Early Out Package

[enough already]

Just curious. Does anybody know what the original sellout, B-scale creating, early retirement package of 1983 highlights were?

 

[Buck]

Is it true last week 800 have already submitted retirement in TULE?

870 a week ago

 

[Barfbag]

What if one takes the SIS and is has not filed his retirement papers does he still qualify for the early out when he files for retirement ? blink:

 

[cf6mech]

The rest of you 100+ viewers of this thread, feel free to state your opinions.
AA is watching

I have,.....and was stomped on by you regular whiners on this forum.....quote....whats with these newbies posting here? etc.etc.......your all to smart for this 22 year veteran at AA......so continue and make us new guys feel unwelcome and procede.....

 

[eolesen]

Hate to be the wet blanket, but can't see AA getting approval to drop what could be ~$180M and up just to avoid involuntary furloughs...

If there are 800 guys lined up & ready to bail out without any incentives, why would the company feel it is necessary to buy people out? just to be nice?.... When was the last time the union offered up something to the company just to be nice? Good goes around, guys...

Between the $75K and 18 months of subsidized health care, you're asking the company to eat some serious money per buy-out, whereas they could just furlough the junior guy for nothing.

Let's assume all 800 of the guys who have said "I'm done" are eligible. And just for gits & shiggles, let's assume that there are twice as many guys who aren't eligible for retirement who want to go.

That's 2400 x 75,000 = $180M just in "incentives" plus what I'd guess is another $4-8M in subsidizing the insurance cost. I have no idea what the sick banks would be worth, but if they're around $5K per employee, that's another $12M that AA doesn't have to pay furloughees...

And you know that those who have subsidized insurance for 18 months are going to run up the tab as quickly as they can type out "elective surgery" on Google.... That's not just conjecture, either. My wife saw it happen when she worked in Benefits....


You want early out benefits? Fight for travel and something else that's going to be non-cash, or maybe stock options worth $X upon exit from bankruptcy.

 

[AANOTOK]

Hey E, did you notice the term sheets? They were the lowest of the low and a starting point for some give and takes. Don't you think the same could be said for Little Jimmy's proposal. And by the way, Little Jimmy has been "offering up something to the company just to be nice" for years.
Nope E, good is a one way street...and Little has been good to the company for a long time!

 

[damajagua]

Hate to be the wet blanket, but can't see AA getting approval to drop what could be ~$180M and up just to avoid involuntary furloughs...

If there are 800 guys lined up & ready to bail out without any incentives, why would the company feel it is necessary to buy people out? just to be nice?.... When was the last time the union offered up something to the company just to be nice? Good goes around, guys...

Between the $75K and 18 months of subsidized health care, you're asking the company to eat some serious money per buy-out, whereas they could just furlough the junior guy for nothing.

Let's assume all 800 of the guys who have said "I'm done" are eligible. And just for gits & shiggles, let's assume that there are twice as many guys who aren't eligible for retirement who want to go.

That's 2400 x 75,000 = $180M just in "incentives" plus what I'd guess is another $4-8M in subsidizing the insurance cost. I have no idea what the sick banks would be worth, but if they're around $5K per employee, that's another $12M that AA doesn't have to pay furloughees...

And you know that those who have subsidized insurance for 18 months are going to run up the tab as quickly as they can type out "elective surgery" on Google.... That's not just conjecture, either. My wife saw it happen when she worked in Benefits....


You want early out benefits? Fight for travel and something else that's going to be non-cash, or maybe stock options worth $X upon exit from bankruptcy.

While I wish the company would approve the early out I agree with E. 100% I don't see the company agreeing to it.
I hope am wrong.

 

[Mr Red]

While I wish the company would approve the early out I agree with E. 100% I don't see the company agreeing to it.
I hope am wrong.

Same agreement United offered,and we all know AA is in much better shape financially.The middle class has had enough
of paying for the Screw street thieves and the Oil cartels GREED !!!Its a drop in the bucket compared to what their paying Lawyers and Advisors.

 

[Birdman]

Same agreement United offered,and we all know AA is in much better shape financially.

It was not offered to the mechanics in BK and there is no indication that it has been offered to any mechanics since the t/a was passed.
Their contract language:
Program Application: The program application window will be offered in the first quarter of 2012 and will last a minimum of 45 days. The company, at its sole discretion, may offer subsequent application window(s).

