Delta Flight Attendants set to Vote!

[Nor'Easta]

The time has come for the Delta Flight Attendants to have a voice!!!

DELTA FLIGHT ATTENDANTS SET TO VOTE


Delta management makes a statement.

DON'T BELIEVE THE "SO CALLED" PROMISES FROM MANAGEMENT

 

[NAPAUS]

Yet another waste of money trying to get DL's f/as to vote in a union - IT WILL NEVER happen. Time for AFA and any other union, to move on an organize elsewhere. It's too bad i believe the f/a group should be Unionized, but too many die hard deltoids believe mother DELDA would never do them wrong. Watch out if a merger happens the f/a group could get royally screwed!

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

If the DL F/A's,....have 1/10th of a brain, they will ask themselves,..................."I wonder why, part of my cabin crew has a Union, even though in conversations with many of them, they don't LIKE Unions" ???

Meaning the PILOTS.

Deltoids,........................it's called..."ULTIMATE PROTECTION"(Kinda like a CONDOM) (Or an AMERICAN EXPRESS Card,................."DON"T LEAVE HOME WITHOUT IT") !

 

[USAir757]

Seriously - nothing angers pro-union workers more than those who don't want to organize. The funny thing about it... you don't see Delta F/A's or AMT's on here proactively preaching to all of you... You should drop your unions! Get rid of them! They do you no good... etc.etc. It's ALWAYS the organizers pressuring, pushing, intimidating, persuading, harping the same old tune over and over and over again. And I wonder why...

Is it because the union model is only truly effective when there is 100% participation? Not just at a particular company, but across the industry? Or, is it a deep seeded jealousy of non-organized groups actually retain more control in the long run? Or is it money? When you have a group of people that doesn't want to organize, why should they continually face demorilization and ridicule for their decisions? Some of you are so righteous and narrow-minded, that you think the only way is your way, and that's your final answer.

What do unionized non-Delta employees stand to gain from Delta organizing that keeps them here day in and day out, arguing vigorously in favor of a pro-union vote???

 

[700UW]

Lets see did DL's non-union employees get to negotiate with DL during bankruptcy or did the company impose whatever they wanted?

And if the CEOs and the rest of the Officers have contracts, what is wrong with the employees having one too?

Ask the non-union US Airways workers what happened to them in 1992 with no union!

 

[North by Northwest]

Seriously - nothing angers pro-union workers more than those who don't want to organize. The funny thing about it... you don't see Delta F/A's or AMT's on here proactively preaching to all of you... You should drop your unions! Get rid of them! They do you no good... etc.etc. It's ALWAYS the organizers pressuring, pushing, intimidating, persuading, harping the same old tune over and over and over again. And I wonder why...

Is it because the union model is only truly effective when there is 100% participation? Not just at a particular company, but across the industry? Or, is it a deep seeded jealousy of non-organized groups actually retain more control in the long run? Or is it money? When you have a group of people that doesn't want to organize, why should they continually face demorilization and ridicule for their decisions? Some of you are so righteous and narrow-minded, that you think the only way is your way, and that's your final answer.

What do unionized non-Delta employees stand to gain from Delta organizing that keeps them here day in and day out, arguing vigorously in favor of a pro-union vote???

Why aren't you at Delta then? Your professed excuses for NON UNION preference rings hollow. What you preach stems from an enormous level of ignorance of the impact of Unionization, not only on the living standards of the U.S. but the Western world. You fail to recognize (or are unable to) the residual benefits that ALL non union workers have enjoyed BECAUSE of Unions. You want a first hand glimpse of what a non union U.S. would look like? Look no further than China, or the wages of millions of illegal aliens in America whom have cut the wages of millions of working class American in half.

I can not waste my time going into detail about the historical significance of how Unions created the U.S. middle class (as they did in every other Western nation after the Industrial Revolution).

Good luck to all Delta FAs in having a voice in your future careers at the "new" and potentially merged Delta.

 

[luv2fly]

It's too bad i believe the f/a group should be Unionized, but too many die hard deltoids believe mother DELDA would never do them wrong.

