SJU lays off 400

[aapitbull]

Perhaps, but the premise still stands -- all of their fleet is encumbered. They own nothing, therefore have nothing to sell at fire-sale pricing.

The 330 is in demand, and there aren't a lot of white-tails at the moment. If US collapses, the mortgage holders or lessors will simply take possession, and fly them to Europe or Asia where they'll be able to get a better return.

Regardless, I doubt AA will order anything without either an extension or a new agreement with the pilots.

Fellows this is a interesting debate but I think you forget that AA is getting ready to install winglets on the 767 that will decrease fuel consumption by at least 4 to 5%. I dont think any new aircraft to replace the 767 is in the plans until they order 787 or A350 because both of these aircraft will have similar advantages over the A330 that the A330 has over the 767 without winglets. Why trade one problem for another 3 years down the line.

 

[777 fixer]

Fellows this is a interesting debate but I think you forget that AA is getting ready to install winglets on the 767 that will decrease fuel consumption by at least 4 to 5%. I dont think any new aircraft to replace the 767 is in the plans until they order 787 or A350 because both of these aircraft will have similar advantages over the A330 that the A330 has over the 767 without winglets. Why trade one problem for another 3 years down the line.

Exactly, why add another aircraft type to the fleet that is technically obsolete when compared to the 787 and A350.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

OK Gents,.............."You've sold me" !!

 

[MCI transplant]

Fellows this is a interesting debate but I think you forget that AA is getting ready to install winglets on the 767 that will decrease fuel consumption by at least 4 to 5%. I dont think any new aircraft to replace the 767 is in the plans until they order 787 or A350 because both of these aircraft will have similar advantages over the A330 that the A330 has over the 767 without winglets. Why trade one problem for another 3 years down the line.

<_< ------ pitbull, We're doing the 767 winglet "proto-type" aircraft here at MCIE, and from what I've seen, and heard, of it so far, it'll be at least a year before the first one goes into revenue flight!

 

[WHISPERJETT]

Kind of hard to drive a school bus from SJU to MIA; unless they decide to emulate their Cuban brothers; but why would they do that when they can arrive by non-revving in first class. And who says MIA will be open, maybe they will have to go to JFK. It looks like they will be junior to me but even if they are not I have no problem with it. If some are senior to me that means they were hired by American Airlines before I was and they have the legal right to enter and work in the US without a passport or visa (The US invaded PR and gave/forced US citizenship to/on them). What I would have a problem with is someone who steals my seniority by using their seniority that they had at a dead/failed/liquidated/bankrupt company. If I were you I would be concerned about my own future prospects at AA; along with the rest of your fellow TWAers (who knows maybe one of those Puerto Rican AMTs will bump you or another TWAer out of MCI and onto the street). TWAers are still at or near the bottom of the lists with no protection and limited bumping opportunities and in the case of the F/As no severance pay. Don't you think AA is drooling at the thought of laying off the topped out F/As at the bottom of the list with no severance and laying off ramp, AMTs, etc. with little or no bumping opportunities in the hope that they will just retire? Remember this SJU cut back is just the beginning. But you need not worry about me, I will be just fine but thanks for your concern.

The TWA folks were screwed enough by AA.....awh I forgot, it;s all about you...former EA...PI..now US>>>

 

[WHISPERJETT]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

("Earth..calling eolesen,...................come in.....E " !!) :unsure: :unsure:

LLC ain't gonna need SH!T, if they ..."GO in the CRAPPER"

LLC is in better shape than you think....while not the best carrier, they are no more CRAPPY than AA,DL, NW,and less CRAPPY than UA...

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

LLC is in better shape than you think....while not the best carrier, they are no more CRAPPY than AA,DL, NW,and less CRAPPY than UA...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Is that a fact !!

Well from what I hear, the..."HOMIES".. h34r: h34r:...who are RUNNING the PHL Ramp, are a "sight to behold",.......unequaled anywhere Industrywide

 

[MCI transplant]

The TWA folks were screwed enough by AA.....awh I forgot, it;s all about you...former EA...PI..now US>>>

<_< ------ WHISPERJETT, aa was just flappen he's jaws! The only way any nAAtive could bump into MCI is if he had at least 20 + years Seniority! MCI, and STL, were the two stations Kasher ruled had 100% of their former TWA seniority. And if he wanted to "bump" me, he'd need, at least, 40. -------- Not gona happen!!!!

 

[Hopeful]

<_< ------ WHISPERJETT, aa was just flappen he's jaws! The only way any nAAtive could bump into MCI is if he had at least 20 + years Seniority! MCI, and STL, were the two stations Kasher ruled had 100% of their former TWA seniority. And if he wanted to "bump" me, he'd need, at least, 40. -------- Not gona happen!!!!

You better hope they don't finally close MCI regardless of the "deal" they made with local officials during the buyout. Your 40 years seniority, 33 of which are pure TWA time, will mean nothing when they move MCI work to TULSA.....Can you say 4/10/01?

And please don't say they can't shut down MCI because of the "deal"...all it takes is a trip to bankruptcy court and it's BYE BYE MCI!

