More On Concessions

[openview]

the 6 mil in bonuses was not just a vp's gift as its always said or stated here but for all mgmt levels and can be justifiable. Mgmt isn't just the handful of vp's but is the contract manager, the electrical engineer, the station mgr, the legal specialist, the web designer, the HR administrator, the IT programmer etc. and on and on.

But, the 15 mil each for 2 people to walk out the door is nothing short of a crime.

 

[ktflyhome]

Openview: Did you just put that last sentence in your post to appear to be friendly?

Why don't you give us more details as to exactly where and to whom the 6million went to???? More specifics Please!!! <_<

 

[openview]

Not trying to appear friendly just presenting a reality to a too often one-sided, close minded view that any bonus given is reason for rage and headline producing spite from the unions. It totally pisses me off that wolf & RG left with 30 mil. Its excessive and abusive. But bonuses are a necessary part of any sucessful business to attract and keep the right people. Take some electrical engineer, or IT architectural programmer, or any other highly skilled position in mgmt that busted his or her ass to get their bachelors and maybe masters in that field, maybe incurred 150k or more in schools loans doing so then gained a few years expertise in that field-they're not going to stick around year after year without bonuses at some point, let alone take pay cut after pay cut just because the guy on the ramp say is asked to. They're going to leave. It often doesn't matter if they're working for GE or AT&T or Delta as long as the pay is competative. So without bonuses some co. like jetblue says well take that engineer that US spent the time, money and resources to train and get experience, pay him his pay & bonus and know he'll step right into the position and start producing. Then US has to go out and try and recruit, train, wait till this new inexperienced person learns the job all over again whichs takes years some times and hope he produces long enough to recoup the investment. Its a cost of doing business.

 

[ktflyhome]

I can't imagine JetBlue or any other Airline wanting any of our Senior Managment. :blink:

 

[MarkMyWords]

KT -

That is where you are getting confused. Openview was trying to express that the bonuses weren't strictly for VP's and Directors. They were to keep lower level managers too. Everything from Base Managers to Station Managers.

 

[Dea Certe]

I have no problems with bonuses being given, when they are merited. My gripe is that doling out bonuses while the corporation is losing money and the grunts are getting paycuts.

KT, all those senior executives are buddies. It's a revolving door for them. UAIR has former NWA, CAL and other airlines. Believe me, they all have escape hatches and other rabbit holes to pop into when the going gets rough. Golden Parachutes too, usually. They have an association which in my mind is not much different than the "pools" railroad executives had back in the olden days. Let me to a little research and I'll see if I can find the name of it.

Dea

 

[Dea Certe]

And, here it is!

http://www.airlines.org/public/about/displ...ay1.asp?nid=978

Enjoy!

Dea

 

[openview]

the ATA is a group meant to represent all airline collectively - often even as a special interest group in congress

 

[ktflyhome]

Thanks for the info Dea, interesting.

MMM: Thanks for getting me Unconfused. I just have one questions. You stated that bonuses were given to lower leval managers too, such as Base Managers and Station Managers. Is there really that much of a call for those such jobs in the Industry today?? I mean are those "leval" jobs really being sought out by other Airlines?

Also, someone posted earlier today, I think, (can't find the post right now), that we (meaning) U could have gone back after the 30 million given to Wolfe and Gangwal, but our Management elected not to. Any light on this? :huh:

 

[usfliboi]

Usflyboi: You said been there done that. I don't believe you for one moment You have said in previous guotes that you are upwards of 15=17 years seniorty. If that be true...my son, then you know knowing of OPR. I know 15 year F/A's who <_< have NEVER been on Reserve. Go jump in a lake. Sorry, but you have no idea what you are talking about. <_<

You have no clue! Youlike to talk Ill give you that one. Been based in chlt since 1989 MY FRIEND and most of the time on resrve. You know, before you start barking about someone you dont know why dont you think. Been on opr many times ,some voluntary , was usually most senior and was an easy easy job considering I got a couple of hrs. Frankly I dont care whether you believe me or not! You see that lake? Are you confused still? Say something productive instead of childish insults!

 

[usfliboi]

Bob,


YES, I do know!

