Cavemen and Lizards

[The Goose]

Yes Ken you are correct it is about celebrating our craft and profession,but it is also about showing respect for the profession. You are wrong about selling out because that is exactly what it is,by accepting this meal you are accepting the way that they are treating you as an AMT and telling you that you are worth nothing more than a couple of pieces of chicken. Do you think that they chose the meal chicken for a reason? Seems kind of fitting for this union and I use the term union very loosely here. The company has shown no respect to the profession by the TA that they offered by wanting to have people work on the planes with another title other than mechanic. The meal that they are feeding you was not offered with respect or any sincerity, it was with pity for the groveling fools that acceppted their meal.Oh and lets not forget that we paid for that meal ourselves with the concessions. The company feels that they can buy you off with somthing as cheap as a meal while they sit back and laugh. If every person would have turned down the food then the company would have seen that there is solidarity within the union. This union is so pathetic,but what can you expect out of a bunch of people that are bought and paid for. A perfect example is your local president along with Steve Luis and Gilboy. They recieved their Int position,but I guess they were a Little (Jim) better than the poor fools that voted yes and got nothing like Todd Woodward out of MIA,not to mention the other 7. Since you have voiced your opinion of this TA on this board lets take it one step further by you and your local reps that disagree with this TA by putting out a letter stating your opinion along with the others and that you disagree with Willie (Bob) Zimmerman (and the answer is yes)for voting to bring this back for a vote.

Not sure how many have the personal principals (obviously not many or we wouldn't be in our present situation) to turn down a free feed regardless of its supposed purpose, but I agree with you - it's not much different than throwing a noisy sea lion a fish.

I'll not be joining the "party".

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Bandit and I are also a big Vot No!

 

[the cave]

Kirk is full power to phasers! "VOTE NO Mr. Sulu!"

 

[High Speed Steel]

Wylie Coyote, SUPER Genius, is Voting No!

Nice cartoons Ken but what are your expectations with the denial of this contract?
I have been a solid NO voter for about a year and a half because of former TA'd articles and direction I felt we were being led in this round of negotiations but now I'm willing to wait and see the final language before giving this a complete thumbs down....I ask myself, " What is to gain with a NO vote? " Remember, we are in mediation! I want to start over at 4-14-2003 but I'm sure the NMB will not allow this.... I can only see that a few of the final TA'd articles would get tweaked if we vote this down and it would be shoved back in our faces again for another look...What do you expect with turning this down Ken? What are we to gain?

 

[TWU informer]

Nice cartoons Ken but what are your expectations with the denial of this contract?
I have been a solid NO voter for about a year and a half because of former TA'd articles and direction I felt we were being led in this round of negotiations but now I'm willing to wait and see the final language before giving this a complete thumbs down....I ask myself, " What is to gain with a NO vote? " Remember, we are in mediation! I want to start over at 4-14-2003 but I'm sure the NMB will not allow this.... I can only see that a few of the final TA'd articles would get tweaked if we vote this down and it would be shoved back in our faces again for another look...What do you expect with turning this down Ken? What are we to gain?

We agree on something here.

I don't like this TA one bit or the fact that we were once again led to concessions for gains.

I would expect very little to change if we vote no and send the same negotiators back to clean this up.

Accepting this TA in the middle of mediation after requesting a release from mediation can only be defined as coduct of cowards that were only threatening action and had NO INTENTION of ever actually being engaged in a cooling off period. A bunch of fools had their bluff called and here we set divided and dissappointed once again.

They have truely led us into a mandatory "we'll get 'em next time brother" position.
So sad.

 

[boston]

We agree on something here.

I don't like this TA one bit or the fact that we were once again led to concessions for gains.

I would expect very little to change if we vote no and send the same negotiators back to clean this up.

Accepting this TA in the middle of mediation after requesting a release from mediation can only be defined as coduct of cowards that were only threatening action and had NO INTENTION of ever actually being engaged in a cooling off period. A bunch of fools had their bluff called and here we set divided and dissappointed once again.

They have truely led us into a mandatory "we'll get 'em next time brother" position.
So sad.

Is the TWU holding roadshows regarding this T/A, and when will the vote be in ?

 

[TWU informer]

Is the TWU holding roadshows regarding this T/A, and when will the vote be in ?

Steve Luis reported at the membership meeting that it would be July before we are voting.

The roadshow or info meetings will take place once the TWU has an insurance agreement to take over the early retirement they just negotiated away.

 

[High Speed Steel]

We agree on something here.

I don't like this TA one bit or the fact that we were once again led to concessions for gains.

I would expect very little to change if we vote no and send the same negotiators back to clean this up.

Accepting this TA in the middle of mediation after requesting a release from mediation can only be defined as coduct of cowards that were only threatening action and had NO INTENTION of ever actually being engaged in a cooling off period. A bunch of fools had their bluff called and here we set divided and dissappointed once again.

They have truely led us into a mandatory "we'll get 'em next time brother" position.
So sad.

Informer, Expect little by sending the negotiators back , or those we should elect to replace them. They would be unfortunately bound by one defining issue....see below


We're in mediation......

 

[The Goose]

Informer, Expect little by sending the negotiators back , or those we should elect to replace them. They would be unfortunately bound by one defining issue....see below


We're in mediation......

Explain these items:

After all the BS talk of "I won't bring back a poor contract" or whatever the sellout Local 514 President Luis said, why did he change his mind and vote to put this in front of the membership? No - I'll not ask him myself as I have no desire to speak with an unaccountable International Vice President.

