DELTA TO GET FULL SENIORITY

[SKY HIGH]

Alot of posters on this board have bashed AA'ers over this sticky seniority issue and now it's their turn to get bashed and they are complaining?
That's a bunch of B.S. and you know it! USAIR employees were the reason the ALLEGHENY-MOHAWK came into being in the first place!

sky high states: Stirring the pot is ALL YOU'RE DOING. :down: Allegheny/Mohawk was in the early 70's. Every merger since then has been with DATE OF HIRE.
And AA? You stapled, you didnt even SLOT the TWA F/A's. You disrespected these people, stripped them of their seniority and kicked them to the curb. The entire industry watched your despicable self-serving move! :down:


0NLY stating opinions

 

[arera-51]

Okay all you AA haters. Let's see what what happens at U.S.AIRWAYS in regards to seniority. Will USAIR people willingly give full seniority to Delta people. My bet is all you people who have been crying about the AA-TWA buyout will all be screaming STAPLE!,STAPLE! now that it's your turn.

Topdog I really cant get into specifics about the case for legal purposes, its still ongoing investigation.But I can tell you its a wild place to work. Managers dont reprimand anyone . You work at your own pace an will. Our starting payscale is so low that we get thug workers or welfare recipiants working. Homedepot an lowes start out at a hire pay scale. We had 25 people get fired for stealing labtops.In one week at least 70 were stolen. We were told we now have a sting operation goin on to catch anymore crap being stolen. The funny part is all 25 newhires that got caught stealing were obviously terminated but the Co. isnt pressing charges ...lol is that funny. Shows you the type of workers you get when the pay scale starts out at $9 bucks an hour.

 

[Charlie_Tuna]

Topdog I really cant get into specifics about

Are you writing your posts or just copy and pasting someone elses from here, I see at least two of yours posted there. Thanks

Your posts at topix.net


I found this over there too regarding the arbitrators ruling on senoirity for IAM TWU integration of the Mechanics and Related Employees, Fleet Service Employees, Stock Clerks and Flight Simulator Technicians in the TWA AA buyout
Man is it ugly

Decision

 

[MMB]

...and one more thing, will US AFA be forced to give former Western and PanAm flight attendants their original (not Delta) DOH? Seeing as the good people at DL made all of them reapply for their jobs and then stapled them to the bottom of the list if they were "lucky" enough to get hired.

Delta’s merger and acquisition history shows a propensity to do better than DOH for the incoming employees:

Delta – CSA merger:
Delta had the higher seniority, but Delta and CSA seniority lists were dovetailed. The benefit went to CSA.

Delta purchased Northeast Airlines:
DOH was the rule.

Delta Western merger:
DOH was the rule. Someone mentioned Western pensions. Delta petitioned the unions to turn the pensions over for Delta to continue. The unions refused, so Delta pensions were figured from merger date. In the mean time, the unions were eating up the pension money with fees. (Yea union!)

There was no Delta – Pan Am merger of any sort. Pan Am’s assets were on the auction block and Delta bought some equipment and routes. Delta then offered first priority hiring status to ex Pan Am workers, AND phased in their full Pan Am seniority even though they were essentially hired off the street. For pay and vacation, they got DOH from day 1. For bidding, they got DOH after 6 months.

 

[BajaBabe]

I remain firm in the fact that hire in date is the way AFA has always operated and for one thing we all should be grateful. I refer you all to video.google.com TWA Legacy of the Skies. It is chilling to watch it's History you guys

 

[l8rd8r]

It will be DOH for this simple reason, AFA will say to the Delta FA's "if you vote for us, it will be DOH". All AFA wants is more damn money. They could care less for the workers who have been paying them.

You bet..its the money and AWA gets the shaft again.

 

[Furloughd4now]

You bet..its the money and AWA gets the shaft again.

Gosh sometime you act like the biggest babies around. We know it is not your fault these companies are merging, but really! :down:

You all just want things done your way or no way ... really now. We need to do what is fair for EVERYONE, not just a select few that like to stomp their feet and believe me I've been seeing alot of foot stomping on the west.

AWA'ers have jobs and so does the East. Believe me MOST mergers, acqusitions or whatever you like to term it results in job LOSSES because of redundancies. We're all pretty lucky.

As the old saying goes, if you don't like it ..... you kinow the rest

 

[N903AW]

You all just want things done your way or no way ... really now. We need to do what is fair for EVERYONE

I am uncertain if you are still on furlough as your name implies. If you are, and Delta is allowed to get DOH, you should consider changing your name to "Furloughd4ever".

 

[brokenwrench]

Delta’s merger and acquisition history shows a propensity to do better than DOH for the incoming employees:

Delta – CSA merger:
Delta had the higher seniority, but Delta and CSA seniority lists were dovetailed. The benefit went to CSA.

Delta purchased Northeast Airlines:
DOH was the rule.

Delta Western merger:
DOH was the rule. Someone mentioned Western pensions. Delta petitioned the unions to turn the pensions over for Delta to continue. The unions refused, so Delta pensions were figured from merger date. In the mean time, the unions were eating up the pension money with fees. (Yea union!)

