US Airways ALPA MEC Chairman's Message

[Mr Furlough]

Wow, I'm sure glad all of the East pilots appointed YOU as their spokesman on this issue. Funny though, in all of my jumpseating in the past few months, NONE of the East pilots I have flown with seemed to share your viewpoint.

In fact, most have the opposite view, and spoke only of how horrible LOA 93 was, and how it was killing them slowly but surely to work under those conditions. One CLT crew I jumpseated with was, in fact, beyond scared that the West would begin our own Section 6 and they would be stuck at the current LOA93 pay rates.

Perhaps you live in a different reality than the common East line pilot.

Yea, LOA 93 is a problem for our east pilots, and it is a problem for the west as well. When was the last time in modern day aviation that the flying went to the more expensive pilot group?

That being said, your assumptions are incorrect, in my opinion. How many of your TWA guys would have voted a pay raise in lue of getting their seniority at American? Yup, same here. The seniority integration is the first issue, the contract is secondary, the survival of the company is third. And today the stock is below $30. Life is moving on.

 

[USA320Pilot]

N905TW,

N905TW said: "Wow, I'm sure glad all of the East pilots appointed YOU as their spokesman on this issue. Funny though, in all of my jumpseating in the past few months, NONE of the East pilots I have flown with seemed to share your viewpoint."

"In fact, most have the opposite view, and spoke only of how horrible LOA 93 was, and how it was killing them slowly but surely to work under those conditions. One CLT crew I jumpseated with was, in fact, beyond scared that the West would begin our own Section 6 and they would be stuck at the current LOA93 pay rates."

"Perhaps you live in a different reality than the common East line pilot."

USA320Pilot comments: I agree that no US Airways pilot likes LOA 93, but they prefer the thought of living with LOA 93 and preventing the Nicolau Award from being implemented, if necessary. Why? Attrtion based career expectation and growth up the seniority list provides meaningful pay raises, improved DC Plan contributions, and imporved quality of life, which is what the US Airways pilots brought to the merger.

The East pilot resolve iss clearly evident because never before in the history of ALPA has an Executive Council meeting had about 450 pilots in attendance, which should should the solidarity on this issue. In my 23 years in this business I have never seen this pilot group have so much solidarity.

Per the MEC June 10 code-a-phone report, "MEC Chairman Jack Stephan recorded a Chairman’s Message today that speaks to the AWA MEC’s refusal to comply with the requirements of the Executive Council’s May 24th resolution, which calls for among other things, 'consensual approaches to promote career protections.' In contrast, the US Airways MEC stands ready to do its part in fulfilling the Executive Council Resolution. It is important to note that all parties at the June 6th meeting in Washington DC agreed that the process proposed by Captain Prater would not in any way waive the position of either party before the Executive Council. This confirms that the US Airways pilots’ position before the Executive Council will continue to be that the Nicolau Award violates the requirements of ALPA Merger Policy and should be invalidated and remanded to another arbitrator for resolution consistent with the Merger Policy. This Chairman’s Message is a must read. It will be posted in What’s New, emailed to all pilots and can be heard by pressing prompt 2 on the code-a-phone (at 800-FOR-ALPA)."

Either there is a consensual agreement or there will be no joint contract, there will be no Nicolau Award implementation, and the toxic relationship and poor company operation will continue. The only people who can stop this from happening are the AWA pilots who have the opportunity to comply with the EC's resolution. If not I believe the parties need to stop waisting each others time and need to independently move on.

Regards,

USA320pilot

 

[Callsign_Cactus]

Don't put the burden on the AWA pilots!!! We all agreed to the process and that was carried out flawlessly, period. DOH is not part of ALPA merger policy and there was no windfall, so tell me again why the AWA pilots are to blame for the mess we’re in and are now suddenly the answer to our problem??????

How about the East leadership starts leading and honors a binding decision??? How about the East pilots stepping up and doing the right thing by accepting what cannot be undone and moving on to a better future???

Ah, but they won't because of the "travesty" and "devastation" the Nicolau award will bear upon them - NOT!! If you can ever figure out you do not work for the same US Airways anymore and are not ENTITLED to your DOH just to staple all of us West to the bottom, only then can we move on. BTW, if you do want to work for the old US Airways, go stand in the unemployment line because that’s about as close as you will ever get.

ALPA will be stronger than ever when they finally accept the ward and submit to the Company. There are many OAL MECs watching this very carefully to see if the EC will uphold its own constitution, or fold under mob mentality pressure. The future of ALPA is at stake here, and I’m not talking about the east threat of decertifying (likely to occur), think bigger picture.

