Failed drug test termination fleet service please help.

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

I did focus on the issue Lu Lu. And it has nothing to do with egos as you suggest.
You want the real issue at hand? This guy is on an open forum asking for any and all help to save his job from an accidental pill being taken. Why is he here asking?? Why hasn't the union at AA helped this man so far?? You have to ask yourself this.
So don't tell me this is part of my ego, get a clue LuLu...

First off do YOU trust the Association?

I don't trust the UNION at all. I would only ever go to them for help out of total desperation, which the OP may very well be at that point. You have to understand where I came from 2 UNION officers (the President and Fleet Service Chairman of 514) cut an under the table deal to push a concessionary contract to save their own asses from having to relocate or hit the street when they got rid of Fleet Service at TUL and TULE.

TWU has already sold me down the river, in fact they did it to over 100 people.

Maybe he does not trust them. Maybe he has just not approached them yet but intends to, or maybe he has but he is asking us to because he is casting a wide net. I don't know.

At any rate it is irrelevant, I rather not deep dive this as I don't want to derail this thread any more than we already have.

 

[swamt]

It’s career decision basically a resignation letter.

i called them certificate of destruction.
By the way this letter is undated but signed by the menber.

Resignation letter?

First off do YOU trust the Association?

I don't trust the UNION at all. I would only ever go to them for help out of total desperation, which the OP may very well be at that point. You have to understand where I came from 2 UNION officers (the President and Fleet Service Chairman of 514) cut an under the table deal to push a concessionary contract to save their own asses from having to relocate or hit the street when they got rid of Fleet Service at TUL and TULE.

TWU has already sold me down the river, in fact they did it to over 100 people.

Maybe he does not trust them. Maybe he has just not approached them yet but intends to, or maybe he has but he is asking us to because he is casting a wide net. I don't know.

At any rate it is irrelevant, I rather not deep dive this as I don't want to derail this thread any more than we already have.

Hell Fking NO I do not trust this aso.?
My God, members in the past have had to hire Our attorney at AMFA to get their jobs back at AA. What the fuk does that tell ya? What does that tell ya? Tell him to hire Seham.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

If you REALLY want my advice, I would start working on an exit plan. I can tell you every person I knew with 20+ years had a major surgery. Back, knee, hip, shoulder. Having a career in Fleet is going to break your body down. I am sure even at 8 years you are already feeling the effects. Trust me, you don't want to be in the later half of your career, broke down, and feeling stuck because you feel you have been there for so long and you don't have any options. There is also the issue of mergers and layoffs. I had to work with a bunch of TWA guys in the twilight of their careers who had to commute to keep their jobs. 4 grown men were sharing an apartment to try to keep costs down. They were just trying to make it work till they could retire. Do you want to be almost retirement age and bunking up with a bunch of guys paying a mortgage for a house you live in a couple of weekends a month?

I have seen too many people pay a really high price for a career in Fleet.

I understand your goal is to get back but apply for a grant NOW while you have no income and if/when you get your job back great, continue your education. Even if you stay in Fleet at least you have options down the road and you got the government to cover part of your education costs.

I know that is not at all what you asked for but you are at a crossroads and I feel that at this time that advice may have more of an impact on you.

 

[Micificent28]

If you REALLY want my advice, I would start working on an exit plan. I can tell you every person I knew with 20+ years had a major surgery. Back, knee, hip, shoulder. Having a career in Fleet is going to break your body down. I am sure even at 8 years you are already feeling the effects. Trust me, you don't want to be in the later half of your career, broke down, and feeling stuck because you feel you have been there for so long and you don't have any options. There is also the issue of mergers and layoffs. I had to work with a bunch of TWA guys in the twilight of their careers who had to commute to keep their jobs. 4 grown men were sharing an apartment to try to keep costs down. They were just trying to make it work till they could retire. Do you want to be almost retirement age and bunking up with a bunch of guys paying a mortgage for a house you live in a couple of weekends a month?

I have seen too many people pay a really high price for a career in Fleet.

I understand your goal is to get back but apply for a grant NOW while you have no income and if/when you get your job back great, continue your education. Even if you stay in Fleet at least you have options down the road and you got the government to cover part of your education costs.

I know that is not at all what you asked for but you are at a crossroads and I feel that at this time that advice may have more of an impact on you.

Well you are absolutely right about the body breaking down part. Which is the reason for the pill in the first place. Knees shoulders and joint all starting to feel it. But here in my state if you didnt fall or something caused the accident the company feels it your fault your not using proper technique to prevent those breakdowns.

 

[eolesen]

Maybe things have changed since USAir took over, but there used to be a world of difference in how failing a random test and failing a post-accident test were handled. Second chance didn't apply for a post-accident or for-cause test.

EAP used to be a safe option if you requested it prior to failing a test. If you failed a test first, you still qualified for help, but still faced being terminated at the end of treatment.

Either way, I'd start looking for something else. Once you're on a final advisory or career decision, there's a permanent target symbol on you, and it doesn't have failing another drug test that gets a date on that resignation letter.

