Envoy training mysteries

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

Just an observation, but I find it interesting that whenever a poster bashes a Union, it seems to be someone from out west.

What are you referring to?

 

[N965VJ]

I’m referring to comments made on this thread and others on this board.

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

I’m referring to comments made on this thread and others on this board.

Sorry. Saw the post you were referring to.

 

[PHX PHLyer]

Just an observation, but I find it interesting that whenever a poster bashes a Union, it seems to be someone from out west.

If you are referring to me....I live in DC...my ID may be PHX PHLyer...but I fly on the east

 

[USstew23]

Well it doesn't matter what they try to spin, we need to have at least 1 or 2 more F/A's on the 330 for TATL. And yes before I get flamed, I think it should be done by the book and not have a bunch of Senior, mid, or junior mamma's sitting around being lazy. If you don't like being tired from commuting in and starting the trip and you just HAVE to do the damn thing then come in the night before and be well prepared.

If they want 5 bev services then fine but augment the crew properly so that it looks professional.

 

[dudeflynhigh1]

It's sad that "phxphlyer" doesn't see the whole picture.
It's funny how management had added responability put on them and they have since been increasesd to industry standard wages. A us/fa deserves the same.

With the exception of 2 posters, one of whom told me to fly domestic, and another that actually got my point, I have no interest in the opinions of non flight attendants. You wouldn't last two seconds with a planeload of Italians or French who don't understand that an airplane with an economy section the size it is on the A330 that if they are in row 6, they will see me once and then not again for another hour because it takes that long to get through the cabin, and that isn't including the 60 video resets, the restock in the middle of the cabin, and actually trying to smile and do a proper job.

The point is, AWA wants me to do a service that required 14 flight attendants with 9. If you accept that kind of work environment, without complaint, that's your choice. There is such a thing as a reasonable working environment, and I resent getting beat to hell in 9 hours. PHX flyer, Your egregious lack of knowledge is humourous. An A330 is a negative stimulation nightmare. The call bells never stop and in the economy section, and the galley was designed by a sadist. A flight attendant can't sit on a jumpseat because it's a futile exercise. The bathroom doors open two inches from it, and you have to get up to let someone in and out. Throw in that you are on at minimum a 13 day and it tends to be tiring. If I read a newspaper on that plane it's because we're delayed. I could explain a bit more, but your intellect isn't worth the effort.

As for the comment to work domestic, I'll let that slide as a reserve that hardly ever flys, and therefore knows nothing of 5 international trips. As it happens, I do have a choice not to work the A330, most of the time. For those too dim to get it, I was pointing out that all of the service procedures in the world do not make for a happy, therefore pleasant to be around, crew. And, for those not yet acquainted with Envoy training, the point was endlessly made that the surveys indicated that a large part of whether or not a person had a good flight was the attitude of the crew.

Can we agree that you get what you pay for? US f/as are paid abysmally.

Now, if you are a flight attendant and enjoy doing 5 beverages and two juice and waters, answering endless call bells and doing at minimum 60-80 video re-sets with a minimum crew and think that I should, fire away. Otherwise, you're irrelevant.

 

[WCT]

Just an observation, but I find it interesting that whenever a poster bashes a Union, it seems to be someone from out west.

Yes, because the West fa's for example, have a very weak council. We have new elections occuring in FEB, and it is time for a change. No back bone or protections for the West fa's thus far. We were very close to implemting some great contract upgrades until the merger, the 66 council did nothing to fight the company before new negotiations took place. Lead fa pay and profit sharing were the only things negotiated in the merger agreement, thanks mostly to the East MEC. Sorry, where is my pay parity? We still make far less wages then the East fa's, and there is no excuse!! :down:

 

[lildutchgrl]

I had some concerns following envoy training and I made sure I asked questions during the breaks as to not delay the class from getting out on time. I was told that they are considering adding a second LODO on all TA flights in which they said might add a position on the planes. I said that that would be great, I might actually see a block again. According to the instructor, which I know pretty well and I know she would only be honest with me, they are wanting to do whatever they can to make US a great global carrier again and that means making our service better and flight attendants happy. The new 767 that has been all redone with new video system just went to CUN on Sunday. I hope it had the galley redone too! Has anyone seen it?