Why, after the company threw this POS out on the table, was it accepted with no counter offers/dealing?

 

[Thomas Paine]

Informer, Expect little by sending the negotiators back , or those we should elect to replace them. They would be unfortunately bound by one defining issue....see below


We're in mediation......

So, we are in mediation. The mediator is not an arbitrator, he doesnt have the power of an arbitrator where he can say what the parties can and can not do. One huge flaw that can be easily fixed with this concesionary deal is the term of the deal. Five years is too long. I say send "some" of the negotiators back to get retro, no concessions, meaningfull raises, and industry standard on vacation, sick time, Holidays, Overtime.

As for Luis, well he went around saying he wasnt Dennis Burchette, if anything Burchette was more honest. Burchette was openly hostile to the line, didnt like what I heard about him but I knew what we had. Luis is simply a liar, he went all across the system, came to our station and told us how they were going to get everything back, would not call for a Roll Call, then he brings this back on a roll call. Can't Tulsa find an honest man from a pool od 6000 candidates?

 

[The Goose]

... snip
Can't Tulsa find an honest man from a pool of 6000 candidates?

Good question, but consider the type that wants to be "in charge".

These are, in my experience, people that haven't a clue how to do their "jobs", but have been union-protected forever, and in the beginning feel some allegiance to the organization that saved them many times from the street. After managing appointment/election a few lower level union positions with the best of intent, they begin to see where the real money and job security is and start running for higher office within the union in hopes of being chosen to further the interests of the boys at the top - in our case, the International.

It's been said "Every man has his price". With this being the only group to seek office (this applies to our elected politicial "representation" also at every level), it's not hard to see how we ended up with what we have. It's certainly not difficult to believe there are payoffs galore, as there's nothing glamorous about the job except maybe the business cards they print for you.

I always ask the lovers running around with the "Vote for Me" crap that make it into my shop what International position they aspire to as it's obvious they haven't any concern re: those that elect them. One idiot last night (Shinde or something like that), asked first how we felt about issues before he started telling us "how he felt" - wasn't that more like "What do you want to hear?" Very hollow and very blatant.

The same people have, for years, made an American Airlines career of not doing their jobs and protecting others who won't either, leaving those who do basically unrepresented except in the most basic of ways.

The way the voting works, it's very doubtful any meaningful changes will be made, rather, it's designed to keep the trash in office. There can be 5000 candidates and 5001 voters, each getting 1 vote from the election, except one clown that gets 2 votes. The one who got two votes is the winner - that's really a mandate, isn't it?

Locally, the TWU is run for the benefit of a very few insiders - all others can go to hell. Even if we were to remove it as our representation, the same group of worthless would worm their way back into power - it's what they do, kinda like it being a child's job to play in a mud puddle.

In short - I am not a believer in the "system" as it's more screwed up and crooked than the Federal Government, as hard as that is to imagine. We are paying dues for the company's representation, not ours. We are paying dues for our representation to perform company functions. The union stewards in my shop don't care to make waves and challenge the company on meaningful issues, only BS. Those in high union office are not accountable to the membership that pays their salaries - they cannot be removed as they are appointed to their positions within the club.

But to answer your question (after much rambling), those people that are relatively honest enough to take on a position of authority within the union and do their job instead of usiing it for their own ends have far too much personal pride in themselves to do such a thing regardless of what they can steal to their benefit or the feeling of "power" they get from it. These people don't live for power & glory and take any suggestion of joining the cabal as a personal insult to their integrity. You'll never see them in the union offices unless it's with a piece of pipe to be used as a club - they stay in the background on a slow simmer.

 

[SkydrolJunkie]

The same people have, for years, made an American Airlines career of not doing their jobs and protecting others who won't either, leaving those who do basically unrepresented except in the most basic of ways.

That is so true. My station reeks of it.

 

[TWU informer]

Good question, but consider the type that wants to be "in charge".

But to answer your question (after much rambling), those people that are relatively honest enough to take on a position of authority within the union and do their job instead of usiing it for their own ends have far too much personal pride in themselves to do such a thing regardless of what they can steal to their benefit or the feeling of "power" they get from it. These people don't live for power & glory and take any suggestion of joining the cabal as a personal insult to their integrity. You'll never see them in the union offices unless it's with a piece of pipe to be used as a club - they stay in the background on a slow simmer.

I will be running for one of the seven (7) Executive Board positions in Local 514.

I do not aspire to be appointed to the International

I too have concerns regarding TWU Election procedures.

I do not aspire to make a career of corruption, or deception of truth. I do not intend to dissappear from my duties from the floor for 3 years if I am blessed enough to be given a chance. I plan to spend time on the floor listening to those that like to run their "pie-holes". I tend to learn from hearing the pie-holes myself.

There are Candidates that have been nominated that will take change from a Local Officer as far as possible within the TWU *which in my opinion isnt very far". There are more that will appear on the ballot that will be more of the same. The most important objective is identifiy the difference and vote in blocks together to gain a majority of change seekers.

Please PM me with your shop location. I wont be carrying the standard "Student Council" type of campaign cards, signs or stickers. I will simply run my pie-hole and respectfully ask each member to consider voting for me.

Some people like me, some hate me. But you know what you are getting.

If anyone wishes to come by for coffee and visit. I grind fresh beans each morning and love to chat about our future. PM me and I will make a more detailed invite.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Even Joe says Vote No!

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Zonk and the gang are voting no!