stop the outsourcing?

[topDawg]

What is the number of m/l flights required to determine if a station is staffed with contractors, I just find it hard to believe that CLT is a contract station, there are 5 m/l on the gates every night, plus at least two on the hardstand...

its up to Delta. they don't have a rule. 
 
How the rampers at Delta Air Lines are happy with stations like CLT and SAN being outsourced I do not know..... Of course I have yet to see a union who would do anything about it anyways. 

 

[blue collar]

you do realize he has basically opened up the Mexico border right? With him doing that he is forcing people like the above onto companies, and then trying to tell them to pay them more. Then they vote in his parties favor. 
 
And they should be fighting the min. wage proposal. Its complete crap to think someone flipping burgers at burger king would make 10 an hour. 
 
You can b*tch and b*tch about contracting all you want, but your beloved unions are just as much to blame. Example, the POS the IAM just signed over at UA allowing them to basically ship out all of there ramp work......... 

I wasn't aware that he basically opened up the border, at least I won't have to deal with showing ID next time I'm coming back from Nogales/TJ. I also wasn't aware he was forcing companies to hire all of the immigrants. I feel so bad for them being forced to drop their hiring standards.

On a serious note- the IAM negotiated a total POS at UA. Ultimately the membership ratified it, and it's on them; but IAM put on their razzle dazzle show to sell it based on wages only. 'Scope? Why ask about scope? Here, check out this wage we got you!!' I don't know how informed the membership was when they ratified it.

 

[700UW]

And yet the IAM/US CBA is far superior than the UA CBA, the IAM is one mainline flight a day and it has to be staffed upon the next station review period.
 
And now this:

 

[southwind]

Didn't realize it's the presidents fault that companies are hiring people at $8/hr. That must be why so many are fighting the $10/hr min wage proposal..

 
guess you can still learn something new everyday!

 

[WorldTraveler]

its up to Delta. they don't have a rule. 
 
How the rampers at Delta Air Lines are happy with stations like CLT and SAN being outsourced I do not know..... Of course I have yet to see a union who would do anything about it anyways.

because employees are concerned about their job - those cities weren't and haven't been DL staffed BW stations for years.

DL employees like others are interested in what happens with their jobs and DL has done as good as or better than average job of protecting DL employee jobs.

The sole reason why AA is "insourcing" airport work now is because they are grossly overstaffed and insourcing is an easier process than laying off people.

They may hold onto that work long term but it is a given that AA's overall staffing will come down; their labor costs were up well above the industry average - along with WN. AA cannot sustain that kind of personnel cost growth. For now, the short term growth is to tolerate some cost creep... but UA did the same thing until the cost creep made them significantly uncompetitive - and $100K per person and $200 million per workgroup packages have to be initiated.

The biggest indicator of how much insourcing or outsourcing will be done is the fleet plan; flat domestic mainline growth and the replacement of older aircraft is a strong indication of little overall growth in the size of the mainline workforce.

Fortunately for DL employees, the mainline fleet is growing and DL is using its maintenance capabilities to operate a predominantly "out of warranty" fleet.

 

[Kev3188]

 

its up to Delta. they don't have a rule.

...Which itself is a big problem...
 

How the rampers at Delta Air Lines are happy with stations like CLT and SAN being outsourced I do not know.....

 
They aren't.


 

because employees are concerned about their job - those cities weren't and haven't been DL staffed BW stations for years.

It hasn't been that long.
 
 
 

The sole reason why AA is "insourcing" airport work now is because they are grossly overstaffed and insourcing is an easier process than laying off people.

They already have PMUS employees in those cities. Why pay a vendor when you can do the work yourself?

 
 

Fortunately for DL employees, the mainline fleet is growing and DL is using its maintenance capabilities to operate a predominantly "out of warranty" fleet.

Great. And when that translate into a real, net growth of benefitted ACS jobs at DL, be sure to let us know...

