JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[Tim Nelson]

I read in Jetnet yesterday that there is still more information to come on how cross utilization will play out. The Q and A was asked from a management perspective can they start cross utilization right away and the answer was no.

any additional cross utilization must be lettered. But some cross utilization already has been formalized and is active, including ORD. But imo it's always going to be with the 'less dominant' group at each station. MIA will never see it for LAA metal. Never.

 

[WeAAsles]

any additional cross utilization must be lettered. But some cross utilization already has been formalized and is active, including ORD. But imo it's always going to be with the 'less dominant' group at each station. MIA will never see it for LAA metal. Never.

There's a lot of rumor mill buzzing going on about us losing flights because there is an ongoing issue over landing and facility fees between AA and the MIA Airport board? I think Parker has that Crandall type personality that if MIA wants to play hard ball he wouldn't have any qualms about pulling a trigger and making MIA sorry for their possible choice of action.

But I haven't read anything that confirms any of this though?

We have been hiring like crazy though here and if they do reduce flights (even temporarily) I don't see them having a layoff right way again at least till the JCBA has been worked out. If true though we can expect OT to dry up like the Goby Dessert.

And I'm not even bringing up the softening of revenue to Latin America or the opposite of the CUBA flights we'll be getting soon enough.

 

[Kev3188]

Kev I know you gave an answer to the question but I was wondering if you could be clearer?

By rough estimate of percentages.

Full Time benefited employee =
Part Time benefited employee =
Ready Reserve non benefited employee =

I think you have benefited part timers right?
 

I answered earlier up the thread. We do have benefitted PTers, but not all too many. In my station, for example, there's 1...

 

[Racer X]

I agree. As far as the cross utilization, my reading the language highly suggest that it doesn't necessarily have to go both ways and is a protector for whichever group is losing the work. For instance, MIA, all of the lUS, at date of signing, now enjoy protections since LAA does the LUS bagroom. The same can not be said regarding LUS doing LAA work. MIA isn't the exception so I think the company will be able to pick and choose which group at each station. IMo it will lean towards protecting the 'lesser' group but who knows.

The language in the LOA states.....then station protection at that location is triggered for all eligible FT and PT Association represented employees..................I believe ''ELIGIBLE'' is also defined in LOA paragraph D....will apply only to those employees whose names appear on the applicable system seniority list as of the effective date of this agreement     [ 08/05/16 ]

 

[WeAAsles]

I answered earlier up the thread. We do have benefitted PTers, but not all too many. In my station, for example, there's 1...

Were you ever able to get a gauge on what those systemwide RR numbers were? We have 100% benefitted employees but as you can see from what Tim and NYer wrote, pretty high PT ranks as well.

We also have at least for the moment quite a few "disappointed" members here in MIA who thought they would be striking gold in 6 years total that now had another 5 tacked on to their time.

 

[WeAAsles]

The language in the LOA states.....then station protection at that location is triggered for all eligible FT and PT Association represented employees..................I believe ''ELIGIBLE'' is also defined in LOA paragraph D....will apply only to those employees whose names appear on the applicable system seniority list as of the effective date of this agreement     [ 08/05/16 ]

So at least until we know what the full details are if any member of management pulls a gaff and wants you to touch the other sides work. I suggest making sure you had a witness that the gaff took place, say ok and notify the union ASAP.

 

[Tim Nelson]

The language in the LOA states.....then station protection at that location is triggered for all eligible FT and PT Association represented employees..................I believe ''ELIGIBLE'' is also defined in LOA paragraph D....will apply only to those employees whose names appear on the applicable system seniority list as of the effective date of this agreement     [ 08/05/16 ]

You must be reading the wage opener by applying it exhaustively in a joint collective way. That would be incorrect. The wage reopener was not joint but was inserted into each separate contract and applies in the context of the twu contract for laa, and iam contract for lus.
 
