remotely serious here?

"Is the spin machine stuck on high back at the politburo??" Apparently so....as usual.

I think that's about enough of this insane BS for me for a bit.

But they had actual real live evidence, in writing no less, some of it from the those that lead the pilot club.

Company has evidence, pilot club has rumor and innuendo.

Pilot club tries to make hay from whence the information came from, not the fact that there is not anything that actually supports their case, is the Wonder Lawyer at it again?

 

[Metroyet]

US Airways is the surviving carrier in our merger.
Hate

That's why US Airways is managed in Tempe by the former Exec. team of America West? You guys got to keep your "styleized" flag painted on the tail, (and LOA93), aside from that, This is an entirely new entity with a merged seniority list that has been signed, sealed, delivered and accepted with out contest by your new managers.

 

[BoeingBoy]

For people that seem to be so certain, supremely confident even, that the dominoes are going to fall their way - 9th, LOA93 pay, MDA - there seems to be a lot of searching for something else to pin all their hopes on...

Jim

 

[Real tired]

First; Why don't YOU go talk to them and explain all about your absurd fantasies about how to properly establish "seniority"? Do get right back to us all with what they tell you.

This statement I can agree with.

Yes, we lost our COC grievance, and I was so hoping we didn't. If we would have won, it would have meant snap back wages AND the ability to pull my PBGC pension and work here at the same time. Finally a chance to get back some of what was take from me! Alas,not to be.

Some time back, before our Transition Agreement was voted on, there were rumors of our west brothers and sisters, due to their junority, using super seniority to slot themselves into our seniority list. This didn't fly with us. And there would of, most likely, been no Transition Agreement if this was the case. But what they did was basically used DOH seniority and placed fences on bids for PHX and LAS for a certain amount of time.

So "from a Mechanic", I myself have no dog in your fight, but I myself do not agree with the "absurd fantasies" of the west pilots for their dream of super seniority, and at the same time, I do not think that the east pilot have a chance to win a COC dispute against this company.