OT: WN ANNOUNCES NEXT CITY

[WorldTraveler]

you really did get stuck in jr. high didn't you. Because normal people dropped that kind of talk decades ago.

This isn't about DL. It's about UA. The two are completely separate entities marking their own future. All I'm saying is that UA has rec'd the real competition that I predicted would happen in its hubs as soon as it exited bankruptcy. Only SFO has yet to be hit but it will come. And meanwhile, UA employees refuse to recognize the severity the threat and mock the competition - as well as those that predict danger ahead.

And remember that UA said they weren't planning to build a big station at PHL. Counted how many flights they have now?

 

[mga707]

deleted by poster

 

[ClueByFour]

swa'S BREAD AND BUTTER is the business traveler??

Yeah, the one whose business is to ask his brother for 50 bucks for a weekend in vegas....
Good One!!!

JBG

It's not Maw and Paw Kettle on the DAL-HOU runs.

Or OAK/SJC-LAX. Or PIT-PHL.

Reality check at 11.

 

[USFlyer]

The reason why WN will do well in IAD is because fares are so high that passengers will either flock to WN or UA will have to match dollar for dollar and watch the revenues flow as fast as the jet fuel out of the storage tanks at ORD on a Friday afternoon.

Huh? Fares out of IAD are usually quite reasonable, even after Indy Air folded.

 

[KCFlyer]

So what is it, is SWA a liesure no cost no frill carrier, or are they trying to be everything to everyone??

Tell me oh great business mind...

JBG

Okay, I'll tell you...Southwest started out offering frequent flights between cities at a decent price. Started out in Texas, between Dallas, Houston and San Antonio. Offered pretty much hourly flights between them. A business person in Dallas who needed to see a client in Houston could buy a ticket, go, then come home that night. For a very reasonable price. For 30 something years, Southwest has never wavered...frequent flights between cities for a reasonable price. They never offered an airport club...they never offered a first class cabin...they never went international...they never had some program that gave "elite" flyers any different service than the first timer. Now let's look at your airline...catering to the international traveller...catering to the first class passenger...catering to the leisure traveller...starting up a whole new "carrier within a carrier" to capture that leisure market. Now....you tell me, who is trying to be everything to everyone, and who is saying "we are what we are"? O mighty and knowing UAL pilot?

 

[WorldTraveler]

Huh? Fares out of IAD are usually quite reasonable, even after Indy Air folded.

According to DOT data, UA's average fares at IAD are higher than just about every other major NE market. Low fare carriers are attractive to those high average fares, esp. in markets where there is high traffic volumes which will only increase dramatically with low fares.

 

[Bear96]

WT

Don't you have some spinning to be doing on the DL board? Like maybe telling everyone how great everything is going at (insolvent) DL on the eve of the imminent historical Great Pilots Strike of 2006?

 

[Deleted by Moderator]

Wouldn't the best way to recover from the horrific downfall of the airline industry be to raise the fares? Would lowering the fares for no apparent reason be good business? Are we in business to give away tickets? Will you dig a hole and move in if the pilot strike destroys your reason to live?

Please enlighten us Mr KoolAid drinker.


***looking forward to a novel in the very near future***

 

[SPG Trvlr]

you really did get stuck in jr. high didn't you. Because normal people dropped that kind of talk decades ago.

This isn't about DL. It's about UA. The two are completely separate entities marking their own future. All I'm saying is that UA has rec'd the real competition that I predicted would happen in its hubs as soon as it exited bankruptcy. Only SFO has yet to be hit but it will come. And meanwhile, UA employees refuse to recognize the severity the threat and mock the competition - as well as those that predict danger ahead.

And remember that UA said they weren't planning to build a big station at PHL. Counted how many flights they have now?

SFO was hit by SWA and what happened????They moved to OAK.

 

[ClueByFour]

SFO was hit by SWA and what happened????They moved to OAK.

IAD is not nearly as operationally constrained.

 

[Deleted by Moderator]

Starting to look as though SWA is getting desperate. They are now entering markets that they never would have gone to 10 years ago. As their hedges disappear and their costs increase serving markets such as this, it should be interesting how that affects their bottom line.