In application, it not only remains consistent to have one metal cross utilized, as opposed to 2, but its also currently being applied that way.  I believe you are misinterpreting it and i am not convinced the language allows you to blanket the protection. Hopefully, you are correct and all 1,250 laa are now protected from laa in ord, not just 60 lus. 

 

[Tim Nelson]

So at least until we know what the full details are if any member of management pulls a gaff and wants you to touch the other sides work. I suggest making sure you had a witness that the gaff took place, say ok and notify the union ASAP.

+1
 
Im almost certain that scenerio will happen. Only by working closely with the twu local were we able to prevent this and give them the necessary information to win grievance payments. We simply have no authority to touch laa metal without formal written consent from the authorized management person to Lombardo.

 

[WeAAsles]

You must be reading the wage opener by applying it exhaustively in a joint collective way. That would be incorrect. The wage reopener was not joint but was inserted into each separate contract and applies in the context of the twu contract for laa, and iam contract for lus.
 
In application, it not only remains consistent to have one metal cross utilized, as opposed to 2, but its also currently being applied that way.  I believe you are misinterpreting it and i am not convinced the language allows you to blanket the protection. Hopefully, you are correct and all 1,250 laa are now protected from laa in ord, not just 60 lus.

Tim as I read it I also believe Racer X is correct. Any cross utilization performed in a station will automatically trigger basically a no layoff clause for those on the clock before the agreement was made.

Putting it this way. Management agrees that until a JCBA is reached determined by the details in that language and whether we pass it they will not make any staffing changes within our groups.

Again I don't suspect any displacements until after ratification anyway but this is just a fail safe agreement for that.

 

[cltrat]

we've been working LAA metal in CLT since pretty close to day one of this merger

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim as I read it I also believe Racer X is correct. Any cross utilization performed in a station will automatically trigger basically a no layoff clause for those on the clock before the agreement was made.

Putting it this way. Management agrees that until a JCBA is reached determined by the details in that language and whether we pass it they will not make any staffing changes within our groups.

Again I don't suspect any displacements until after ratification anyway but this is just a fail safe agreement for that.

The protection is very good as it not only protects against layoffs but it also protects against involuntary displacements, including being reduced to part time.

 

[NYer]

They won't have the complete dynamics of a fully merged airline until they reach a JCBA. Utilizing the cross utilization puts the company in a bind on overages if they wanted to say shrink a particular city and grow another. Let's take LGA as an example just because there are a lot of members on both sides. (Only an example) Say they cross utilize and then wanted to shrink there by 20% and move those flights to PHL. Well now LGA has an overage on headcount of 20% that can't be moved and PHL has to hire 20% more heads to cover the work. That leaves the company with X amount of heads systemwide that they don't need. The "Station Protection" being the trade off for cross utilization that keeps the company coming to the table.

And as I see it now. If say DFW management asks for a "favor" in any station even for one side just to push the other sides metal off the gate, cross utilization should take affect and trigger the station protection? And if the company balks at that notion it should be grieved and arbitrated if necessary.

Another reason I believe the company will continue to come to the table is Executive Compensation. To agree to the merger the secured creditors stated that Parker and the top executives would be compensated 20% less than their industry peers until ALL JCBA's were completed. Parker even stated in one roadshow that he's currently about 30% behind right now. Why would he even mention that if he wasn't just as interested in getting paid as anyone else?

Until we have complete agreements in place the company can't make all the moves it wants that also when they do probably will elevate the share price which we know will make Wall Street extremely pleased. (Also why I continue to be in a hold on the shares I own)

 
Let me see if I understand.
 
You believe the Company will have a need or desire to come to the table in order to get further advantages of the Merger. Correct?
 
Because we've been told it was the Company that wasn't dealing with the Association in good faith and they're the reason this process has taken as long as it has. You even posted a video from one of the Presidents to make that point. 
 
But AFTER they get an advantage of Cross-Utilization you believe now is the time they will be motivated to come to the table and get a deal done (in 4 months no less).
 