 

[Art at ISP]

There is much to agree with here. I think the pay policy stinks, but someone in the union agreed to it. I also think the key to whether or not the new product will be successful is staffing. US historically understaffs flights, and if that is not addressed the problems and attitudes will continue.

I just came back from China as most of you know, and I was in Business/First on a competing carrier (I worked hard and flew right). I was VERY impressed with the service and the product. There were three meal services each way, more china, silver and glass in one cabin than US probably has in their total inventory, and a cheerful, efficient and friendly crew. In short they had the tools and the resources to make it work. My cabin was serviced by at least 6 or 7 FAs--3 in the galley, and one in each aisle with an extra helping as needed. The ISM also was actively involved, and in many cases was the "swing" helping as needed. I think the total cabin crew was 12 plus ISM (or including I am not sure), but the aircraft had a capacity of around 270.

I think there were between 42 and 48 premium seats on this 777.... how many FA's work Envoy?

Also, a big difference was that these folks seem happy in their jobs. Their company treats them with respect and those I spoke with actually like their CEO. As I have been saying all along, that is key....

I fear this will be another case in which US has a good idea but fails miserably at execution--and through NO fault of the crews.....

My BEST to you all....

 

[lildutchgrl]

Curently Envoy is staffed with the following flight attendants:

757 ETOPS: 1 in galley, 1 in aisle
767: 2 flight attendants one in each aisle (new seat config. is 18 pas)
330: 3 F/As, one running the galley one in each aisle. There is an additional flight attendant that helps with the intial beverage service and then goes to the back.

 

[Travelpro72]

Folks the company is NEVER going to give you extra staffing be it domestic or transatlantic. EVER. You may have a chance of seeing an extra lodo but that is doubtful. Ya see, when it come time for the service to start we all know we will do what we have to do to make it work. The company knows this as well. Remember how dreadful we thought it was when the 757 went from 6 to 4 and the md-80 went from 4 to 3? Even the packed 737-400 going from 4 to 3? We b!tched and moaned but STILL got it done. This new service will be the same thing. It's different and will do more throughout the flight but we'll still get it done. This is the SAME company that won't give you basic tools. You seriously and honestly see ANY hope of them adding another f/a? The company even made sure that ANY tweaking to the new Envoy service was done BEFORE training of the first flight attendant began. They won't be rewriting anything to accommodate our complaints and adding a f/a. Forget it.

 

[SegmentKing]

i wonder what Pam Ann would do...

Cabin Service by Pam Ann

 

[Art at ISP]

Travelpro,

Sadly I agree with you. They will never provide adequate staffing, so regardless of how they train and how they try to improve the product, it will not likely succeed.

A further note to my recent experience, there were at least 3 LODO (I assume that refers to native speaking or bi lingual) FAs on each flight.

What's the use in comparing? I agree nothing will change.

Good luck folks.....

 

[Travelpro72]

Though we are working all flights at FAA minimum and sometimes can be very trying I NEVER, EVER let it show to the passenger. Because my company treats us like junk and we are working with the bare essentials doesn't mean that I have to let it trickle down to the customer. Regardless if they were upgraded, paid $99.00 or whatever...they're STILL our guest and a contributor to my paycheck. It's no secret that we are short handed at times. It won't be changing anytime soon. I take a little advice from my grandfather and "work smart....not hard".

 

[N965VJ]

<SNIP> Even the packed 737-400 going from 4 to 3?

We also had a fourth on the 737-300 and -200 right after the implementation on F after the PI merger for a while.

A few years later when the Extra positions were not being staffed, folks were really making a chunk of change with Understaffing Pay.