Let them have it

[700UW]

I am going to ask this for the tenth time:

Please explain to me how is it worse to have insurance and have to wait then to have no insurance at all and not be able to see a dr and be gravely ill or die?

It seems all you anti-health care for everyone have failed to answer or explain this since I have asked it many times, I guess Jack Nicholson was right, you can't handle the truth

And if socialized medicine is such a failure why is it so succesful all over the world and if its sch a failre why hasn't it been scrapped?

 

[Dignity]

they are not going to be able to rush through universal or socialized health care.

they are attempting to do way too much during a period when the country is in a financial crisis.. for merely the sake...to have it.

the economy needs to stablize first.. IMO.

what about all the undocumented or those who are living here illegally, who may claim benefits yet contribute not one penny towards (not one cent at all) any taxes. are they to be included as well?

some should think this very carefully before attempting to get something just for the sake of..

getting it.

 

[Freedom4all]

I am going to ask this for the tenth time:

Please explain to me how is it worse to have insurance and have to wait then to have no insurance at all and not be able to see a dr and be gravely ill or die?

It seems all you anti-health care for everyone have failed to answer or explain this since I have asked it many times, I guess Jack Nicholson was right, you can't handle the truth

And if socialized medicine is such a failure why is it so succesful all over the world and if its sch a failre why hasn't it been scrapped?

Because for one, Obama's and the dems plan is for single payer. That means no alternative. Some of the other countries have alternatives and have had long periods of time work the system out. But theres still problems that remain. Sure our system have problems now, but what they are proposing is far from being a solution to it. You trading one problem for another with more then likely a worse result.

Look at Medicare and Medicaid, they are broke, and they are going to bring on another entitlement program? Who's going to pay for it? The rich? Well you can bet, on this pace with the dems that the amount of people with wealth will diminish as they strangles those that creates jobs in our country...and then guess whos going to front this entitlement boondoogle? You and me, the middle class. No thanks.

The only thing that made sense was the coop idea, where private companies can pool groups, so anyone can shop around for best plans and services. Competion and free enterprise will drive the the costs and availaibiluty for health care reform, not the government single payer idea.

BTW in google there was only 164,000 results for "socialized medicine success" and 162,000 for "socialized medicine horrors" so what does that tell you?

What it tells me is that its not the answer everyone is wanting.

 

[700UW]

Once again you failed to tell the board how having socialized medicine and having to wait is worse than not having insurance and not being able to get care which can lead making a illness worse or dying.

Why do you keep avoiding it?

And I don't see the health care systems in Europe and Canada broke? Canadians were paying 3% payroll tax to fund in the province where Ottawa was located.

The difference is health care in the US is for profit, not for getting people well, unlike socialized medicine where the goal is to get the patient healthy and not make Drs, drug companies and hospitals rich.

 

[Freedom4all]

Once again you failed to tell the board how having socialized medicine and having to wait is worse than not having insurance and not being able to get care which can lead making a illness worse or dying.

Why do you keep avoiding it?

And I don't see the health care systems in Europe and Canada broke? Canadians were paying 3% payroll tax to fund in the province where Ottawa was located.

The difference is health care in the US is for profit, not for getting people well, unlike socialized medicine where the goal is to get the patient healthy and not make Drs, drug companies and hospitals rich.

The answers are withing the search results you provided! You just choose to ignore them.

Or you choosing to ignore the data on canadian wait times? You don't find an issue with that? 120 days for an MRI? I just had one in 4 days! 45 days for a heart bypass? When my father was alive he had his within hours 24 hours of diagnoses!

People don't get well here? That's strange we have the best quality of care hands down, then any other country in the world. Unless you choose to believe some phoney film maker of course.

That quality in socialized medicine suffers, its even in the data provided by those countrys evidenced by your own supportive data via google! LoL

 

[700UW]

Once again you fail to comprehend, two never saw Moore's film, three I lived it with my son's cousin who had no insurance.

Simply amazing that you can't admit socialized medicine is better than having no insurance, my 12 year old can understand that, apparently you can't.