Who is better suited to make that decision? The person who actually works at Delta, or someone like you who is simply an outsider looking in?
This post isn't meant to be flame bait. As a union member, I can honestly say your negative campaigning will only dissuade people from organizing.
The real questions become, has mother Delta done enough wrong that organizing becomes preferable? Does Delta's historical treatment of their FA's justify the union? Do you have reason to believe that treatment will change in the future as a result of some event, and do you believe your interests would be better preserved by a union?
In the pilots case, the answer was yes. It may very well be that time for the FA's, but let them make up their own mind.

 

[JakesWorld]

It is nice to see so many people from other airlines concerned with our future at Delta. Times are bad for Flight Attendants at every carrier in the U.S. even the ones represented by AFA. Even if AFA is voted in we will not get much more than what we have right now...and who knows the DL F/A could end up with less, only time will tell. To NewHampshire Black Bears to compare the DL F/A or any F/A to the pilot group is ridiculous. We will never get in a F/A contract what pilots have and the pilot groups would not stand by us in our negotiating process. This is just my opinion, ALPA would through their mothers under a train for an extra buck.

 

[North by Northwest]

Who is better suited to make that decision? The person who actually works at Delta, or someone like you who is simply an outsider looking in?
This post isn't meant to be flame bait. As a union member, I can honestly say your negative campaigning will only dissuade people from organizing.
The real questions become, has mother Delta done enough wrong that organizing becomes preferable? Does Delta's historical treatment of their FA's justify the union? Do you have reason to believe that treatment will change in the future as a result of some event, and do you believe your interests would be better preserved by a union?
In the pilots case, the answer was yes. It may very well be that time for the FA's, but let them make up their own mind.

Historical is subjective in the sense of ...never before having been bankrupt, nor having management from another airline (one with the worst labor management relations in aviation) or the impact of the highest oil prices in history, and it's impact upon management's decisions on operations and it's workforces. Or, pending mergers where Delta OR it's FAs will have NO SAY whatsoever in seniority integration. Or, the continuation of inferior work rules to Union airlines, hence it lowest FA's costs that they currently brag about in SEC filings.

Delta FAs will make up their own mind...just like Delta's Unionized pilots. As a member of ALPA, an industry Union, you of all people should know that it is the right of every working FA in US aviation to have an opinion about every Union drive that affects their industry and career. I dare say you'd have that opinion if you were discussing the NON Union pilots at "Make believe Airways" and it's very real impact on your industry.

I want what's best for Unionized Delta FAs joining a Unionized industry...just as the Unionized pilots do of their profession.

 

[luv2fly]

If the DL F/A's,....have 1/10th of a brain, they will ask themselves,..................."I wonder why, part of my cabin crew has a Union, even though in conversations with many of them, they don't LIKE Unions" ???

Meaning the PILOTS.

Deltoids,........................it's called..."ULTIMATE PROTECTION"(Kinda like a CONDOM) (Or an AMERICAN EXPRESS Card,................."DON"T LEAVE HOME WITHOUT IT") !

Statements like this do nothing further your cause. In fact, they detract from it buy enforcing the mentality that unions are bad for business. You would be better off solidifying your argument with coherent thoughts, not "unions are like condoms." <_<

 

[luv2fly]

Historical is subjective in the sense of ...never before having been bankrupt, nor having management from another airline (one with the worst labor management relations in aviation).

If historical is subjective as you suggest, then it strengthens my point. Who better to interpret those personal feelings or opinions, than the employees themselves? Your experiences with NW don't necessarily translate here at DL or other airlines for that matter. NW is heavily unionized as is WN, however the cultures are vastly different.

Or, pending mergers where Delta will have NO SAY whatsoever in seniority integration.


In regards to mergers and acquistions they would only have their experiences with Pan Am an Western to draw from. I am not familiar with AFA's merger integration policy, but I can assure you "having a say" doesn't translate into protection. Look no futher than the US/AW merge for a case in point.



As a member of ALPA, an industry Union, you of all people should know that it is the right of every working FA in US aviation to have an opinion about every Union drive that affects their industry and career.

