The DEAL is done for Mechanics

[FWAAA]

Whine, whine, whine.

You guys can either vote to cut your pay or you can watch the bankruptcy court do it.

Sure, you could go on strike, and watch AA fold and liquidate.

Then you could start all over at the bottom of some other company''s seniority pile - if anyone hires you.

Has it occurred to you that if you agree to the concessions now, and a year or two later AA is highly profitable, that you could demand some of the pie (and strike if you''re told "NO")??

On the other hand, your fate is sealed if you veto the concessions. AA will file Chapter 11, languish in a protracted attempt to restructure, the bankruptcy court will cut your pay (probably more like 50%), and life will really suck.

I forgot, of course, that the executives are hiding the billions of cash right now and will split it up as soon as you vote "YES" on the TAs.

 

[RV4]

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On 4/1/2003 836 PM FWAAA wrote:

Whine, whine, whine.

You guys can either vote to cut your pay or you can watch the bankruptcy court do it.

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There is a huge difference between voluntary rollover, and forced concessions.

Why doesn't anyone ever mention the removal of those in management that took us here and their loss of control in BK? I find that appealing myself!

 

[Bob Owens]

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On 4/1/2003 836 PM FWAAA wrote:

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You are either ignorant or a liar, perhaps both.
Lets look at what you posted.
I would rather have a judge impose Temporary cuts than agree to Six years of cuts.

"Has it occurred to you that if you agree to the concessions now, and a year or two later AA is highly profitable, that you could demand some of the pie (and strike if you're told "NO")??"

Oh really? Are you sure about that? Has it occurred to you that we are under the RLA? Do you know what a Six year contract under the RLA is? It means that for six years the contract is binding unless both parties agree to change it. Strikes or other job actions are illegal unless the company changes the terms and rates of pay.So if we agree with this we are stuck with it for SIX YEARS!

"Then you could start all over at the bottom of some other company's seniority pile - if anyone hires you."

I'd rather start at the bottom than end up at the bottom. If we accept this agreement that is where we will be headed.
As far as anyone hiring me, its never been a problem. You see, I've always worked two jobs, and I've had offers already but I'm not going out without a fight.

"On the other hand, your fate is sealed if you veto the concessions. AA will file Chapter 11, languish in a protracted attempt to restructure, the bankruptcy court will cut your pay (probably more like 50%), and life will really suck."

Our fate is sealed? How do you know what the company will do? How do you know what the judge will do? 50% where did you get that number from? UAL has been in BK for 5 months and the judge imposed a 14% Tempoorary cut on them. Where did you get 50%?

 

[FWAAA]

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On 4/1/2003 8:53:47 PM Bob Owens wrote:

You are either ignorant or a liar, perhaps both.
Lets look at what you posted.
I would rather have a judge impose Temporary cuts than agree to Six years of cuts.

Oh really? Are you sure about that? Has it occurred to you that we are under the RLA? Do you know what a Six year contract under the RLA is? It means that for six years the contract is binding unless both parties agree to change it. Strikes or other job actions are illegal unless the company changes the terms and rates of pay.So if we agree with this we are stuck with it for SIX YEARS!

Our fate is sealed? How do you know what the company will do? How do you know what the judge will do? 50% where did you get that number from? UAL has been in BK for 5 months and the judge imposed a 14% Tempoorary cut on them. Where did you get 50%?


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Ok - go ahead and gamble that the court''s "temporary" cuts will be better than the TA.

AA''s unions have a history of not letting the RLA interfere with their job actions - so why start now?

Go ahead and vote no - I''ve already got mine.

 

[Bob Owens]

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On 4/1/2003 959 PM FWAAA wrote:


Ok - go ahead and gamble that the court''s "temporary" cuts will be better than the TA.

AA''s unions have a history of not letting the RLA interfere with their job actions - so why start now?

Go ahead and vote no - I''ve already got mine.

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I will take my chances in BK just as you take yours by buying AMR. You are here to serve your interests, as I am mine. I do not want to give up $20,000 a year in wages and even more in benifits to help make you richer.

 

[FA Mikey]

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On 4/2/2003 11:39:59 PM Bob Owens wrote:

I will take my chances in BK just as you take yours by buying AMR. You are here to serve your interests, as I am mine. I do not want to give up $20,000 a year in wages and even more in benifits to help make you richer.


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You are not just taking your chance''s you will force every other employee threw the same drama of BK. You will lose more than 20,000 and you will see permanent cuts and more draconian work rule changes.

Its hard to understand the mentality of someone unable to make change in there own organization. Who believes a BK court judge will save him drastic permanent cuts.

When AA puts forward there next round in the court room. Its TWU against the AA lawyers and all the creditors wanting some payment.

