Company match for the Medical Prefunding any word yet when

[Bob Owens]

Isnt today the hearing on the company match?

YES

 

[AANOTOK]

http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2013/01/judge-approves-american-airlines-acquisition-of-boeing-airbus-jets.html/

Now that that is out of the way, up next on the docket is the screwing of the retiree's to help pay for these planes.

Thanks Judge Lane!!

 

[Rogallo]

BOHICA!!

 

[Bob Owens]

From the TWUBK website.

This morning the bankruptcy court approved four motions filed by American Airlines to assume, as modified, four prepetition aircraft purchase agreements with Airbus, Boeing, GE and Rolls Royce. These agreements, as modified, include agreements to fix the amount of claims to be allowed in favor of the four aircraft vendors as well as releases in favor vendors. Counsel for Creditors Committee represented to the court that the Committee supports each motion. On a related motion, the court also approved placing the aircraft purchase agreements under seal due to the extremely confidential nature of the agreements.

In addition, the court approved motions to allow American to enter into an agreement with the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey which provides for the assumption of certain gates at Newark Airport and the rejection of others that it no longer needs. On a related matter, the court approved American's agreement to reject sublease agreements with United Airlines and Porter Airlines and to enter into a sublease agreement with Virgin Air.

The court also approved the Creditor's Committee's application to pay certain fees and expenses of members of the official committee of unsecured creditors
and the final fee application of Boston Consulting Group ("BCG") in the amount of $11.7 million. BCG was retained by American to provide consulting services with respect to the restructuring and reduction of wages and benefits for the company's non-union employees.

Finally, the court approved two motions to extend the deadline to assume or reject two leases of non-residential real property to April 3, 2013.

Orders reflecting the court's rulings should be entered later today or tomorrow.

The court will hold a hearing later today at 2:00 p.m. (ET) in connection with American's motion for summary judgment seeking an order determining that American can unilaterally modify retiree benefits for current and future retirees. A report with respect to the outcome of that motion will be provided at the conclusion of that hearing.

"On a related motion, the court also approved placing the aircraft purchase agreements under seal due to the extremely confidential nature of the agreements."

In other words they dont want to let the workers know that they are the only ones getting screwed.

 

[Bob Owens]

The bankruptcy court heard argument at a hearing held on January 23, 2013 at 2:00 p.m., to consider American Airline's ("AA") motion (the "Motion") for summary judgment for a declaration that AA has the unilateral right to modify or terminate "retiree benefits" for all its retirees because the benefits were not legally "vested." It should be noted that the term "Retiree Benefits" does not refer to pension plan payments. It refers to payments by a company for retired employees and their spouses and dependents for medical, surgical, or hospital care benefits, or insurance benefits in the event of sickness, accident, disability or death.

AA takes the position that the company's various written "Benefit Guides" are the only documents that should be considered by the court to determine whether AA retained the unilateral right to modify or terminate retiree benefits and that those documents allegedly contain language that preserved AA's right to modify or terminate such benefits. AA takes the position that the language of the Benefit Guides is so clear and unambiguous that the only reasonably conclusion that the court can make is that AA retained the right to unilaterally modify or terminate retiree benefits. It should be noted that during oral argument AA's counsel indicated that the company intends to modify the retiree benefits not terminate them.

On the other hand, the Official Committee of Retirees (the "Retiree Committee"), which has been appointed by the Office of the United States Trustee and which represents the interests of the retirees, opposes the Motion on the grounds that the Benefit Guides are not the only relevant and governing documents that the court can consider. The Retiree Committee argues that when other documents are considered, such as collective bargaining agreements, there is a material factual issue as to whether AA can modify or terminate retiree benefits. Therefore, the Retiree Committee argues that the court must conduct a full trial on the issue and cannot decide the issue by a motion for summary judgment.

After nearly three hours of arguments, the bankruptcy judge did not rule on the Motion. Instead he reserved decision and indicated that he will attempt to rule on the Motion as quickly as possible but did not state when the decision will be issued.

So no decision yet.

FYI, the TWU chose two retirees to argue what happens to our matching funds. Ed Koziatek and Howard Blades. Ed has stated that he feels that in BK all the matching funds should remain in the fund and be used to continue to provide retirees benefits until those funds run out. In other words our matching funds should be used to continue to provide his benefits. Great deal for him, he has already been getting covered for 10 years, after only paying a couple of dollars a week for ten years,and even though he undoubtably recieved many times, not only what he paid into it, but also what was matched, he would continue to get the benefits. He would be completely unscathed by the BK at our expense. Its not like he will be destitute, I'm sure that either of his pensions would more than cover the cost. Its like he gets to stick it to us one last time.