I’m fine with east remaining separate until whenever, but the real problem is you are not comfortable with that and you know it!! Why constantly bring it up as if it were a threat? Do you really think we care? Do you think the west pilots are just sitting here anxiously waiting to jump on all that lucrative attrition we supposedly inherited?? Don’t even get me started on the ATTRITION MYTH. Yea, we really want all of your FO and FUR attrition! Fact is, half of all that ATTRITION you speak of is from these positions. What you and others really want is your cake so you can and eat it too, with the West supplying the plates, forks, and napkins so you can eat with some dignity. You want it your way or the highway. We’ll I say have it your way and live under LOA 93 until you die, for all I care. Just do us all a favor and do whatever you are going to do and stop trying to convince all of us on the west that Nicolau violated ALPA merger policy, or that there is a windfall at the expense of east, or any other fabricated mistruth. You will never, and I repeat, NEVER, convince any of us that’s the case.

Finally, do you really think the east pilots are the cause and solution to the Company's current dismal performance?? Oh yea, the operation would be turned around tomorrow if only the east pilots would get their way, boy are you delusional :wacko:

Cheers!

CC

Either there is a consensual agreement or there will be no joint contract, there will be no Nicolau Award implementation, and the toxic relationship and poor company operation will continue. The only people who can stop this from happening are the AWA pilots who have the opportunity to comply with the EC's resolution. If not I believe the parties need to stop waisting each others time and need to independently move on.

Regards,

USA320pilot

 

[ClueByFour]

When was the last time in modern day aviation that the flying went to the more expensive pilot group?

Something tells me everyone on the East is TOS (or close to it) and not everyone out west is there, yet. Making assumptions about "the more expensive group" might be dangerous.

 

[john john]

If not I believe the parties need to stop waisting each others time and need to independently move on.

Regards,

USA320pilot

AGREE 110% stop with the threats (brinkmanship) you word not mine.

 

[Mr Furlough]

Don't put the burden on the AWA pilots!!! We all agreed to the process and that was carried out flawlessly, period. DOH is not part of ALPA merger policy and there was no windfall, so tell me again why the AWA pilots are to blame for the mess we’re in and are now suddenly the answer to our problem??????

How about the East leadership starts leading and honors a binding decision??? How about the East pilots stepping up and doing the right thing by accepting what cannot be undone and moving on to a better future???

Ah, but they won't because of the "travesty" and "devastation" the Nicolau award will bear upon them - NOT!! If you can ever figure out you do not work for the same US Airways anymore and are not ENTITLED to your DOH just to staple all of us West to the bottom, only then can we move on. BTW, if you do want to work for the old US Airways, go stand in the unemployment line because that’s about as close as you will ever get.

ALPA will be stronger than ever when they finally accept the ward and submit to the Company. There are many OAL MECs watching this very carefully to see if the EC will uphold its own constitution, or fold under mob mentality pressure. The future of ALPA is at stake here, and I’m not talking about the east threat of decertifying (likely to occur), think bigger picture.

I’m fine with east remaining separate until whenever, but the real problem is you are not comfortable with that and you know it!! Why constantly bring it up as if it were a threat? Do you really think we care? Do you think the west pilots are just sitting here anxiously waiting to jump on all that lucrative attrition we supposedly inherited?? Don’t even get me started on the ATTRITION MYTH. Yea, we really want all of your FO and FUR attrition! Fact is, half of all that ATTRITION you speak of is from these positions. What you and others really want is your cake so you can and eat it too, with the West supplying the plates, forks, and napkins so you can eat with some dignity. You want it your way or the highway. We’ll I say have it your way and live under LOA 93 until you die, for all I care. Just do us all a favor and do whatever you are going to do and stop trying to convince all of us on the west that Nicolau violated ALPA merger policy, or that there is a windfall at the expense of east, or any other fabricated mistruth. You will never, and I repeat, NEVER, convince any of us that’s the case.

Finally, do you really think the east pilots are the cause and solution to the Company's current dismal performance?? Oh yea, the operation would be turned around tomorrow if only the east pilots would get their way, boy are you delusional :wacko:

Cheers!

CC

Callsign_Cactus,

We clearly have a difference in opinion that will never be solved here on the board. We are in a process to decide what to do with the Nicolau award, a joint contract, and the future of ALPA. We will just have to wait and see how that all unravels.

You seem to behold much distain for your fellow pilots in the east. I'm perfectly ok with that. But I would disagree that our rejection of the Nicolau award equates to some level of greed. As I am curtain that if any of you guys and gals in the west were in our shoes, you too would share the same stance. That is why we haven't seen one single post here from an east person stating that they are happy-or evan ok-with the Nicolau award.

It's not your place in aviation that any of us want, it's our place. Our differences on this issue are a product of the differences in the makeup of each of our seniority list. So disperse the "they are greedy" thing all you like. It accomplishes nothing. Further, your slamming of the east operation is something akin to biting the hand that feeds you. Not very polite! Remember this, the east is by far the greatest producer of profits and revenue for this organization. To me, that doesn't really mean much, until I hear some rant coming from the west that we wouldn't be here without you.

Best,

 

[Busdrvr]

You seem to behold much distain for your fellow pilots in the east. I'm perfectly ok with that. But I would disagree that our rejection of the Nicolau award equates to some level of greed. As I am curtain that if any of you guys and gals in the west were in our shoes, you too would share the same stance.

