Clt Observer On Cwa - Company Meeting

[cavalier]

A job that is not expected to be fulfilling is NOT a career.

A career is not necessarily a profession.

I would never have, nor certain not now, considered a flight attendent position a career or a profession. However, if a particular person was very interested in the job, then I might conceed that that personal interest might justify referring to that person's job experience as a 'career.' Additionally, I'd argue that that person would probably do better to decide to become an inflight service/security/safety manager, manage flight attendents, or write policies for flight attendents or provide some more valuable service to the inflight safety, security and services field. Light Years' attitude and knowledge and insight about the job would qualify, but having her perform the service of a flight attendent, as currently defined in the industry, does not maximize her contribution to the field. (In my opinion)

I might have considered a reservation agent or customer service agent's position as a 'career' 15 to 20 years ago. Respectfully, I'd have to admit that 10 years ago, I'd have expected that these folks would have started seeing the writing on the wall regarding the technological future.

I am examining the technological future for my career and considering alternatives and I'm in a complex, human-behavior oriented analytical position.

Since people seemed confused:

ca·reer (kà r"rÆ), n.
1. an occupation or profession, esp. one requiring special training, followed as one's lifework: He sought a career as a lawyer.
2. a person's progress or general course of action through life or through a phase of life, as in some profession or undertaking: His career as a soldier ended with the armistice.
3. success in a profession, occupation, etc.
4. a course, esp. a swift one.
5. speed, esp. full speed: The horse stumbled in full career.
6. Archaic. a charge at full speed.
–v.i.
7. to run or move rapidly along; go at full speed.
–adj.
8. having or following a career; professional: a career diplomat.
[1525–35; < MF carriere < OPr carriera lit., road < LL carr!ria (via) vehicular (road), equiv. to L carr(us) wagon (see CAR1) + -!ria, fem. of -!rius -ARY]
—Syn.2. vocation, calling, work, lifework, livelihood.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Wow, I got pretty close to the Webster's without looking it up. I'm pretty good at the dictionary game. As I said, a F/A would not be a career as per def #1. Def #2 is a general use of the word, including general 'undertakings:' not the context that we're using here. However, I'd apply definition #3 to certain F/A's on an individual basis and certainly to certain reservation agents and CSAs.

 

[ktflyhome]

Well, RowUnderDCA, according to def. #1, F/A DO get special training. You think we just walk in off the street and are handed wings?????

As far as def.#3, I assume you are limiting that statement to the ones who treat you kindly???? :down:

 

[mweiss]

...according to def. #1, F/A DO get special training.

I'll say upfront that this is not a fair comparison...
Grocery store clerks get special training too.

What makes the FA's job different is that the training is there for reasons of safety. That does tend to make Definition 1 more accurate.

Serious question, since I haven't gone through FA training. What's the percentage of enrollees in FA training that do not graduate?

 

[cavalier]

Because at least in my life I know who is responsible for me being where I am, ME! No evil Dave to blame, No Wicked Republicans, No Godless heathens just littel ole PineyBob, the source of my success and the source of my failures. That's why my emotional pillow is very soft and sleep comes easy for me, even in a Beech 1900 flown by the evil Mesa subsidiary Air Midwest.

What about people that are disabled and wracked with a disease which wrecks their body mind and soul, are they responsible for their plight, did they do anything wrong? You put a lot of personal responsibility upon yourself and I pray to the mighty one above for your sake that you maintain a strong back healthy body and sound mind least you become one of the ones who don't fit into your world view.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Well, RowUnderDCA, according to def. #1, F/A DO get special training. You think we just walk in off the street and are handed wings?????

As far as def.#3, I assume you are limiting that statement to the ones who treat you kindly???? :down:

No, you confusing me with someone that considers 'southern charm,' or motherly kindness, or a fraternal smile a comodity worth purchasing. That's a vaguely 'icky' concept to me. Do F/A's sell those things? Eyew.

I want a F/A who knows what and who is on her plane. Knows were it is. Can heave a big bag into the overhead or tell a customer to CHECK IT, with authority. I want a F/A to be able to take out some level of threatening pax with her body or cunning. I want them to have more professional skills, not just a bureaucracy at the FAA designating non-professional skills as professional ones.

DO NOT SMILE at me to compensate for you lack of ability to do some of the things above. Save that for Piney Bob.

