More On Concessions

[usfliboi]

OPR Been there done IT!!! Thank your union for that ! PITBULL!!! Please inform others on how many of these poor poor people who attended this meeting to inform you of their plight. This supports what i have said all alon. Most f/as either dont need money or they are addicted to the lifestyle that this job (used) to bring. I enjoy your name calling Bull its shows me your vocabulary possiblities. Can we move up a notch ? Maybe to the level of an adult?

 

[cavalier]

OPR Been there done IT!!! Thank your union for that ! PITBULL!!! Please inform others on how many of these poor poor people who attended this meeting to inform you of their plight. This supports what i have said all alon. Most f/as either dont need money or they are addicted to the lifestyle that this job (used) to bring. I enjoy your name calling Bull its shows me your vocabulary possiblities. Can we move up a notch ? Maybe to the level of an adult?

usfliboi this is for you and those like minded.

This was written by BoeingBoy and is well worth repeating because it really puts to rest any further arguments if one follows logic.

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Since we're playing "show and tell" with prospects of life without US Airways, I thought I'd share the view from my place in the pecking order.

Since I don't know where other posters fit in the pecking order, it is hard for me to compare my position to yours. The one exception is USA320Pilot - while I don't personally know him I do know where I sit relative to him.

Suffice it to say that I am significantly more senior. Likewise I am significantly closer to retirement (2 years 9 months, but who's counting). There is no way that I could start over (in or out of aviation) and come anywhere close to making what I will make if this company survives, even with further concessions. I certainly have sufficient reason to proclaim "Whatever it takes for the company's survival. Throw him overboard if it means keeping my job."

At this point there will be some of you that realize I haven't advocated more "giving" on this forum. Some of you may be thinking I'm about to change my tune. Let me assure all of you that I have not nor will not be advocating more concessions. Why? There are two basic reasons.

First can be called a sense of fair play. Too many people have given up what was asked, only to be furloughed, expressed, threatened with their jobs being outsourced, etc. Some will say that these things are just the way it is in corporate America today. My reply - that the existence of injustice does not justify injustice. After all, such things as assault, rape, and robbery exist but their existence does not make them right.

Second is the realization that further concessions will not save this company. Immediately before and during bankruptcy, we employees gave over $1 billion a year in concessions. The vendors, suppliers, leasers, etc gave about half that, resulting in $1.8 - $1.9 billion a year. What has that achieved - very little. Prior to bankruptcy, our CASM was 12.25 cents. Last quarter it was 11.70 cents. That's a whopping 4.5% reduction. To get to a 9 cent CASM through concessions would require 5 times what has already been given - over $9 billion. Since our total employee costs are only about half that, we cannot get there from here. If every employee worked for free, we would have CASM about 25% higher than WN.

So what is the answer to our conundrum? From where I sit, the tools for our survival are the same tools that have been in Dave's hands since he set foot on the property.

Take steps to increase revenue. Simplify the fare structure (as counterintuitive as that sounds), sell last minute upgrades to fc if seats are open, fly the airplanes more creating very low cost (how does under 5 cent CASM sound) seats to sell, etc.

Take steps to increase efficiency. Again, fly the airplanes more (either point-to-point or thru hubs), roll (depeak) the hubs to make them more efficient (and allow the airplanes to fly more), use the gates more frequently (by, guess what - flying the airplanes more), etc.

Until these tools (and others) are utilized, we are doomed. Throwing the employee's money and jobs at the problem will affect the timing, but not the outcome. Therefore, if given the chance, I will vote against any additional concessions. The extra months they might provide is not enough to salve my conscience.

 

[usfliboi]

I read it before! Thanks for the repostin. Some truth and some not. Great reading!

 

[BoeingBoy]

usfliboi,

Care to elaborate on what you consider not truth?

Jim

 

[hammerhead]

in usfiboi's defense, comparing concessions to rape is a little much.