It's not your place in aviation that any of us want, it's our place. Our differences on this issue are a product of the differences in the makeup of each of our seniority list.

Remember this, the east is by far the greatest producer of profits and revenue for this organization. To me, that doesn't really mean much, until I hear some rant coming from the west that we wouldn't be here without you.

To be perfectly frank, most pilots "in your shoes" would have been applying elsewhere by about early 2001 (except for the ones that thought they'd get a great windfall from some future UAL merger.... )

Your place in aviation is at the bottom of the active seniority list. That's what your peso's bought when you came to the table. Heck, to be honest, your peso's didn't even buy that...you got a windfall (recall) as a result of the merger.

Don't break your arm patting yourself on the back about all the "profits" the east brings in. It's a bunch of bunk. If you guys were potentially so profitable, the other airlines would have been in line to buy you carcas. They weren't. Doogie bought you, and honestly, he is now trying to make it look like he did the right thing. It's not a tough task to show the east doing well, you just move a few cost items from operation to operation. From what I understand Lorenzo made EAL buy all it's fuel from his fuel subsid at an inflated price. The fuel arm made big money while the airline lost big.

 

[autofixer]

Busdrvr, Now play nice. It is hard to leave an airline. Just ask the EAL, TWA and PanAm guys. After all, UAL has been in bankruptcy once and looks as if it is headed there again and I don't see UAL pilots jumping ship. It is the lack of a national seniority list that is at the root of the problem.

 

[LCC_#1]

Just do us all a favor and do whatever you are going to do and stop trying to convince all of us on the west that Nicolau violated ALPA merger policy, or that there is a windfall at the expense of east, or any other fabricated mistruth. You will never, and I repeat, NEVER, convince any of us that’s the case.

You sound like the many Germans (one works for US Airways) who still think there was no Holocaust. Keep believing what you want. The majority of the ALPA MEC knows the TRUTH!!

 

[AWA320]

You sound like the many Germans (one works for US Airways) who still think there was no Holocaust. Keep believing what you want. The majority of the ALPA MEC knows the TRUTH!!

Here we have yet another flight attendant that confuses LONGETIVITY WITH SENIORITY!! Two very different things with very different meanings!

Many east pilots have LONGETIVITY WITH very low SENIORITY which is why they are on the bottom of the AAA seniority list. Said pilots belong on the bottom of the combined list, yet people like yourself with absolutly no dog in this fight what so ever advocate a windfall position. Bottom means bottom and the nic award was more than fair. You east F/A's already got your windfall so move on and enjoy already would you!!

 

[EyeInTheSky]

AWA320 -

Here's a new slogan for you: "Date of Hire - So simple even a caveman gets it." So, what's your excuse?

Later,
Eye

Here we have yet another flight attendant that confuses LONGETIVITY WITH SENIORITY!! Two very different things with very different meanings!

Many east pilots have LONGETIVITY WITH very low SENIORITY which is why they are on the bottom of the AAA seniority list. Said pilots belong on the bottom of the combined list, yet people like yourself with absolutly no dog in this fight what so ever advocate a windfall position. Bottom means bottom and the nic award was more than fair. You east F/A's already got your windfall so move on and enjoy already would you!!

 

[AWA320]

AWA320 -

Here's a new slogan for you: "Date of Hire - So simple even a caveman gets it." So, what's your excuse?

Later,
Eye

No excuse Eye just show us where it is in section 45 of the merger policy and we can discuss it. Howeverr if it's not part of section 45 of the merger policy how about y ou drop it and move on huh?

In todays merger policy DOH is like the uncola, never had it never will

 

[donttouchthebeauty]

No excuse Eye just show us where it is in section 45 of the merger policy and we can discuss it. Howeverr if it's not part of section 45 of the merger policy how about y ou drop it and move on huh?

In todays merger policy DOH is like the uncola, never had it never will

AWA320 please do us all a favor and at the next townhall meeting get up and say - hi i am AWA320 and this is how this airline should be ran and this is the only way to do things etc.... I am sure that everyone will bow to you - the almighty AWA320 - our savior - go ahead reveal yourself - almighty one!!!

 

[Bear96]

AWA320 please do us all a favor and at the next townhall meeting get up and say - hi i am AWA320 and this is how this airline should be ran and this is the only way to do things etc....

AWA320 is only saying ALPA should follow its own policy.

The East pilots are the ones saying there is only one way to do things. Unfortunately, their view of the way things ought to be does not match ALPA policy.

 

[exB717Flyer]

Had AWA MEC Chairman speak at recurrent training today. Nothing earth-shattering. He explained how Prater is just trying to be a politician and make the USAir guys happy by pressuring AWALPA to make concessions. He said the EC certainly could toss out the Nicolau Award but wouldn't since that would be such a blatant violation of ALPA Policy. He felt the worst-case scenario was the EC further delaying the inevitable presentation of the List to Parker.

And BTW, for those who don't know the MEC passed a new merger assesment yesterday. Thus, we are quite well funded for whatever challenges lie ahead.