IAD is a highly international jumpoff spot for United which may prove to be a stumbling block for SWA if their intention is to knock UAL out.

 

[ELP_WN_Psgr]

Starting to look as though SWA is getting desperate. They are now entering markets that they never would have gone to 10 years ago. As their hedges disappear and their costs increase serving markets such as this, it should be interesting how that affects their bottom line.

IAD is a highly international jumpoff spot for United which may prove to be a stumbling block for SWA if their intention is to knock UAL out.

I don't think Southwest's goal is to knock anyone out. That's never been their modus operandi. Strangely enough, they operate an airline company in an effort to make money for their shareholders. I know it's a bizarre concept, but what the heck.

I don't look at the current expansions into unfamiliar territory as some sort of desperate act. I see it as the culmination of a pretty decent strategy.

Before you take on the big airlines at the big airports, make sure you are a big airline too with deeper pockets than anyone else.

Make sure you have a diverse route network so that bad economic times in one region of the country do not translate into an absence of profits. This widespread route netw ork helps avoid "putting all the eggs in one basket" and makes it much harder for a competitor to target you.

To me, Dulles is nothing more and nothing less than exactly what they did in Los Angeles, the Bay Area, and Boston. If you want to avoid putting all your eggs in the one basket, surround the basket. No DCA? Do BWI + IAD. No BOS? Do PVD + MHT. No SFO? Do really well at SJC and OAK.

You do realize, I'm sure, that in the big scheme of things SFO is less significant. OAK-LAX is a 3330 psgr per day market, whereas SFO-LAX is only 1931 psgrs per day. Heck, San Jose to El Lay (2030 psgrs per day) is bigger than SFO to LAX.

What I really expect is for us to see more, rather than less, of Southwest's incursions into fortress hubs over the next 10-12 yrs as we wait for Boeing to build the 90 seat airplane that has a CASM like the 737NG. It's going to take that sort of airplane for Southwest to start going to the Pensacolas, Fresnos, Laredos, and Knoxvilles of our country.

 

[JungleClone]

Not much damage? How do you figure? Yes, UA will be forced to match WN's lower fares, which will eat into any decent yields UA was enjoying with the demise of Independence Air. Sure, two gates may not seem like much. But WN are as good as anyone at gate utilization. And they'll tack on several more gates as time goes by. This is not good news for UA. This is the second UA hub that WN has set-up shop in. They're firing a shot across the bow for sure. But this move has more to do with WN's shifting strategy. No longer can they afford to launch service to smaller, second-tier cities. That's because the revenue streams simply aren't enough to offset rising costs. Not anymore. So they're forced to enter into bigger metropolitan markets. While those airports may be more costly to operate in, they also allow WN to tap into a considerably larger revenue stream. Look for more of these moves from WN going forward. UA had better get the dancing shoes on.

 

[mrman]

swa'S BREAD AND BUTTER is the business traveler??

Yeah, the one whose business is to ask his brother for 50 bucks for a weekend in vegas....
Good One!!!

JBG

I suggest you check out DAL, HOU, MCI, MDW, LAX, on a week day. I think you will differ from your opinion. WN attracts the business traveler with frequent service, no hub connections (most flights are non stop), free booze, no RJ, overhead space and more leg room. If I am flying Dallas I am going WN to avoid the RJ experience. What you have to understand in today's world most flights are now RJ with low frequency. WN uses 737 and has high frequency, no change fee, and utilization of non refund fares for other flights. WN largest customer base is the business traveler, many of who have a legacy bad taste in the mouth over being raped by last minute $1000 walk up fares

Huh? Fares out of IAD are usually quite reasonable, even after Indy Air folded.

Really, has United locked walkup fare to around $300

 

[Deleted by Moderator]

Haven't heard much 'hoopla' since they entered DIA and bet the same will go for IAD. A few years back they avoided airports like these simply because of the costs. This can't be a good thing for them.

How many years ago did United run them out of Denver? Will they this time or will LUV figure out how to make money there now that Frontier has shown Denver a more presentable LCC?