 

[MiAAmi]

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On 4/2/2003 11:39:59 PM Bob Owens wrote:



I will take my chances in BK just as you take yours by buying AMR. You are here to serve your interests, as I am mine. I do not want to give up $20,000 a year in wages and even more in benifits to help make you richer.


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Does this sound like United or what? The mechanics at United said the same thing.

 

[RV4]

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On 4/3/2003 5:59:37 PM FA Mikey wrote:

No crystal ball or dionne warwick or physic friend. I know how AA operates and that in BK they wont be working to lessen the burden on us all. They are a smart strong company. They will get as much as they can in one clean sweep.

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Just as I figured.

Nobody else can prove this claim either. It is just a repeated company fear statement.

 

[RV4]

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On 4/3/2003 6:54:52 AM FA Mikey wrote:

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You will lose more than 20,000 and you will see permanent cuts and more draconian work rule changes.

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Where is the proof of this claim? I have not seen worse than our T/A at United or USAir. What do you base this belief on anyway? Do you have a crystal ball?

 

[FA Mikey]

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On 4/3/2003 4:55:59 PM RV4 wrote:

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On 4/3/2003 6:54:52 AM FA Mikey wrote:

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 You will lose more than 20,000 and you will see permanent cuts and more draconian work rule changes.

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Where is the proof of this claim? I have not seen worse than our T/A at United or USAir. What do you base this belief on anyway? Do you have a crystal ball?

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No crystal ball or dionne warwick or physic friend. I know how AA operates and that in BK they wont be working to lessen the burden on us all. They are a smart strong company. They will get as much as they can in one clean sweep.

 

[FA Mikey]

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On 4/3/2003 5:03:37 PM MiAAmi wrote:

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On 4/2/2003 11:39:59 PM Bob Owens wrote:



I will take my chances in BK just as you take yours by buying AMR. You are here to serve your interests, as I am mine. I do not want to give up $20,000 a year in wages and even more in benifits to help make you richer.


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Does this sound like United or what? The mechanics at United said the same thing.


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And bob was over on their board cheering them on for full pay til the last day. Turns out he not to popular over on the UAL board either.

 

[Bob Owens]

:

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On 4/3/2003 5:59:37 PM FA Mikey wrote:

No crystal ball or dionne warwick or physic friend. I know how AA operates and that in BK they wont be working to lessen the burden on us all. They are a smart strong company. They will get as much as they can in one clean sweep.


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It seems to me that they are going for that now, prior to BK. Lets face it if they cut deeper they stand to lose employees even before the economy recovers. Airline employees have to be Drug free, no criminal background, with a verifiable background going back at least 10 years plus some have to have specialized skills and lisences.​

 

[RV4]

Speaking of Arenas:


American Airlines is seeking some relief from the $5 million annual payments it makes to Center Operating Co., which runs the American Airlines Center.
Airline officials declined to say what is being requested, but a spokesman said the company is reviewing all agreements and contracts with vendors, suppliers and other key stakeholders.
The airline signed an agreement in 1999 to have its logo, name and images placed throughout the home of the Dallas Stars and Dallas Mavericks. The ownership groups of both teams control Center Operating Co.
The deal called for American to make 30 annual payments of $5 million. The first payment was made in 2001 when the center opened; there are 27 years left on the deal.
Brad Mayne, president and chief executive of the operating company, said American made a request to restructure the naming rights deal for the facility.
In response, he said, "We made a general proposal late last week and we haven''t heard back from them yet. We''re waiting with bated breath to hear what they have to say."

 

[Bob Owens]

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On 4/3/2003 5:55:43 PM FA Mikey wrote:

And bob was over on their board cheering them on for full pay til the last day. Turns out he not to popular over on the UAL board either.

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Maybe not but apparently the majority of the mechanics agreed with me. They voted NO. So will we.​

 

[Bob Owens]

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On 4/3/2003 6:54:52 AM FA Mikey wrote:

You are not just taking your chance''s you will force every other employee threw the same drama of BK. You will lose more than 20,000 and you will see permanent cuts and more draconian work rule changes.

Its hard to understand the mentality of someone unable to make change in there own organization. Who believes a BK court judge will save him drastic permanent cuts.

When AA puts forward there next round in the court room. Its TWU against the AA lawyers and all the creditors wanting some payment.

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Like I said before, if you like you can give my share and keep my equity stake. You sound like the company. If all this is so definite then why hasnt it happened at UAL yet.

If we go into BK then the company can get out of a lot of other things before they come to us. Things like having their name on sports arenas, leased cars for executives etc.

Are you an APFA official? If AA gets these concessions it increases the likelyhood that UAL will liquidate. How many more members do you figure the APFA will get if that happens?​