JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[Tom Talbert 1888]

All of what you said is correct and then some,

However CWA/IBT had major leverage with weak representation at the negotiating and bargaining table and signed a concessionary rushed contact

How did you have major leverage when the majority weren’t working under a CBA?

 

[WeAAsles]

How did you have major leverage when the majority weren’t working under a CBA?

A little over 70% of the LAA group that had been unorganized prior were not protected under any CBA.

 

[WeAAsles]

If it's on the table, then there should be a price tag attached to it.

And if there's a price tag attached to it, the membership should see that. We used to get an "itemized" break down of items.

I don’t anticipate seeing something like that but it would be interesting.

We already know that we have at least 400Mil in improvements standing by out there for us since Parker said it at a recent Roadshow.

The improvements coming within the JCBA’s will far outweigh any “perceived” items lost due to harmonizing language from each other’s contracts.

And Kev trying to head this off at the pass the reason I said “perceived” items lost is because if economically as part of an overall CBA I went up in wages by $1000.00 per month but something else wound up costing me $200.00, I still come out with a net gain of $800.00 per month. (I can’t stand the ridiculous arguments this item tends to draw out)

 

[swamt]

If it's on the table, then there should be a price tag attached to it.

And if there's a price tag attached to it, the membership should see that. We used to get an "itemized" break down of items.

That is correct Kev. All proposals have cost. The NC should be well aware of said cost before any kind of pass or decisions are made. And Yes, the membership should be able to see it as well. I don't think either one of these two unions will allow it as they are not transparent enough. The NC should have to the penny what every single ask by co. and the union will cost and or be given up on the back and forths. Now the doom and gloom continues once again in the media for the company so maybe they are getting ready to pass some kind of final to the membership after the first of the year some time. But I have ran across 3 articles now that are starting to supply the co. efforts to subdue any kind of huge future raises for the mechanics, fleet and other groups left as stated in this article that they already gave them 22% thus far. Is it really 22%?

American Airlines pilots expose frailty of CEO's $1 billion labor bet

 

[ATD]

My inside informants tell me the LUS health plan is history in the new jcba.
If Weasy has the in on the twu then he knows and is playing politics.

 

[WeAAsles]

My inside informants tell me the LUS health plan is history in the new jcba.
If Weasy has the in on the twu then he knows and is playing politics.

If I know something and I chose not to spill the beans or maybe I’m asked in confidence not to spill the beans that means I’m playing Politics?

Anyway no this time I really don’t know anything about the LUS Medical. I was hoping it would at least go up over time to soften any blow to people who could get dramatic sticker shock if the change is from one year to the next?

I believe you have an inside informant and I believe you’re telling the truth (You’re not Nelson) Care to share more details here then?

 

[WeAAsles]

BTW off topic I know but Congratulations are in order to many who made this happen.

Go TWU.

 

[cltrat]

My inside informants tell me the LUS health plan is history in the new jcba.
If Weasy has the in on the twu then he knows and is playing politics.

if that really is the case then the LUS people deserves something for it

 

[WeAAsles]

if that really is the case then the LUS people deserves something for it

Agree. They should be eased over time into the higher cost. A signing bonus dedicated to defer some of that added expense would accomplish that goal.

Although again you have received around $7.00 per hour in increases prior to a JCBA being signed. That increase to your wages should honorably be at least considered in your thoughts.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

They did give the LUS FAs a bonus to make up for the difference for the first year.

No the increase shouldn’t be taken into effect.

It still increases their cost and reality it cuts into those increases.

So LAA in reality would be getting a bigger increase than LUS.

 

[NYer]

My inside informants tell me the LUS health plan is history in the new jcba.
If Weasy has the in on the twu then he knows and is playing politics.

There are some who are already trying to soften the blow by rationalizing the changes that seem to be coming. The rationalization is out of touch with the expectations the Members were given and the reality of the emotions will avail themselves when we see it in black and white.

The expectations given at the start and during this process will not meet the reality of the final document. If the proper expectation were set and the differences that needed to be overcome were addressed as we moved through this process there would have been a better chance of a more positive reaction.

As it stands, with little official information to go on, there have been many that have created their own expectation and that will certainly not be the reality we will eventually face.

The negotiators are working hard and making difficult choices, but the Members don't know what challenges they're facing and will not understand why some of the changes in language were made. It is unfortunate and hopefully, the emotions of the situation don't cloud the decision making when it is time to vote.

 

[WeAAsles]

They did give the LUS FAs a bonus to make up for the difference for the first year.

No the increase shouldn’t be taken into effect.

It still increases their cost and reality it cuts into those increases.

So LAA in reality would be getting a bigger increase than LUS.

It’s not a contest. We all want to get to the same goal post.

If anyone views it as a contest you only ultimately hurt your own personal bottom line and do yourself the disservice.

When a JCTA comes out you read it clearly with no distractions and decide if it works for you? If not you vote to send them back to the drawing board.

 

[swamt]

There are some who are already trying to soften the blow by rationalizing the changes that seem to be coming. The rationalization is out of touch with the expectations the Members were given and the reality of the emotions will avail themselves when we see it in black and white.

The expectations given at the start and during this process will not meet the reality of the final document. If the proper expectation were set and the differences that needed to be overcome were addressed as we moved through this process there would have been a better chance of a more positive reaction.

As it stands, with little official information to go on, there have been many that have created their own expectation and that will certainly not be the reality we will eventually face.

The negotiators are working hard and making difficult choices, but the Members don't know what challenges they're facing and will not understand why some of the changes in language were made. It is unfortunate and hopefully, the emotions of the situation don't cloud the decision making when it is time to vote.

NY'er, as I have stated about the outsourcing numbers, I honestly expect the same with the medical as well. I don't see them going full blown LUS medical, and I don't see them going full blown LAA medical. I see them meeting somewhere in the middle just like the outsourcing numbers i talked about earlier on. If anyones cost to rise for medical monthly, for cost out of pocket and yearly maxes it will be a concession to one side or the other. All raises given thus far has nothing to do with medical, and had everything to do with working each others metals, so don't let anyone tell you that that is an offset for the medical. Also someone posted that a bonus will offset it, it will not, a bonus is only a one time payout (usually used to buy into something) and the concessions of the changes in medical are on ongoing cost to the employees that will just continue to grow in the future, and for some with a lot of medical issues (usually the older crowds) it can be too costly that no bonus comes close to making up for it. I would hope that this asso. would fight like crazy to keep the LUS medical as it has been saved thru 2 BK's.
Not putting words in CB's mouth, but I do think he and I had a personal discussion not long ago and he said something about the medical will not be LUS or LAA that there will be changes, but he did not say the LUS medical was history as ATD is hearing. We will all see in the end. If they could keep the LUS medical that would be industry leading for medical aside from UPS's medical. If closer to the LAA medical not so sure if that would be industry leading.
The emotions will remain high, until the members get fully updated with all details, and then it might very well get even more emotional after they get the full blunt of changes coming to both sides. JMO.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

The road shows will explain it all NYer.

Your record player is broken.

You’ve stated your doom and gloom over and over and over.

It won’t change a thing.

Everyone should wait till the JCTA comes out in full after an agreement is reached.

Maybe your President of 568 should have taken the offer to be at the Negotiations.

 

[WeAAsles]

When the TA’s are voted on:

Fleet 72% Yes vote
AMT 58% Yes vote

Have a nice day. 🙂

Edit: Slap an off the hook buyout or great signing bonus in there and:

Fleet 92% Yes vote
AMT 83% Yes vote

Still have a nice day. 🙂