 

[topDawg]

because employees are concerned about their job - those cities weren't and haven't been DL staffed BW stations for years.
clearly not, do you understand how seniority works? 
DL employees like others are interested in what happens with their jobs and DL has done as good as or better than average job of protecting DL employee jobs.
back on the drugs again eh?
The sole reason why AA is "insourcing" airport work now is because they are grossly overstaffed and insourcing is an easier process than laying off people.
what a hot bunch of horse s**t. AA isn't going to add a ton of cost just so they don't have to lay people off. 
They may hold onto that work long term but it is a given that AA's overall staffing will come down; their labor costs were up well above the industry average - along with WN. AA cannot sustain that kind of personnel cost growth. For now, the short term growth is to tolerate some cost creep... but UA did the same thing until the cost creep made them significantly uncompetitive - and $100K per person and $200 million per workgroup packages have to be initiated.

The biggest indicator of how much insourcing or outsourcing will be done is the fleet plan; flat domestic mainline growth and the replacement of older aircraft is a strong indication of little overall growth in the size of the mainline workforce.

Fortunately for DL employees, the mainline fleet is growing and DL is using its maintenance capabilities to operate a predominantly "out of warranty" fleet.

You keep saying that, but how has that benefited anyone below wing at Delta?
 
and No, AAR, HEACO, ST aeropace and AeroMexico is using its maintenance capabilities to help Delta operate a out of warranty fleet.  
 

 

...Which itself is a big problem...
 
 
They aren't.


 

It hasn't been that long.
 
 
 



They already have PMUS employees in those cities. Why pay a vendor when you can do the work yourself?

 
 



Great. And when that translate into a real, net growth of benefitted ACS jobs at DL, be sure to let us know...

ahem or maintenance jobs that aren't contractors or Mexico/China  

 

[WorldTraveler]

give me a list of the number of mainline staffed stations that AA, DL, and UA had at the time of the merger (including merger partners) and what they have now and it will be very apparent that DL employees have indeed faired better.

And the BW only distinction is meaningless because DL absolutely allows qualified staff to move between workgroups with no loss of pay or seniority - something that is non-existent at many union airlines.

and yes, AA is absolutely increasing their labor costs in order to avoid laying off employees as a result of the merger. IN the last quarter's earnings release, they increased labor costs by 10.2% and employees grew by 2.6% on a consolidated YOY basis - faster the rate of growth of RPMs.

 

[Kev3188]

 
 

give me a list of the number of mainline staffed stations that AA, DL, and UA had at the time of the merger (including merger partners) and what they have now and it will be very apparent that DL employees have indeed faired better.

People bounced from CLT & SAN might disagree with that...

And the BW only distinction is meaningless...

...Not when the discussion about insourcing revolves around BW work at AA...

 

[WorldTraveler]

and tell me when since 7.5 which was nearly 20 years ago happened that happened...


as for BW vs. consolidated ACS ranks at DL, it is precisely because there are many DL employees who have shifted from BW to AW and remained in their current station that the issue is just not as big as you want to make it out to be.

how about you give us an updated list of how many cities that DL has AW agents in and then compare that to the number of locations where AA or other airline employees can move between AW and BW without loss of seniority or pay/benefits.

the reality is that DL's unified non-union ACS workgroup has given employees flexibility to retain their positions and/or locations that other airlines cannot match. Even among those who were impacted by 7.5, many went to a res office in order to remain in their city, often only to return years later.

A current high level mgmt. person in a PMNW hub was bumped by 7.5 and went to res only to return to ACS and restarted her/his climb up the ACS ranks including the usual moves to other locations.

a non-union workforce provides flexibility that was true in 7.5 and is still true today.

 

[Kev3188]

 

ahem or maintenance jobs that aren't contractors or Mexico/China

Bring it. The more AMT's across the system, the better!

 

[Kev3188]

 

and tell me when since 7.5 which was nearly 20 years ago happened that happened...

'06 or '07...

 

[WorldTraveler]

'06 or '07...

of course... at the same time that NW closed ?? stations to mainline personnel.

 

[700UW]

Explain how if they are overstuffed that they are recalling US, AA employees then will be hiring off the street to staff the insourced work? Once again don't let the facts get in your way!

 

[WorldTraveler]

Explain how if they are overstuffed that they are recalling US, AA employees then will be hiring off the street to staff the insourced work? Once again don't let the facts get in your way!

overstuffed or overstaffed? that is priceless.

someone stayed out too late at the AA party last night.

the DL - IAM parties involve far less rollicking. Just a sober stare and "is this really it...? we're in deep ..."