Approvals: The company reserves full and sole discretion on the Early Out approval process. The company will determine the number of Early OUt Plans to be awarded, the effective dates, locations, and order of approvals.

 

[TWU informer]

TWU Strategy to "Fight Like Hell" for our interest.

Tuesday Feb 14th - Picket DFW Ariport causing passengers grief trying to get to their flights and gate.

Wednesday Feb 15th - Beg for a $75,000.00 per head Early Retirement Agreement.

Does this sound like a winning "Fight Like Hell" strategy to you?

 

[TulsaTurd]

Hate to be the wet blanket, but can't see AA getting approval to drop what could be ~$180M and up just to avoid involuntary furloughs...

If there are 800 guys lined up & ready to bail out without any incentives, why would the company feel it is necessary to buy people out? just to be nice?.... When was the last time the union offered up something to the company just to be nice? Good goes around, guys...

Between the $75K and 18 months of subsidized health care, you're asking the company to eat some serious money per buy-out, whereas they could just furlough the junior guy for nothing.

Let's assume all 800 of the guys who have said "I'm done" are eligible. And just for gits & shiggles, let's assume that there are twice as many guys who aren't eligible for retirement who want to go.

That's 2400 x 75,000 = $180M just in "incentives" plus what I'd guess is another $4-8M in subsidizing the insurance cost. I have no idea what the sick banks would be worth, but if they're around $5K per employee, that's another $12M that AA doesn't have to pay furloughees...

And you know that those who have subsidized insurance for 18 months are going to run up the tab as quickly as they can type out "elective surgery" on Google.... That's not just conjecture, either. My wife saw it happen when she worked in Benefits....


You want early out benefits? Fight for travel and something else that's going to be non-cash, or maybe stock options worth $X upon exit from bankruptcy.

I don't have the numbers but if you added up what severence a vested 45 year old member will get, plus protection payment (which will be first thing gone in BK court), the cost to fund your retirement for the next ten years, cost to keep you on the inactive payroll for next ten years, and what ever you will draw in retirement and medical when eligable, etc etc etc, I bet it's not to far off from the amount the TWU has proposed as a buyout. Plus they can replace you imediately with a new hire at what ever poverty rate the BK judge allows them to impose without having to call you back. It's a way for the company to accomplish some of it's own MX at MRO wages by replacing the topped out AMT's with new low paid, unvested, no promises employees.

 

[Deleted member 14439]

I don't have the numbers but if you added up what severence a vested 45 year old member will get, plus protection payment (which will be first thing gone in BK court), the cost to fund your retirement for the next ten years, cost to keep you on the inactive payroll for next ten years, and what ever you will draw in retirement and medical when eligable, etc etc etc, I bet it's not to far off from the amount the TWU has proposed as a buyout. Plus they can replace you imediately with a new hire at what ever poverty rate the BK judge allows them to impose without having to call you back. It's a way for the company to accomplish some of it's own MX at MRO wages by replacing the topped out AMT's with new low paid, unvested, no promises employees.

Brother as much as I would like to see it happen, you might as well forget it. The company is going to get rid of the AMTs and its not going to cost them anything! Game, set, match brother. We lose.

 

[TulsaTurd]

Brother as much as I would like to see it happen, you might as well forget it. The company is going to get rid of the AMTs and its not going to cost them anything! Game, set, match brother. We lose.

Point taken but I don't believe the company will be successful in getting the severance clause thrown out, protection yes, severence no, so it will cost them at least that.

 

[Buck]

Hey E, did you notice the term sheets? They were the lowest of the low and a starting point for some give and takes. Don't you think the same could be said for Little Jimmy's proposal. And by the way, Little Jimmy has been "offering up something to the company just to be nice" for years.
Nope E, good is a one way street...and Little has been good to the company for a long time!

I am going to change your last sentence to make my post.

Little has been working together with the company's for a long time.

 

[Deleted member 14439]

Point taken but I don't believe the company will be successful in getting the severance clause thrown out, protection yes, severence no, so it will cost them at least that.

The system is stacked against us, "the working man". The judge will most certainly give the company what they ask for. We are screwed, it as simple as that. Loyalty, dedication and hard work have no place in todays business. Good luck.