There was no Delta – Pan Am merger of any sort. Pan Am’s assets were on the auction block and Delta bought some equipment and routes. Delta then offered first priority hiring status to ex Pan Am workers, AND phased in their full Pan Am seniority even though they were essentially hired off the street. For pay and vacation, they got DOH from day 1. For bidding, they got DOH after 6 months.

You are correct on all points except for Pan AM AMT's. They got full credit for pay and bennies from day one but for bidding could only exercise 1/3 of time per year. After three years they had full credit.
Just FYI.

DOH is the ONLY way to go in this industry.

YOU could be next

 

[N903AW]

There was no Delta – Pan Am merger of any sort. Pan Am’s assets were on the auction block and Delta bought some equipment and routes. Delta then offered first priority hiring status to ex Pan Am workers, AND phased in their full Pan Am seniority even though they were essentially hired off the street. For pay and vacation, they got DOH from day 1. For bidding, they got DOH after 6 months.

Funny, my best friend who was an ex-Pan Am Flight Attendant, adopted by Delta, NEVER regained his full Pan Am seniority for bidding. This from when he started with Pan American in 1978 up until the day he quit in 2004. I believe he lost a few YEARS (I believe it was 7 years) in bidding seniority during his entire tenure with Delta. He NEVER regained his original DOH for bidding from Delta.

By the way, the Flight Attendants that were most supportive of the unsuccessful AFA drives at Delta were mostly ex Pan Am Flight Attendants.

If there are any former Pan Am Flight Attendants out there that were (or were not) adopted by Delta in 1992, it would sure be nice to get the REAL story here about how generous Delta was with seniority when bringing you onboard.

 

[Michael B]

< You are correct on all points except for Pan AM AMT's. They got full credit for pay and bennies from day one but for bidding could only exercise 1/3 of time per year. After three years they had full credit. Just FYI. >

Now that you mention it, I do remember it started out as a three-year phase in of Pan Am DOH seniority. What I remembered most was that after 12 years with Delta and 21 years in the industry, Ex Pan Am'ers who were given full Pan Am DOH seniority by March '93 knocked me back onto midnight shift.



< Funny, my best friend who was an ex-Pan Am Flight Attendant, adopted by Delta, NEVER regained his full Pan Am seniority for bidding. This from when he started with Pan American in 1978 up until the day he quit in 2004. I believe he lost a few YEARS (I believe it was 7 years) in bidding seniority during his entire tenure with Delta. He NEVER regained his original DOH for bidding from Delta. >

Using 'adopted by Delta' shows you at least see, if not understand, that Pan Am was not a merger or acquisition. Those people were hired off the street. If anyone failed them, it was Pan Am. We got a couple ex Pan Am'ers who should have been up for retirement. They said their retirement was invested for them in a couple office doors in the PanAm building.

F/A's are a special deal at Delta. They aren't union, but they do have an Association that Delta listens to. As to your friend, I have a friend who, after 12 years with Delta, transferred into the F/A program. For bidding purposes, he lost ALL of his DELTA seniority.

In any case, I'd say that for a bunch that was hired off the street, Delta gave them a darn sweet deal. Nobody else hired off the street gets anything. When I hired on in '80 I had 9 years experience that got left at the door. I have a friend who had 23 years experience and goes by Delta DOE.
CSA, Northeast, and Western were mergers and acquisitions and were treated fairly. In CSA's case, more than fairly. Because of the dovetailing done with the seniority lists, you could have started with Delta 10 years prior, and at bidding time been behind someone with 8 years carrier time who started with CSA. Pan Am'ers were handed a pot of gold.



< By the way, the Flight Attendants that were most supportive of the unsuccessful AFA drives at Delta were mostly ex Pan Am Flight Attendants. >

Now why don't I find that surprising?
The place I worked before Delta had a closed shop. The only people the union EVER helped were the ones who couldn't hold a job picking their nose without union backing. The union did nothing for bulk of the employees except take a percentage of their pay twice a month. The union shackled the real hard-hitters. When a promotion came up, the person who deserved it couldn't get it unless he was also senior; otherwise it would go to any butt scratchier with one day more seniority.

 

[aislehopper]

IIRC, the top 3000 DL f/a's were protected and then the PAA f/a's were slotted in on either a 5:1 or 3:1 ratio (DL to PAA, and I do not remember which of the two ratios was used.)

Many of the initial supporters of the afa drive were the named plaintiffs in the FAFSI (Flight Attendants for Fair Seniority Integration)suit. In this case, a group of former PAA flight attendants brought suit agains DL in a Florida court. Ultimately, it failed and the flight attendants moved on to their next cause which was the participating in the launch of the afa campaign.

 

[gabby]

Don't worry even though US Air has a history of "Not" stapling people to the bottom they do have a wonderful history of burning their young.

Mark my words.....
The bottom 10% and wholly owned are all going to get "SOLD" out to make room for the senior pilots to capitalize on the merger. How and When we will find out later. But if you fall in the bottom 10% say goodbye to any positive outcome of the merger.
Eat the young.....