 

[PITbull]

Wow, I got pretty close to the Webster's without looking it up. I'm pretty good at the dictionary game. As I said, a F/A would not be a career as per def #1. Def #2 is a general use of the word, including general 'undertakings:' not the context that we're using here. However, I'd apply definition #3 to certain F/A's on an individual basis and certainly to certain reservation agents and CSAs.

Row,

Your as far off as one who attempts to hit a "bullseye" blindfolded.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Row,

Your as far off as one who attempts to hit a "bullseye" blindfolded.

Streamers and bells and whistles. Now, that I got a PitBull meaningless, brush-off, I know I'm too close to the truth for comfort!

 

[PITbull]

mwiess posted: I'll say upfront that this is not a fair comparison...
Grocery store clerks get special training too.


PITbull replies: A grocery clerk who gets training for bagging groceries and the use of a cash register is in no way even close to being equated with 6 weeks of f/a training on safety/emergency procedures.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Another example:

Nursing is a job that became a career, because it was professionalized. Perhaps orderlies and what used to be called candy-strippers are becoming professionalized because of the changing structure of health-care, I don't know.

F/A and CSA are jobs that became 'careers' because people never did anything else. I mean career in the Def #2 sense. (with the prior stated caveats excepted)

I am very sad and disappointed that labor unions have failed so miserably in dealing with the injustice in our political culture that continues to make the prospective 'careers' of our children so shaky. If we are going to have to deal with a new global economy with new dynamics, seniority isn't going to work. We need something new. And it can't be handed down from corporate America.

 

[PITbull]

Another example:

Nursing is a job that became a career, because it was professionalized. Perhaps orderlies and what used to be called candy-strippers are becoming professionalized because of the changing structure of health-care, I don't know.

F/A and CSA are jobs that became 'careers' because people never did anything else. I mean career in the Def #2 sense. (with the prior stated caveats excepted)

I am very sad and disappointed that labor unions have failed so miserably in dealing with the injustice in our political culture that continues to make the prospective 'careers' of our children so shaky. If we are going to have to deal with a new global economy with new dynamics, seniority isn't going to work. We need something new. And it can't be handed down from corporate America.

Row,

Better share your comments with the physicians and nurses who are presently organizing at a fast rate.

Unions are more about livable wages, job protection, affordable health care, and safe environment than they are about seniority. Seniority is just a byproduct of membership.

Since you are a "critic" of orgnanized labor, why not share your ideas in the new global economy that will give more stability to the educated youth who are job seeking.

 

[cavalier]

PINEY


Then STOP coming on here and preaching to me all the time about my faith and what if's! Which you do using the Lord's name in vain like it's an easy target not to be taken seriously.

Don't ever bring up the faith issue again to me and I will likewise reciprocate by ceasing my assaults upon your lectures of personal responsibility.

 

[PITbull]

Be gentle. I'm new here, but in your opinion what is the other half of the problem?

Best,

Oh please don't whined up mwiess again.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Fair-enough, but I'll end it there, for risk of shutting down the thread for off-topic.

Im not terribly sophisticated on these matters, other than to know that we need to stop going in the wrong direction.

Namely, we need to stop increasing the power of accumulated wealth on the individual worker, by stopping corporate tax-breaks, and incentives to cheat. We need to make the tax code somewhat more progressive and less punitive to labor. We need to increase the minimum wage.... everybody who works should be closer together on the scale than they are now... not equal, but closer. This is simply so our society can work again as one and not two. We need to provide for some of the basics that make working people trapped, like separate healthcare from working status. I know that's a hard one, cuz people like to find systems that reward them with more than their percapita share of health care resources. Same thing with education,including job training. I'd also consider making it easier for parents to stay home with children, if they want to by providing health care.

All of this would make the task of individual workers adjusting to an economy that requires rapidly changing skills. It seems to me that politics is the mechanism to make this work. However, I'm sure that there are labor economists that could provide examples of alternative models for working class mobilization in the 21st century. I wonder if unions like AFA look into those things?

Moderator..... I'm done. It's just that I've been quite blunt lately and I'm doing my penance.

 

[mweiss]

Oh please don't whined up mwiess again.

Hmmm...did you see my response? If you didn't, read it. If you did, how about you point out what's missing in my analysis, huh? :huh:

A grocery clerk who gets taining for bagging groceries and the use of a cash register is in no way even close to being equated with 6 weeks of f/a training on safety/emergency procedures.

Um. Wasn't that what I said? You really don't read my posts at all, do you?