As a long time AMFA supporter I have to defend Kev on the no struck work. I don't blame him for crossing the AMFA picket line to do his job. I do blame his union for not backing AMFA. If he had refused to cross the line with out the backing of his union he would have been fired.
The new Northwest...named "Delta"
- Thread starter North by Northwest
- Start date
Kev3188
Veteran
Thank you.
Your assessment is dead on. The leadership of DL143-or more importantly Bobby DePace- failed miserably in how this was handled. If nothing else, they should have adopted the "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" approach. Instead, we were treated to listening to DePace act like a Spurned ex-girlfriend trying to get revenge.
Doing the right thing was an easy decision to make. The fact that it subverted the 143 leadership's agenda made it all the better.
The silver lining in all that (if there is one) is that during the next election, the membership spoke, he was voted out, and our district is vastly improved as a result....
this is a 13min video but a key point and the reason I am posting it is to respond to NXNW assumption that the new DAL will be the old NW. In the video Allen and Anderson agree that it is important that the delta culture be the culture to survive.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=807959830
http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=807959830
North by Northwest
Veteran
Cooper, you keep believing that from the people who RAN Northwest into the ground and who have given promises 'in writing" to only one employee group on Delta property....UNIONIZED pilots.
When there are more NW people running the new delta, the culture will never be "delta" that is just plain commonsense. I can see now that there are many people at Delta that simple trust management by it's word. Well, you will do that with this gang at your peril. You have better face reality. Your "old" delta is dead, if this goes through. It is a fact, "new" delta will be ran by majority Northwest executives....period, no matter how you try to slice it.
757inthebarrel
Member
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2006
- Messages
- 97
- Reaction score
- 0
It's the employees who dictate the culture of the airline. Upper management basically inherits the culture of the company they are taking over. They can control how they interact with the employee groups but 5 or 6 individuals do not determine the corporate culture. It's the thousands of middle managers, FAs, pilots, agents, maintainers, etc that determine over many years the culture of the company. Delta has always and will continue to be a combination of the groups it assimilates along the way. Of course with this being the largest merger in US airline history the new culture will be a combination of NWA and DL with the larger group having the bigger impact on the result. Hopefully we get the best of DL and NWA in the combined carrier.
I have no plans to argue that management are angels. I think they were referring to the fact that Delta has had a better relationship with labor than NWA has. This includes our unionized pilots. Just because you are unionized doesnt mean you have to automatically hate management. I too support unionization, however we can organize and still have a positive relationship with management. Other airlines do it. SW is unionized and they do not have an advasarial (sp) relationship with management. I can only speak for myself when I say that I hope that we can all come together to make this work. Bringing both of these airlines together may create a very successful airline, it will do no good to predict our doom and then work for our demise. However I do not look forward to working side by side on a flight with someone who is closed minded to change and would rather see the whole airline destroyed based on their own bitterness.
North by Northwest
Veteran
I will share with you and cooper this answer. As to your theory of culture I say this, upon these peoples arrival at NWA in the early 1990's and the promises of "let's work together, share together" the Northwest "culture" smoked Delta up and down left and right...in every category. THAT...is a historical fact! Once screwed, the "culture" changed...guess that is what you folks will have to learn. (if this goes through)
Managers, regardless of their level will carry out the orders of the leaders of the company. How they achieve that has been demonstrated by their past actions.
You are dead wrong if you think the employees of Northwest Airlines will be "assimilated" into anything but Northwest merging with a slightly larger equal now run by Northwest. It is you who will be assimilated into the "bait and switch" of these individuals. Clearly, their history falls on deaf ears. That's like ignoring the history of an ax murderer, and thinking "well, he's at our house now so he won't be killing anybody like he did over the last 17 years" cause it's Delta.
Denial is a powerful elixir. You are in the wrong dimension if you think Northwest employees will happily give up their Unions with out a fight. First off...it is a KNOWN fact that the rank and file of NW employees are staunchly against the profiteering sale/ merger (what ever the HEDGE FUND bootlickers call it) of their company...period.
I feel the same about flying side by side with a detached from factual reality types, especially when they think they can tell us about people we've been dealing with for over 17 years. But...they will be "different" now because they have been kissed by the Delta magic fairy. It will NOT go as planned, that much you can plan on.
757inthebarrel
Member
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2006
- Messages
- 97
- Reaction score
- 0
It seemed to me that the culture at NW changed with the Checci/Wilson leveraged buyout and the fallout that occured afterwards. I don't see anything remotely near that scale being done here.