If you have no insurance by the time you are sick enough and broke enough to get treatment its too late.

 

[Freedom4all]

Once again you fail to comprehend, two never saw Moore's film, three I lived it with my son's cousin who had no insurance.

Simply amazing that you can't admit socialized medicine is better than having no insurance, my 12 year old can understand that, apparently you can't.

If you have no insurance by the time you are sick enough and broke enough to get treatment its too late.

Well if canada is the test for sucess, you will sooner die waiting for your free health care.

Look at some of the county hospitals where the poor go to for their free health care. People suffering from neglect, dieing in the waiting rooms, the staff could care less and let's you rot in your own feces. That's what your free health care looks like. Send your 12 year old to that, not for mine.

Like I said, a coop free market, no goverment run system I support, but a single payer, no way.

 

[700UW]

The Urban Institute estimates there are 27,000 deaths a year in the US because they lack health insurance.

Please go ask the families of those 27,000 people who have died if they would have like to have the Canadian Healthcare instead of having none and being dead.

Game, set and match.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/11/opinion/11krugman.html

 

[Freedom4all]

The Urban Institute estimates there are 27,000 deaths a year in the US because they lack health insurance.

Please go ask the families of those 27,000 people who have died if they would have like to have the Canadian Healthcare instead of having none and being dead.

Game, set and match.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/11/opinion/11krugman.html

Krugman liberal op-ed? Oh pah-lease.

Did you not consider the Cato article I referenced earlier?

Every year, shortages force Britain's National Health Service to cancel as many as 50,000 operations. Roughly 40 percent of cancer patients never get to see an oncology specialist.

Delays in receiving treatment are often so long that nearly 20 percent of colon cancer cases considered treatable when first diagnosed are incurable by the time treatment is finally offered.

And that's just referencing cancer patients only!

So do your math, percentage of the usa population (300 million plus) and your "27k". Then look at how more people in Britain statistically are dieing waiting on their free health care.

Numbers don't lie.

Game over son!

 

[700UW]

A study published in the New England Journal of Medicine estimates that over 100,000 people in the US die a year due to having no insurance:

http://monthlyreview.org/0903navarro.htm

 

[delldude]

President Obama admitted he wants the government to decide what health care Americans receive.

It's a scary picture the president paints. He stated that "the chronically ill and those toward the end of their lives are accounting for potentially 80 percent of the total health care bill out here." For them, he said, "I think that there is going to have to be a conversation that is guided by doctors, scientists, ethicists. And then there is going to have to be a very difficult democratic conversation that takes place. It is very difficult to imagine the country making those decisions just through the normal political channels."

Your time is up my friend............

 

[Freedom4all]

President Obama admitted he wants the government to decide what health care Americans receive.

Your time is up my friend............

President Obama admitted he wants the government to decide what health care Americans receive. "There's always going to be an asymmetry of information between patient and provider," he said. "And part of what I think government can do effectively is to be an honest broker in assessing and evaluating treatment options."

Exactly my point, this is horrifying to think that a government bureaucracy is going to choose whether I can have a treatment/procedure, etc. And yet people are blindly accepting that the gov public option best for them? It amazing how many people have their head in the sand.

 

[Freedom4all]

A study published in the New England Journal of Medicine estimates that over 100,000 people in the US die a year due to having no insurance:

http://monthlyreview.org/0903navarro.htm

Sorry those statistics are still far below whats happening with the single payer system in Britain and Canada. People are going to trade off dieing from no health care to dieing waiting for healthcare. How does that make any sense?

 

[700UW]

Prove to me by showing us real data from a country with a similar population that has socialized medicine.

I seriously doubt the number will even be close, funny it seems to be working and our health care sysytem is broken with almost 50 million americans with no coverage.

 

[Freedom4all]

Prove to me by showing us real data from a country with a similar population that has socialized medicine.

I seriously doubt the number will even be close, funny it seems to be working and our health care sysytem is broken with almost 50 million americans with no coverage.

That has already been proven to you multiple times already, even with the search data you provided, you just choose to ignore it.