JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet. **New and improved 2.0 version**

[WeAAsles]

We will be reviewing key do uments at a meeting in late April, regarding the pension crisis.

Oops I think you broke one of your keys.

 

[WeAAsles]

I have and did with several positions ive held. But now i just focus on member rights and democracy and destroying the greed and nepotism before the iam dies.

Oh, Ah, Oh, Ah, Oh, Ah, Ok.

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Man I’m really getting to enjoy this ignore feature

Rat, it also works well in Spanish...

 

[WeAAsles]

Rat, it also works well in Spanish...

It works in Spanish as well...

Piedmont I hope you don’t mind but I just had to post this cause I was sitting on the bowl looking for a funny YouTube to hit the Kook with and I found this.

It’s just too funny to wait for Tim to post more weird chit tonight or tomorrow.

 

[PIEDMONT784]

What does that have to do with anything? Those are personal choices.
While we're talking about choices people make, lets talk about all the people in the company that choose to live unhealthy lives, never work out, abuse drugs and alcohol, smoke, eat all the wrong foods and super size every meal until they have to cart their arse around in a jazzy waiting for diabetes and the inevitable heart attack, they get to do so unencumbered.
The rest of us that do live as healthy as we can pay for the increased health insurance costs to cover their poor decisions.

I'll take the 401K over the failed IAMPF, it's not even a close call.
The contribution needs to be much higher than 5%, that isn't even close to where it needs to be.
The Flight Attendants got better language in worse economic conditions.

Any of those still trying to make the argument for the IAMPF , stop it, your arguing to save the Titanic.
It's in 2 pieces at the bottom of the ocean, that ship cannot be saved, nor should it be.
Now, let's get the contribution to where it needs to be for the 401K.

Let me connect the dots for you-- Airline Workers are comprised of a demographic that falls within the classification of "Average American". Over the last several decades Corporate America, which incidentally is a demographic that the Company falls within, has been unilaterally eradicating pension plans in lieu of the 401k.

Now, since almost half of the stated Average American demographic (Airline Workers included) fails to invest properly, or even at all... the Company (AA/LUS) escapes the entire cost of a once certain labor expense that they in the past incurred under pension plans. When a large percentage of workers do not invest, the Company simply pockets the match contribution, and escapes all administrative costs.

The 401k is essentially is a useless negotiated benefit if it is never used by the benefiting worker!
History has proven that many workers will NEVER use the benefit. This is the very reason Corporations lobbied Washington over the decades to eliminate defined pension plans to begin with... It saves them MONEY!

When the Negotiating Team accepts a compensation that may, or may not even be used -- we ALL lose by lowering the entire compensation equation value that was originally agreed upon. Thus, the ENTIRE Represented Group gets shortchanged, and not by f-ing "CHOICE"!

Understand?

>SPIT<

 

[cltrat]

P Rez I’m in it and oblivious I’m going to continue to be, where I have an issue is that if and I realize that is a big if it should not continue to be contributed to in a new deal then I feel very strongly that I should have the option to move my money to a 401 or whatever if it’s just going to be locked and not growing and worse could be subject to being cut

This must have gotten overlooked

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Piedmont I hope you don’t mind but I just had to post this cause I was sitting on the bowl looking for a funny YouTube to hit the Kook with and I found this.

It’s just too funny to wait for Tim to post more weird chit tonight or tomorrow.

Weez... what happened to the cartoon newbie dude speaking Spanish? Did he get the David Lee Roth boot... or the weez beeatch slap?

 

[cltrat]

Rat, it also works well in Spanish...

So I discovered

 

[WeAAsles]

Good news here in this article but still 21% are being left behind and that’s with an average company match of only 4.5%


“Employees put a record average of $5,850 into their 401(k)s over the past 12 months, a 4 percent increase from a year ago. Ninety-five percent of active employees contribute to their 401(k)s, and many defer enough of their pre-tax salary to get the average company match, which is 4.5 percent. But about 21 percent of employees can’t, or aren’t, contributing enough to get the full match. Many are likely to have been auto-enrolled into their 401(k) at a salary deferral rate of 3 percent, and left it there.”

http://fortune.com/2017/08/03/americans-record-highs-401k-balances/

 

[WeAAsles]

Weez... what happened to the cartoon newbie dude speaking Spanish? Did he get the David Lee Roth boot... or the weez beeatch slap?

Zero clue bro. I work in Meeami I know but I no comprende Espanol Compadre.

 

[737823]

Good news here in this article but still 21% are being left behind and that’s with an average company match of only 4.5%


“Employees put a record average of $5,850 into their 401(k)s over the past 12 months, a 4 percent increase from a year ago. Ninety-five percent of active employees contribute to their 401(k)s, and many defer enough of their pre-tax salary to get the average company match, which is 4.5 percent. But about 21 percent of employees can’t, or aren’t, contributing enough to get the full match. Many are likely to have been auto-enrolled into their 401(k) at a salary deferral rate of 3 percent, and left it there.”

http://fortune.com/2017/08/03/americans-record-highs-401k-balances/

Anyone elegible to do the full $18,500 and isn’t pedal to the metal is foolish. Obviously everyone’s day to day financial needs are different but the opportunity cost for that money to grow completely tax free is staggering. People won’t fund their 401K but will come up with money for $500 car payments.

Josh

 

[P. REZ]

The ”math” may well indicate that but you haven’t adjusted for risk and the probability of default and/or reductions in payments to plan participants and future beneficiaries. Hasn’t the IAMNPF done that several times now? Have you compared the accurarial value vs. fair value of the plans assets and liabilities? The plan may tout that its 101% funded but that’s on an accurial value basis, the fair value analysis published by Credit Suisse several years ago is more conservative and paints a very different picture.

Josh

Um, if it took a 50% hit, I'd still be ahead per my scenario. I think I factored in risk.

P. Rez

 

[P. REZ]

P Rez I’m in it and oblivious I’m going to continue to be, where I have an issue is that if and I realize that is a big if it should not continue to be contributed to in a new deal then I feel very strongly that I should have the option to move my money to a 401 or whatever if it’s just going to be locked and not growing and worse could be subject to being cut

cltrat,

I couldn't find anything on that. I believe only at retirement if you took the lump sum option could you do that. That wouldn't help if you weren't near retirement. Don't quote me though, not sure. I'll try to find out more about that.

P. Rez

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Good news here in this article but still 21% are being left behind and that’s with an average company match of only 4.5%


“Employees put a record average of $5,850 into their 401(k)s over the past 12 months, a 4 percent increase from a year ago. Ninety-five percent of active employees contribute to their 401(k)s, and many defer enough of their pre-tax salary to get the average company match, which is 4.5 percent. But about 21 percent of employees can’t, or aren’t, contributing enough to get the full match. Many are likely to have been auto-enrolled into their 401(k) at a salary deferral rate of 3 percent, and left it there.”

http://fortune.com/2017/08/03/americans-record-highs-401k-balances/

Weez -- this is exactly why we have 401k's as opposed to pensions... the Companies know that a large percentage will NEVER collect on their match...
They have also eliminated the liabilities, and administrative costs associated with a Company Pension Plan, like our dad's and granddad's once enjoyed.
The 401k is the largest hoax to ever be perpetuated onto the American Workforce!

It was originally sold to workers as a "SUPPLEMENT" to the pensions. The Companies then slowly jerked the rug out, and ditched the pensions all together to appease shareholders.

 

[PIEDMONT784]

The overall pension demographics are very interesting for the workforce here in the US. Among unionized workers 67 percent have pensions.
In the private sector... In contrast, only 13 percent of non-union private-sector workers are covered.Jan 11, 2013