 

[TWU informer]

SCREWED AGAIN

 

[OldGuy@AA]

FYI, the TWU chose two retirees to argue what happens to our matching funds. Ed Koziatek and Howard Blades. Ed has stated that he feels that in BK all the matching funds should remain in the fund and be used to continue to provide retirees benefits until those funds run out. In other words our matching funds should be used to continue to provide his benefits. Great deal for him, he has already been getting covered for 10 years, after only paying a couple of dollars a week for ten years,and even though he undoubtably recieved many times, not only what he paid into it, but also what was matched, he would continue to get the benefits. He would be completely unscathed by the BK at our expense. Its not like he will be destitute, I'm sure that either of his pensions would more than cover the cost. Its like he gets to stick it to us one last time.
Koziatek was the mastermind behind giving away our free medical and paying for retiree medical in 89. He screwed us every step of the way back then and he continues to do it now. Not surprising. Did you really think the TWU would try to get that money for you? Makes me wanna puke.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

How much more of the TWU are You willing to PUT up with?​

Have YOU had ENOUGH YET?​

 

[AANOTOK]

Ed K wins, you will lose your match when AA modifies and not terminate the fund.

http://twu514.org/blog/2013/01/23/summary-of-january-23-2013-bankruptcy-court-hearing-regarding-retiree-benefits-issues/

 

[Realityck]

So no decision yet.

FYI, the TWU chose two retirees to argue what happens to our matching funds. Ed Koziatek and Howard Blades. Ed has stated that he feels that in BK all the matching funds should remain in the fund and be used to continue to provide retirees benefits until those funds run out. In other words our matching funds should be used to continue to provide his benefits. Great deal for him, he has already been getting covered for 10 years, after only paying a couple of dollars a week for ten years,and even though he undoubtably recieved many times, not only what he paid into it, but also what was matched, he would continue to get the benefits. He would be completely unscathed by the BK at our expense. Its not like he will be destitute, I'm sure that either of his pensions would more than cover the cost. Its like he gets to stick it to us one last time.

Bob: Once again, you’re talking with no concern for the truth regarding the prefunding plan but that’s not unusual. You imply we will never see the company match, but we got the contract required prefunding + interest while waiting for the Bankruptcy Judge to rule on American’s obvious attempt to circumvent it’s responsibility to those already retired. Apparently you didn’t read or chose to ignore the Videtich Letter that clearly stated the decision to use the company match for continuation of the retiree medical plan was entirely up to the individual plan participants. As I read the Prefunding Plan Agreement, in the event of a Bankruptcy or Plan Termination the intent (when the Prefunding Trust was negotiated in 1992) was to continue funding a retiree medical plan should the participants decide to do so. As explained in the Videtich letter, nowhere does it say it would be done without the approval of the TWU’s Prefunding Plan participants. What exactly don’t you understand?

The simple fact is that no one on the Retiree Committee is asking for a nickel of any active employee’s prefunding or prefunding match or to interfere with the distribution of the Company match to employees as required by the contract. What the Retiree Committee is asking for is that the Court not allow the Company to simply jettison its obligations to retirees leaving them with nothing. It is not asking any active employee to meet this obligation; it is asking the Company to do so.

I suppose its not surprising that you don’t understand the 1114 process or that you have not read the material before the Court. What is unforgivable though is your attempt to pit retirees against active employees when every moral and union principle dictates that we should work together and support one another.

 

[TWU informer]

Bob: Once again, you’re talking with no concern for the truth regarding the prefunding plan but that’s not unusual. You imply we will never see the company match, but we got the contract required prefunding + interest while waiting for the Bankruptcy Judge to rule on American’s obvious attempt to circumvent it’s responsibility to those already retired. Apparently you didn’t read or chose to ignore the Videtich Letter that clearly stated the decision to use the company match for continuation of the retiree medical plan was entirely up to the individual plan participants. As I read the Prefunding Plan Agreement, in the event of a Bankruptcy or Plan Termination the intent (when the Prefunding Trust was negotiated in 1992) was to continue funding a retiree medical plan should the participants decide to do so. As explained in the Videtich letter, nowhere does it say it would be done without the approval of the TWU’s Prefunding Plan participants. What exactly don’t you understand?