An opinion is one thing. Insulting and deragatory remarks are another. I have seen some coherent arguments for organization on these boards, but I have seen more that show a severe lack of professionalism to put it politely.

I dare say you'd have that opinion if you were discussing the NON Union pilots at "Make believe Airways" and it's very real impact on your industry.

An opinion.... yes. Hopefully, a well thought out one that would support my argument, not the drivel I am seeing from far too many here.

 

[luv2fly]

We will never get in a F/A contract what pilots have and the pilot groups would not stand by us in our negotiating process. This is just my opinion, ALPA would through their mothers under a train for an extra buck.

I am not quite sure what you meant by your statement that the pilot groups would not stand by you. It would not be ALPA's responsibility to negotiate for you. AFA would represent your interests at the bargaining table.

 

[Nor'Easta]

Seriously - nothing angers pro-union workers more than those who don't want to organize. The funny thing about it... you don't see Delta F/A's or AMT's on here proactively preaching to all of you... You should drop your unions! Get rid of them! They do you no good... etc.etc. It's ALWAYS the organizers pressuring, pushing, intimidating, persuading, harping the same old tune over and over and over again. And I wonder why...

Is it because the union model is only truly effective when there is 100% participation? Not just at a particular company, but across the industry? Or, is it a deep seeded jealousy of non-organized groups actually retain more control in the long run? Or is it money? When you have a group of people that doesn't want to organize, why should they continually face demorilization and ridicule for their decisions? Some of you are so righteous and narrow-minded, that you think the only way is your way, and that's your final answer.

What do unionized non-Delta employees stand to gain from Delta organizing that keeps them here day in and day out, arguing vigorously in favor of a pro-union vote???

Hey its the Eastern SCAB aka USAir757! You still talk like a SCAB. Why you ask? Once a SCAB, always a SCAB! It will follow you to every airline you work for.

 

[North by Northwest]

Luv:"If historical is subjective as you suggest, then it strengthens my point. Who better to interpret those personal feelings or opinions, than the employees themselves? Your experiences with NW don't necessarily translate here at DL or other airlines for that matter. NW is heavily unionized as is WN, however the cultures are vastly different.

My experience at NW does VERY much translate to what occurs at DL as my experience was partly woven by the same CEO that is now running DL.


Or, pending mergers where Delta will have NO SAY whatsoever in seniority integration.


In regards to mergers and acquistions they would only have their experiences with Pan Am an Western to draw from. I am not familiar with AFA's merger integration policy, but I can assure you "having a say" doesn't translate into protection. Look no futher than the US/AW merge for a case in point.

Their experience with Pan Am and Western was and will be VASTLY different than anything they are about to go through in todays industry. Delta is not, nor likely will to be, in the commanding position it was in when it controlled it's previous mergers...that is a fact of reality.

And I can assure you "having a say" DOES translate into a better alternative than having "NO SAY"!

I think we can all agree on the importance of an informative and serious discussion needed regarding this matter. This will be a major change for a large group of people. They are entitled to have as much factual information as possible. It is our duty as Union members to assist them with that. They must also view the current reality as vastly different than 5 years ago (and most likely will be forever).

 

[luv2fly]

My experience at NW does VERY much translate to what occurs at DL as my experience was partly woven by the same CEO that is now running DL.

So are you saying the culture is solely defined by the CEO? And out ouf curiosity, what was your experience with Anderson? The NW pilot remarks have supported what I have seen from him so far, and that is he tells it like it is. A refreshing change if you ask me.

Or, pending mergers where Delta will have NO SAY whatsoever in seniority integration.

Once again, how much say did the USAirways pilots have when they were subjected to binding arbitration?

Delta is not, nor likely will to be, in the commanding position it was in when it controlled it's previous mergers...that is a fact of reality.

Really, why is that? Just trying to seperate facts from opinions here. There seems to be a thin line at times. Enlighten me as to why this is a "fact of reality"?

I think we can all agree on the importance of an informative and serious discussion needed regarding this matter.

Agreed.

This will be a major change for a large group of people. They are entitled to have as much factual information as possible.
I have no problems with facts. I don't really have a problem with opinions until people start try to disguise them as facts.