I'll leave the union arguements for you and others. I already have one. What I'm saying is we have had our share of idiot management types push this or that new program and some who have attempted to ruin the company, yet the culture at DL remains relatively the same. That's because most of the people who do the job day in and day out remain the same and the pass their training and experience on to those that have followed them. There is no doubt that the culture at DL will be in for a big change with the addition of a large employee group with a long tradition of doing business their own way. It's also a major reason many here, especially the more senior ones, fear that this merger may harm the company in the long run. I hope we'll pick the best atributes of both company's and move forward.
You are obviously very protective and proud of your company. That's admirable. While I'm proud to work for DL, I'm mainly in this for the paycheck and quality of life. I really don't care which name is painted on the side of the airplanes or who has worked in which management previously. It's in management's interest to work with the employee groups as much as possible, especially now, and I'll give them the benefit of the doubt until they prove me wrong. I'll support whatever I think gives me and my fellow employees the best chance at relative stability in this screwed up industry. Since this merger is going to happen whether I throw a tatrum or not, I choose to do what I can to make it work when it does happen. I look forward to working with my new co-workers when the opportunity arises. I think you'll find most here are outstanding individuals like those you work with now and I expect I'll find the same.
aislehopper
Senior
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 331
- Reaction score
- 9
deleted duplicate post (link to CNBC segment)
North by Northwest
Veteran
Hats off to you 757...a sound quality response. Afterall, it's not like these companies will miss any of us when we are gone.
"It seemed to me that the culture at NW changed with the Checci/Wilson leveraged buyout and the fallout that occured afterwards."
I would add that Anderson and Steenland were VERY VERY much a part of that era...if not worse in some ways. The toxic poison that Steenland carries with him is known all over the world. Anderson was his boss.
I am sure your culture at nwa is and has been a very good one, I do not know why you insist it would smoke Delta's . I do not see it as a competition, we should not work against each other but with each other. And yes that is why we need unionization but for myself we can unionize and still have good relationships with management. I know you think that our new management is just out to get us as they did at nwa. I guess I just have a wait and see attitude. I do not think that the circumstances are the same nor the attitudes the same with the new company. It would not be in thier best interest to merge these two companies together and then try to pick fights with all the unions. Maybe that is because I see the glass half full.
No it's not. It's your opinion and nothing more. The fact that you don't know the difference between a fact and an opinion is pretty alarming.
If they are so against it, why aren't there any protests or efforts to stop it? I haven't seen the NW employees do anything to stop it. If they are so staunchly against it, you'd think they'd at least picket or do something. The NW employees have done nothing...it's probably one of the most apathetic responses I've ever seen from a group about to be merged.
I'll agree with you that this management team won't do things like the old Delta. But the old Delta has been dead for a long time. And I have a feeling that most DL employees would rather take their chances with this team than the previous one (Mullin, Reid & Co).
North by Northwest
Veteran
Instead of trying to sound clever...clearly a stretch, do some "historical FACT checking on the rankings of US majors for the early 90's" sonny boy. You'll learn a thing or two (perhaps you can learn how and when to use alarming). Furthermore, as you are neither Delta or Northwest...what the h*ll would you know what either liked. Stick to something you know about...seat warmer.
Kev3188
Veteran
Just because you haven't seen it, doesn't mean it isn't occuring... You must not be looking very hard?
Just a few examples:
+ A concerted campaign to have employees write local senators/congress urging opposition.
+ Well attended hearings in Washington D.C.
+ Well attended hearings in Minnesota.
Need more?
Apathetic is the last adjective I'd use to describe the NW workgroups right now.
North by Northwest
Veteran
My comment was a reply to the comparison of cultures. Nothing more. There is nothing more beneficial for any company than good employee relations...IF, the company believes in them and not just self enrichment as your potentially new Delta Board members, Steenland, and Bostock does.
You should think as you wish. We, however, would be beyond foolish to think the same Pimps on a different block is going to treat us any better than they have for the last 17 years. Action speaks louder than words, so far, we've seen the same garbage from the same Pimps (who clearly respects one thing, the POWER from a Union that is unified and could throw a wrench in their power grab).
NW/Delta Cabin Crew now face this merger from a weakened position vs. a powerful one, because 60% of Delta FAs thought Delta would be in control and skim off the top to their benefit ala Pan Am. That says alot about the bulk of Delta FAs. Now...they are facing the possibility of a precedent setting arbitration to the benefit of NW FAs. Delta management can do NOTHING for them now. If NW crews turn down the negotiated settlement it automatically goes to binding arbitration. Delta FAs had better hope the next Union election passes...for their benefit. Greedy Karma is a crazy B*tch with an meat ax.
In the long run...757 lays the reality of the situation out on the table. It is what it is.