I'm a female. A more exposed gender who can experience rape, sexual harrassement, and assult. I am very well aware; I am in a mostly female profession. Everyone on these boards has either someone they know or has experienced one or all of the above.

You would have to take the word out of the English langugage and buy it to have the "rights" not to have anyone use these words in any other context than what you believe these words would be used.

Nothing any one says will minimise rape, homicide, insist, war. Just because folks come on this board and know of loved one or friend who has experienced any or all of the above, does not mean that no one can use the words anywhere in written form in anyother context than what that poster believes it should be used or not because of their own exposure in some horrific manner. This is a public forum.

I've said this before in previous posts, and I will say this again, stop with the sensitivity. If you folks have deeper problems with the above issues, then seek mental/behavioral health specialists. That's why they are there.

Sounds like your the one who needs the help PIT BULL! I get sick your insults and usually push report every time till they finally do something about your insults. Get a clue Im not the only one Either clean your act up or eventually you wont be on here !

 

[diogenes]

With the exception of a few stations, CSM's are a dime a dozen - no special education required.

If bonuses were based on a)his station's performance, and B) the company's profitability, ok.

But beyond the numbers that EMPLOYEE's produce, i.e. on-time performance, PAWOB's, customer complaints, etc., I am unaware of any metric the company measures CSM's by.

Please don't come back with the CSM causes those numbers, or is even chiefly responsible for making them happen. I know stations that were in between managers for months, and hit their DOT and budget numbers.

I also know of less than stellar managers that collected their $$, and laughed all the way to the bank.

See, at U, once you're in the club, you are IN. Barring pictures of the CSM en flagrante delicto with a goat, he/she is golden.

Ohh, and I know U had the opportunity to consolidate stations under one CSM, and didn't. Evidently, it is not essential to cut all costs, just labor's.

 

[delldude]

Bob,


YES, I do know!

I'm a female. A more exposed gender who can experience rape, sexual harrassement, and assult. I am very well aware; I am in a mostly female profession. Everyone on these boards has either someone they know or has experienced one or all of the above.

You would have to take the word out of the English langugage and buy it to have the "rights" not to have anyone use these words in any other context than what you believe these words would be used.

Nothing any one says will minimise rape, homicide, insist, war. Just because folks come on this board and know of loved one or friend who has experienced any or all of the above, does not mean that no one can use the words anywhere in written form in anyother context than what that poster believes it should be used or not because of their own exposure in some horrific manner. This is a public forum.

I've said this before in previous posts, and I will say this again, stop with the sensitivity. If you folks have deeper problems with the above issues, then seek mental/behavioral health specialists. That's why they are there.

Sounds like your the one who needs the help PIT BULL! I get sick your insults and usually push report every time till they finally do something about your insults. Get a clue Im not the only one Either clean your act up or eventually you wont be on here !

so you are the one....when you've backed yourself into a corner from posting illogical and uninformed information,your response in some type of perverted defense is to rat the other person out?
what comes around goes around,dude.

 

[TheLarkAscending]

PineyBob:

There are several definitions of the word rape. Not all definitions relate to an act of violence against one gender by another. Although I have the greatest empathy for any and everyone that has lived through this type of encounter, I will continue to use the word when deemed appropriate in given circumstances. I do not agree with war, and I am sure all human beings have suffered direct consquences regarding the aftermath of war, acts of violence, terrorism, robbery, homicide, et al. All of these words should and must be used when appropriate. Being a Libertarian, I'm rather shocked that you would choose to censor or govern over another poster's use of words regardless of their personal impact.

I'm deeply sorry about your personal experiences and sincerely hope that you and those around you continue to heal.

Peace

Lark

 

[AOG-N-IT]

Word Up Lark !!

I've heard enviromentalists use the word rape in context as to what's happening to our national forrests and all sorts of ecological references...The dumbing down or the hyper-sensitivity of todays society never ceases to amaze me.

The ones usually crying the loudest are the ones whom know no other way to get out or a corner in a debate. They tend to lash out by latching on to a particular word or phrase in an attempt to re-direct the actual subject matter at hand.

No Piney , I'm not singling you out in that statement either !!...I know you are smarter than that.