Delta to keep SEA-HND (with conditions)

[WorldTraveler]

and AA did in fact NOT operate its JFK-HND for weeks at a time before it gave up the route.

And AA has held Brazil frequencies which were not used 365 days per year

DL was playing by the rules that DOT included with the route award.

If the DOT wants to change the rules, then do it across the board and make their rules reflective that every carrier can lose their authority if they don't fly it every day of the year.

The DOT has never done it and I doubt that those rules will ever become reality for DL on SEA-HND and if they do, DL will ensure that they are applied to all HND routes at the minimum.

again, DL has had the best operational reliability among the US carriers. You want to get into a pi89ing contest about operational reliability, I can assure that you DL will come out on top.

 

[STIS]

and AA did in fact NOT operate its JFK-HND for weeks at a time before it gave up the route.

And AA has held Brazil frequencies which were not used 365 days per year

DL was playing by the rules that DOT included with the route award.

If the DOT wants to change the rules, then do it across the board and make their rules reflective that every carrier can lose their authority if they don't fly it every day of the year.

The DOT has never done it and I doubt that those rules will ever become reality for DL on SEA-HND and if they do, DL will ensure that they are applied to all HND routes at the minimum.

again, DL has had the best operational reliability among the US carriers. You want to get into a pi89ing contest about operational reliability, I can assure that you DL will come out on top.

 
Boiiiiiiii what you missin is the DOT aint playin'  This ain't the old west and you and your posse ain't gonna be able ta waste the resource, you know what I mean homie?  Its like dat homie hoggin all the good kush while you all hangin out.  Nobody like dat homie.
 
DOT dont gotta play the rules the same way, aint you never seen how the cops make different rules for a homeboy compared to a top button whitey like yourself?
 
When you in power you aint gotta answer to nobody FULL STOP HOMIE

 

[WorldTraveler]

DL played by the rules the DOT set for the route award when it was issued.

AA got its pants in a wad because it walked away from its JFK-HND flight, tried to strip DL's route using DL's poor usage - that still was by the rules, and the DOT ruled that on the basis of the route award, SEA still is a better place for a 3rd US carrier route from the mainland than to have 2 LAX-HND US carrier flights

further, DL decided that adding its own LAX-PVG service makes sense which means that AA is now worse off than it was before at LAX and is now the smallest LAX-Asia/Pacific player among the US airlines.

all that is of an issue is whether the DOT can get by with imposing 365 day/year operate it or lose it rules.

I say the DOT won't impose it on the final order and even if they do, DL could easily win a legal case to keep the route from being stripped given that no other route award has EVER been issued with conditions that don't allow for the normal operation of airlines that includes cancellations due to a number of factors

 

[WorldTraveler]

of course that is what you want to focus on rather than admit that AA made a strategic blunder, DL kept SEA-HND, and AA gained new competition at LAX in the process.

 

[MAH4546]

Strategic mistake? Ha! Thanks to American, Delta is being forced to lose money flying Seattle-Haneda 365 days a year for two years, and, de facto, Delta is being forced to fly it's money losing Los Angeles-Haneda service, too. Good for AA - it forced Delta's hand and won. 

 

[WorldTraveler]

DL will lose a hole lot less money flying SEA-HND than the HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS that AA has flushed down the drain trying to build a presence in Asia, including from LAX.

and you and others seem to gloat that AA will make money to Asia this year based on low fuel prices but can't seem to believe that DL could gain the same advantage and also make money.

yes, AA got outfoxed.

AA cried to the DOT, the DOT kept the route with DL, and AA now has even more competition to Asia from LAX, including to a city where DL has a very strong track record even up against UA, and AA is now supposed to be able to hold its own?

yes, AA pulled off another strategic screw up that goes right alongside the LGA slot deal, the merger agreements, DAL, and on and on

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

 

DL will lose a hole lot less money flying SEA-HND than the HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS that AA has flushed down the drain trying to build a presence in Asia, including from LAX.

and you and others seem to gloat that AA will make money to Asia this year based on low fuel prices but can't seem to believe that DL could gain the same advantage and also make money.

yes, AA got outfoxed.

 

 
Remind us again how much money DL will lose on the refinery.
 
and how many billions are the fuel hedge losses?  5% of income?  Yeah, when AA losses over the Pacific approach that, then speak up.
 
yes, DL outfoxed themselves

 

[eolesen]

DL is only forced to fly the route 365 if they accept DOT's conditions. It wasn't clear from their objection if they were consenting to the more stringent conditions, or if they were going to walk away from the market if they didn't get relief.

Since DOT didn't appear to place any enhanced dormancy conditions on LAX-HND, I guess DL could fly that route every three weeks and just funnel everyone else up to SEA.

The only entities who think this was a win for DL are on this board. Everyone else sees it for what it was.

DL has now created a position by which only one party gets to save face -- either DOT caves in and raises their tolerance for no-ops, or DL has to bear the consequences of their earlier petulence.

I'd like to see DOT stick to their guns on this, but given the inconsistency in which the Obama Administration seems to run, all bets are off on predicting how they'll actually act.

 

[WorldTraveler]

it is only in your dreams that DL will walk away from the route.

DL made it abundantly clear that it believes it has the legal position to argue that the DOT has no basis to impose 365 day "fly it or lose it" requirements.
 

Remind us again how much money DL will lose on the refinery.
 
and how many billions are the fuel hedge losses?  5% of income?  Yeah, when AA losses over the Pacific approach that, then speak up.
 
yes, DL outfoxed themselves

uh, the refinery IS profitable and is expected to continue to be.

the only people that are pissing and moaning about DL's profitability with the refinery are those who made such a production about how much money DL would lose in it - and are wrong.

And feel free to continue to argue about DL's fuel hedge losses - in the meantime, AA is a shrinking company.

profitable it may be but shrinking is not exactly a viable long-term strategy

and the reason why AA is shrinking whether it is in Latin America or the JFK transcons or the Caribbean is because AA can't be profitable against all competitors and so just shrinks its presence in the hopes that one day they will have a viable network.

Since other competitors don't play that way, AA will wake up once again with the realization that they need a merger in order to survive - but there just might not be anyone left with whom AA can merge.

that difference in strategy might be why AA's market cap is now 10% less than DL's after being at parity not that long ago.

 

[700UW]

Starting March 27, 2016; Delta will resume intra-Japan service.


Schedule:
DL473 NRT1730 – 1850KIX 752 D
DL172 KIX1355 – 1510NRT 752 D
 
KIX is Osaka.

 

[MAH4546]

Today DOT finalized it's position on Delta's SEAHND authority. The tentative order stands, including the strict operating requirements forcing Delta to have a daily, year-round, uninterrupted service. 

 

[WorldTraveler]

Great news on two routes

DL's network in Japan continues strong.