As far as Executive Compensation, those guys are making millions...tens of millions. Again, it hasn't rushed them before so it seems unsupported they will suddenly run to the table for a deal. The dynamics are play call for a longer trajectory to getting a JCBA.

 

[Kev3188]

Were you ever able to get a gauge on what those systemwide RR numbers were? We have 100% benefitted employees but as you can see from what Tim and NYer wrote, pretty high PT ranks as well.

We also have at least for the moment quite a few "disappointed" members here in MIA who thought they would be striking gold in 6 years total that now had another 5 tacked on to their time.

My earlier answer is still the same- a guess of 65/35. We don't have a system seniority list, so you'd have to do it station by station...

Edit: Maybe 60/40...

 

[WeAAsles]

Let me see if I understand.
 
You believe the Company will have a need or desire to come to the table in order to get further advantages of the Merger. Correct?
 
Because we've been told it was the Company that wasn't dealing with the Association in good faith and they're the reason this process has taken as long as it has. You even posted a video from one of the Presidents to make that point. 
 
But AFTER they get an advantage of Cross-Utilization you believe now is the time they will be motivated to come to the table and get a deal done (in 4 months no less).
 
As far as Executive Compensation, those guys are making millions...tens of millions. Again, it hasn't rushed them before so it seems unsupported they will suddenly run to the table for a deal. The dynamics are play call for a longer trajectory to getting a JCBA.

Who ever said that they weren't dealing with the Association in "good faith"? Of course they were going to try and extract out of us as much as they possibly could or the people they were paying wouldn't be doing their jobs.

But according to the updates they have improved on Articles in both contracts on at least 19 out of 21 off the top of my head. And as of the last count they've gone back and forth on at least 7 maybe 10 more articles? So those could be finished maybe soon as well which would bring it to 30 or 31 out of a possible 38 to 40 total articles by Aug, Sep? Two biggies being SCOPE and PT staffing still waiting in the wings. But the company has shown through the agents that they seem to want to bring jobs back in house maybe for better quality control and customer service which is really the only way the airlines are going to be able to compete with each other moving forward since pricing is pretty much in line with each other. And the company already has a plan to go after the LCC's with economy and economy plus pricing and seating.

And on Executive compensation yes they are making 10's of millions. Mainly of course by selling shares held in the former US before they expire and they have been accumulating more shares in AAL. Parker in particular choosing to be compensated in shares alone with no salary or contract now. My guess is even without a contract the BOD will still honor their commitment and bring him up to parity against his peers when the JCBA's are completed?

But yes, I believe this still "can" be completed by the end of the year and am placing a new bet that it will be. When the full synergies of the merger are able to move forward (and when the share buyback is completed) I believe they are going to make operational moves that will send the stock soaring up. Don't assume that just because people are making money now that they don't want to make maybe substantially more. Or maybe a speculation that with the deal for wages that was signed that there wasn't more to that?

I personally don't see a dragging out too much longer of this. Particularly like the worst of the glass half empty people think into Section 6 negotiations? I could be wrong but I just don't feel it. (Gut instinct)

 

[WeAAsles]

And before anyone comes back with a comment about a final deal being done behind the scenes. The Association formation itself was a deal done behind the scenes that no President or IAM AGC or members got to vote on. And now this wage deal was made behind the scenes but thankfully brought to our negotiators for a vote of acceptance which was given.

In the TWU (and I suspect the IAM as well) it's the International's who ultimately own the contracts. And in the TWU at least which is where I have my 21 years of experience they have done many dealings behind the scenes. The debate always being if those deals were really in the best interests of the membership or not?

And I'm certainly NOT saying anything is being taken out of the hands of our negotiators or ultimately us when we get to vote on a full JCBA.

Again I'm just floating out a gut instinct from personal experience and what has gone on so far with this merger.

(Remember when one day the CWA negotiators said they were at a standstill and the next day suddenly they had a deal)