 

[jimntx]

When it comes to prohibited drugs, I wouldn't count on what has been done in the past. You may have personally witnessed hundred's of employees getting their job back from drug violations. That may have been before the zero tolerance FAA regulations. In general with government agencies, zero tolerance means zero tolerance. It doesn't matter what they "used to do." Also if it is a zero tolerance drug, whether you do or do not have a prescription doesn't matter in the least. Your problem with the drug is not whether or not you got it legally, it's that you went on the ramp while "under the influence." And, no you do not get to decide whether or not you were under the influence. That you have it in your system means you violated zero tolerance rules. It will be said that you didn't bother to "keep current" with drug regulations or you would know that you should not have gone to work after taking that drug.

To everyone reading this discussion. Do not keep unused/out of date drugs in your house and situations like this will not arise because there would be no chance for you to accidentally take one of them. AND, please do not throw out of date/unused drugs in your trash. Find out which pharmacist in your area is certified to take in these drugs and dispose of them in a way that will not affect the environment. Also, there will be no chance that children or pets ingest these drugs.

 

[Filter]

Maybe things have changed since USAir took over, but there used to be a world of difference in how failing a random test and failing a post-accident test were handled. Second chance didn't apply for a post-accident or for-cause test.

EAP used to be a safe option if you requested it prior to failing a test. If you failed a test first, you still qualified for help, but still faced being terminated at the end of treatment.

Either way, I'd start looking for something else. Once you're on a final advisory or career decision, there's a permanent target symbol on you, and it doesn't have failing another drug test that gets a date on that resignation letter.

A Final advisory is a terminating document...the company no longer uses career decision days as far as I know for the last 3 years at least...they now use USAir last chance agreements that are resignations signed but not dated by the employee...the company can date them at any time in the following 2 years...it basically waives you grievance rights if let go at that point...as Jimntx pointed out, there is zero tolerance but is not adhered to like hate speech or work environment issues.

 

[delldude]

Jim, I agree with your post 100%.
When drug testing was first implemented at UAir, I was involved at the union level and attended training in the procedure/process to answer the many questions and concerns arising from testing.Two things that were at the top of the list were never take a medication you personally do not have a prescription for and if you have a prescription for a medication that may impair your ability to function, it is your duty to inform your supervisor you are taking this type of medication and they will assign you to another function temporarily.
It's been quite a while since then but I'm pretty sure this hasn't changed.

 

[swamt]

[

I have spoken to the union but they were really vague and didnt seem to interested as of now for my case because the hearing will be down the road i suppose. but a lot of what they said is being reflected by members here and I and happy for any and all input from all members.

If this is the kind of response you received from this asso., then I would suggest looking elsewhere for representation. For any and all terminations, it should be all hands on deck IMO. Just the fact that you said they are taking your case with a grain of salt is pathetic. But I have heard the same over the years from both the TWU and the IAM representation when it comes to personal cases.
I hope you get your job back, it may be tough as the co. might make do backflips and unlimited testing for a set time period etc... Even though it was an accident, the co. has a duty to make sure it won't happen again, and possibly even some reliability once they allow you to come back so they will tie some regulations to it if they do let ya come back usually.
If you still feel like posting about this, let us know how it got handled. I would in the meantime get another job as sometimes these cases can take up to a year. Good luck to ya.

 

[eolesen]

A Final advisory is a terminating document...the company no longer uses career decision days

Thanks.... It's been 13 years since I had to follow AA's way of doing things under PPC, and about 10 since I had to fire someone over a drug test.

Do they still do 29F's?...

 

[Filter]

Thanks.... It's been 13 years since I had to follow AA's way of doing things under PPC, and about 10 since I had to fire someone over a drug test.

Do they still do 29F's?...

Yes...29fs are still contractual

 

[Kev3188]

i will be respectful to you and all of those that have created this great forum! I hope you don’t block or i get my IP blocked as what happen to thay guy FROM MIAMI!

‘Sup Dave. Nice to see you back.

Jim, I agree with your post 100%.
When drug testing was first implemented at UAir, I was involved at the union level and attended training in the procedure/process to answer the many questions and concerns arising from testing.Two things that were at the top of the list were never take a medication you personally do not have a prescription for and if you have a prescription for a medication that may impair your ability to function, it is your duty to inform your supervisor you are taking this type of medication and they will assign you to another function temporarily.
It's been quite a while since then but I'm pretty sure this hasn't changed.

FWIW, that’s more or less how it is at DL as well.

 

[Jester]

Unless it has changed american has a second chance policy too

I know guys who were tested positive for marijuana and cocaine, given the chance to complete rehab to come back. They were placed on "last chance" warnings as a condition subject to random testing.

 

[1AA]

I know guys who were tested positive for marijuana and cocaine, given the chance to complete rehab to come back. They were placed on "last chance" warnings as a condition subject to random testing.

Was that Pre-AmericaWest management?

 

[Filter]

LAA, at least in DFW has always had a similar document but wasn’t published in the PPC...”Thin ice letter”...but this was actually a step after the CDD, so in essence we had an extra step...Art Pappas used these a lot with terminated employees...IMO it was a double edge sword...you signed your resignation without a date and came back to work immediately waiving your right to a grievance...or take your chance in arbitration and maybe get back pay and lesser discipline....had it go both ways.