 

[MCI transplant]

You better hope they don't finally close MCI regardless of the "deal" they made with local officials during the buyout. Your 40 years seniority, 33 of which are pure TWA time, will mean nothing when they move MCI work to TULSA.....Can you say 4/10/01?

And please don't say they can't shut down MCI because of the "deal"...all it takes is a trip to bankruptcy court and it's BYE BYE MCI!

<_< ------ Hopeful, no, I'm not going to say that! I've been though two bankruptcies already, and have a pretty good idea what it's like. Anything is possible, but frankly, "this time", I'm not too concerned about them closing down MCI!

 

[Hopeful]

<_< ------ Hopeful, no, I'm not going to say that! I've been though two bankruptcies already, and have a pretty good idea what it's like. Anything is possible, but frankly, "this time", I'm not too concerned about them closing down MCI!

Yes anything is possible and the thing with AA is that this time around the cuts and layoffs are gonna be big... Right now the company is analyzing every aspect of the operation,,,,on the table are the possibilities of closing the smaller stations and/or letting them go Eagle just to name one..

My point is, like u already said, anything is possible....But i don't think everyone realizes what is in store for all of us!

 

[MCI transplant]

Yes anything is possible and the thing with AA is that this time around the cuts and layoffs are gonna be big... Right now the company is analyzing every aspect of the operation,,,,on the table are the possibilities of closing the smaller stations and/or letting them go Eagle just to name one..

My point is, like u already said, anything is possible....But i don't think everyone realizes what is in store for all of us!

<_< ------ Hopeful, All I'll say on that, is I hope you don't work at AFW! But, yes! Anything can happen! And if they did shut us down, I've come to the point in my life where I have the luxury that I can retire! And would!

 

[aafsc]

The TWA folks were screwed enough by AA.....awh I forgot, it;s all about you...former EA...PI..now US>>>

TWAers were screwed by AA? Without AA they would have been on the street years ago with absolutely nothing. If anything AA saved them. The few thousand that are currently working for AA have top pay (among the legacies), are accumulating pension benefits in AA's plan; which could (after working a much shorter time span at AA than they did at TWA) be greater than what they receive from the PBGC (TWA), and they will get retiree medical, passes and other benefits. They also got to keep all their sick leave, vacation time, and severance pay calculated from their TWA seniority (except for F/As). Even those TWA people who retired before AA bought the assets get medical and passes from AA. Since the transaction, TWAers have been able to retire with benefits; because of AA and the nAAtives. They are just pi$$ed because they could not use their extremely high TWA seniority to staple us nAAtives beneath them. As soon as the deal was done they were screaming DOH.

And yes, it IS about me and all the other nAAtives. We spent many years of hard work building AA and we were here long before the TWAers came in from their dead/bankrupt/failed company. AA does not control the seniority lists, the unions do and the union members of AA's unions made it perfectly clear to the union leadership that we did not want to be screwed by the TWAers. In the case of the TWU, of which I am a member, we went to BINDING ARBITRATION; just like your pilots at US. And like your pilots, they can't seem to comprehend the meaning of BINDING ARBITRATION.

 

[aafsc]

LLC is in better shape than you think....while not the best carrier, they are no more CRAPPY than AA,DL, NW,and less CRAPPY than UA...

Then why are your top tier customers defecting in droves to other legacies?

 

[MCI transplant]

TWAers were screwed by AA? Without AA they would have been on the street years ago with absolutely nothing. If anything AA saved them. The few thousand that are currently working for AA have top pay (among the legacies), are accumulating pension benefits in AA's plan; which could (after working a much shorter time span at AA than they did at TWA) be greater than what they receive from the PBGC (TWA), and they will get retiree medical, passes and other benefits. They also got to keep all their sick leave, vacation time, and severance pay calculated from their TWA seniority (except for F/As). Even those TWA people who retired before AA bought the assets get medical and passes from AA. Since the transaction, TWAers have been able to retire with benefits; because of AA and the nAAtives. They are just pi$$ed because they could not use their extremely high TWA seniority to staple us nAAtives beneath them. As soon as the deal was done they were screaming DOH.

And yes, it IS about me and all the other nAAtives. We spent many years of hard work building AA and we were here long before the TWAers came in from their dead/bankrupt/failed company. AA does not control the seniority lists, the unions do and the union members of AA's unions made it perfectly clear to the union leadership that we did not want to be screwed by the TWAers. In the case of the TWU, of which I am a member, we went to BINDING ARBITRATION; just like your pilots at US. And like your pilots, they can't seem to comprehend the meaning of BINDING ARBITRATION.

<_< ----- Hello aa! It seems most people have you pegged!----- Oh, I'm always grateful for what I get! But make no mistake about it! What I get is what I've earned! ------ Our retirement with AA started in 2002! One year "after" the merger/buyout! The first year, we were still TWAllc. And were not credited towards retirement! So you see, whatever retirement we receive from AA is "earned", not given! And that my friend, was part of the "BINDING" in "ARBITRATION!" That's the main reason I'm not too concerned about a large RIF here at MCI this time. We "earn" our keep! And AA recognizes that! And friend, that's the best protection you can have!!!! But!---- Like the man said, "anythings possible!"