 

[ktflyhome]

Usflyboi: You said been there done that. I don't believe you for one moment You have said in previous guotes that you are upwards of 15=17 years seniorty. If that be true...my son, then you know knowing of OPR. I know 15 year F/A's who <_< have NEVER been on Reserve. Go jump in a lake. Sorry, but you have no idea what you are talking about. <_<

 

[BoeingBoy]

Hammerhead,

You are correct - I was over the top there. My apologies to everyone.

Jim

 

[PITbull]

OPR Been there done IT!!! Thank your union for that ! PITBULL!!! Please inform others on how many of these poor poor people who attended this meeting to inform you of their plight. This supports what i have said all alon. Most f/as either dont need money or they are addicted to the lifestyle that this job (used) to bring. I enjoy your name calling Bull its shows me your vocabulary possiblities. Can we move up a notch ? Maybe to the level of an adult?

That would not be at your level, and your confusion would be worse.

 

[PITbull]

in usfiboi's defense, comparing concessions to rape is a little much.

hammer head,

How so?

What defense does he need?

There are many forms of rape. Expand on your thinking and you just might get it.

 

[PITbull]

Bob,


YES, I do know!

I'm a female. A more exposed gender who can experience rape, sexual harrassement, and assult. I am very well aware; I am in a mostly female profession. Everyone on these boards has either someone they know or has experienced one or all of the above.

You would have to take the word out of the English langugage and buy it to have the "rights" not to have anyone use these words in any other context than what you believe these words would be used.

Nothing any one says will minimise rape, homicide, insist, war. Just because folks come on this board and know of loved one or friend who has experienced any or all of the above, does not mean that no one can use the words anywhere in written form in anyother context than what that poster believes it should be used or not because of their own exposure in some horrific manner. This is a public forum.

I've said this before in previous posts, and I will say this again, stop with the sensitivity. If you folks have deeper problems with the above issues, then seek mental/behavioral health specialists. That's why they are there.

 

[BoeingBoy]

PitBull & PineyBob,

Pit,

Thanks for the defense, but I've already apologized. Let's just say including rape was a little insensitive.

Piney,

I take pokes at you and you take pokes at me - all in good fun I hope. I had forgotten that a certain subject is particularly sensitive to you. My apologies. I'll try to miss your eye with my future "pokes".

Jim

 

[Peeky]

Lest we forget that the bloodless "turnip" eeked out a mere $15 million in retirement for Gangwall and Wolf, and another $6 million in bonuses for VP's?? And that was at the same time every labor gave up a great deal to help save the airline. At this point in the game, whatever is going to happen with U is going to happen regardless of labor's participation.

 

[700UW]

It was $35 million to Messrs, Wolf, Gangwal and Nagin and $6 million in retention bonuses.

The $35 million could have be recovered by US in BK but they chose not too.

And as far as the $6 Million goes, US was taken on that, the current executives should pay US for their ineptness of running an airline.

 

[pitguy]

I suppose we should not use the word 'beaten' as in beaten down employees or 'death' such as in death of the airline. These words are used in more than one fashion. So what else is a person to do? We could go an and on about the various words and why someone would be offended by them. Such is life and nature of the beast is to complain.

I am sure no one here would mean to offend someone with the use of such words as they would not be able to know if someone would have had a history reason why not to like such word.

 

[delldude]

I suppose we should not use the word 'beaten' as in beaten down employees or 'death' such as in death of the airline. These words are used in more than one fashion. So what else is a person to do? We could go an and on about the various words and why someone would be offended by them. Such is life and nature of the beast is to complain.

I am sure no one here would mean to offend someone with the use of such words as they would not be able to know if someone would have had a history reason why not to like such word.

i think if you wish to get all touchy feely with the PC movement...beleagured and extinct come to mind.
i've been feeling "beleagured" as of late with the possibility that we may become "extinct" as a major carrier..
i work for a beleagured supervisor,my colleagues are begining to appear beleagured.....