The simple fact is that no one on the Retiree Committee is asking for a nickel of any active employee’s prefunding or prefunding match or to interfere with the distribution of the Company match to employees as required by the contract. What the Retiree Committee is asking for is that the Court not allow the Company to simply jettison its obligations to retirees leaving them with nothing. It is not asking any active employee to meet this obligation; it is asking the Company to do so.

I suppose its not surprising that you don’t understand the 1114 process or that you have not read the material before the Court. What is unforgivable though is your attempt to pit retirees against active employees when every moral and union principle dictates that we should work together and support one another.

Although you make some compelling arguements, there is one glaring concern when it comes to the TWU.

You point out this:
"""As explained in the Videtich letter, nowhere does it say it would be done without the approval of the TWU’s Prefunding Plan participants. What exactly don’t you understand?"""

But as we all know, James C. Little has pointed out in Federal Court in the past that the International owns the contract not the membership or individual participants, and Little recently even invoked that claim the IAC of the International is the supreme authority within the TWU concerning the single Local issue.

So it is safe to say that the term "plan participants" could have many meanings as it pertains to the TWU and the members of the TWU. There is clearly a seperation within this Union. There is the Union International and then there is the Union member, clearly two different things within the TWU. So you can bang your drum all you want, but truth is that having a belief that James C Little and/or the TWU will screw the membership regardless of what is written or what might be considered today's interpetation of facts, is not far fetched thinking by any means. Who the hell really knows what "the truth" is when it comes to dealings involving the TWU?

One simple question would be:
If the company match funds of an active employee are not in anyway in jeopardy during the 1114 process, then why doesn't AA just go ahead and mail the checks? If the contract has the assurance you claim, then why wait?

 

[Vortilon]

Bob: Once again, you’re talking with no concern for the truth regarding the prefunding plan but that’s not unusual. You imply we will never see the company match, but we got the contract required prefunding + interest while waiting for the Bankruptcy Judge to rule on American’s obvious attempt to circumvent it’s responsibility to those already retired. Apparently you didn’t read or chose to ignore the Videtich Letter that clearly stated the decision to use the company match for continuation of the retiree medical plan was entirely up to the individual plan participants. As I read the Prefunding Plan Agreement, in the event of a Bankruptcy or Plan Termination the intent (when the Prefunding Trust was negotiated in 1992) was to continue funding a retiree medical plan should the participants decide to do so. As explained in the Videtich letter, nowhere does it say it would be done without the approval of the TWU’s Prefunding Plan participants. What exactly don’t you understand?

The simple fact is that no one on the Retiree Committee is asking for a nickel of any active employee’s prefunding or prefunding match or to interfere with the distribution of the Company match to employees as required by the contract. What the Retiree Committee is asking for is that the Court not allow the Company to simply jettison its obligations to retirees leaving them with nothing. It is not asking any active employee to meet this obligation; it is asking the Company to do so.

I suppose its not surprising that you don’t understand the 1114 process or that you have not read the material before the Court. What is unforgivable though is your attempt to pit retirees against active employees when every moral and union principle dictates that we should work together and support one another.

Even if what you are saying is true, it still doesn't change the fact that we are all so used to getting screwed by the TWU - the thought of taking it in the shorts (yet again) from the TWU isn't so far fetched.

 

[Gman10]

Members who are participants in the prefunding program will receive their own contributions plus investment earnings and the employer contributions plus investment earnings, subject to “successful conclusion of the 1114 process.”

"Successful conclusion" for whom? AA? TWU? Retirees?

 

[1AA]

Ed Koziatek and Howard Blades are not arguing for the retirees. The TWU wants that money for themselves. These two guys do not need the money or the benefits. They have theirs with the TWU. They hired these two clowns to make it seem like they are fighting like hell to save the retirees medical prefunding. Been around the TWU for over 25 years almost 30 years, the TWU fights only when it has a personal interest to themselves and not the membership. Don't be fooled. The TWU wants our match and if they lose their argument in court we will see how hard they will fight like hell for it to be turned over to us. When I read the arguing points the TWU made in court it is obvious that the TWU does not want us to get the money. The company wants it back and the TWU wants it for them. So who is fighting on our behalf in getting the money to be released to us? NO ONE!!

Like AMFAinMIAMI said: "Had enough yet?"

 

[Chuck Schalk]

the Ed Koziatek letter was clear that in the event the plan is terminated that we get our money and the company contribution. These were individual accounts set up with JP morgan to protect them being taken away from us even in bankruptcy. How my individual account made it into court is beyond me. Unless it was allowed to be.........