Any Word On 757s?....

MarkMyWords said:
Tadjr,

It was decided to cap all B757 flights at 8 in f/c for the very reason you noted above. It is easier to roll people up front then it is to push them to the back. Inventory was supposed to have started capping all flights to 8 sometime last week. I personally brought the same issue up to my boss (who is very well connecteed) when it was first announced that we were going to reconfigure the fleet. They assured me that they would handle this situation better then they did the B733 and M80 configurations. Keep your fingers crossed.
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Tadjr -

I did a follow-up check today and all B757 flights are capped at 8 in F/C effective Oct 30th and beyond. That is the date that the first reconfigured aircraft should roll into service.

Thank you Inventory......you have made the conversion a little easier for our friends in the stations and more importantly, our customers.
 
Also, for those that wish to know.....I did some additional research today. I looked at the PHL, PIT and CLT to and from MCO routes and checked the bookings for the next 8 days, starting today the 4th. Out of 134 flights into or out of MCO that are being operated by 757 equipment, only 14 flights had more then 8 people booked in first class. All told there are 587 customers booked in first class on a 757 in the next 8 days to or from MCO, yet there are 3216 seats available in that market, on those flights. That is less then a 20% load factor in first class! Even if we only offered 8 seats on these airplanes (that would be 1072 seats in the market) the average load factor would be less then 55%.

For those that think I skewd the numbers by adding dates that are more then a week away I will add this. For today, the 4th, there are 20 flights on 757 equipment to/from MCO. That gives you a total seat capacity of 480 seats in first class. Today we are booked to 112 out of the 480 seats for a load factor of 23%. If we were to have only 8 seats available, then the seat capacity drops to 160 with a load factor of 70%. Of the 20 flights only 4 of them are booked to more then 8 in first class

Looking at tomorrow, here are the numbers for tomorrows flights. There are the same 20 flights with 24 seats to/from MCO. That is 480 available seats and we are booked to a whopping 134 for a load factor of 28% for a FRIDAY. Once again if we reduced the seating capacity to 8 seats we would now have a load factor of 84%.

I hope that the above figures reinforce what I have been saying all along, the reconfiguration of the B757 fleet to 8/185 is a positive step. It does realign capacity with demand.
 
My guess would be that those flights to MCO would be booked very light anyway at this time of year, but I don't know. Isn't this a particularly slow travel time to FL? It would be more interesting to know how those figures worked out a few months from now.
 
Well I can tell you from last years holidays they very often had anywhere from 10-20 seats blocked in FC on a daily basis with coach being overbooked by that much. We moved people up day of departure on a daily basis. If you are a 1/2/3, how many times dont you get an upgrade to Florida on a 12F plane? There isnt that much of a difference with that and the 757s coming up. The one exception might be a DCA flight on Mon am or Fri pm, otherwise a lot of the planes (even the 12 seaters) have seats available until the clearing starts at the gate on many of the flights.
 
Clue -

I will check LAS flights for you either today or tomorrow. I would be interested in seeing that as well.

mbmbbost -

Agreed this is a slower time of the year, but we are running an average load factor to MCO of about 55% for today and tomorrow in coach.
 
tadjr said:
If you are a 1/2/3, how many times dont you get an upgrade to Florida on a 12F plane?
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What does 1/2/3 signify? Subcategories in Chairman's Preferred...

or CP, Gold and Silver?
 
ClueByFour said:
Mark,
What do those numbers look like on 757 equipment from the hubs to LAS?
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Clue -

As I expected, the results from the LAS flights were just the opposite of the MCO flights. 82% average load factor in first class over the next 8 days. By comparison, the coach load factor is just over 95% average.

This presents some interesting problems. How do you maintain service levels? If you utilize an A321 in place of the 757 then you reduce the overall capacity by 13 seats, but increase first class seats by 2. If you keep the 757 on the routes then you reduce first class by 16, while increasing coach capacity. Not good for our VFF's. What's the answer?

When I was looking at the schedule for the fall/winter I noticed that there are still several routes that are showing A321's to some florida cities, along with 320's, 319's, and 734's. Since the marketing schedule is only finalized through the end of Oct (there is a Nov paper schedule that has not been loaded yet), I wonder if there will be any shift in aircraft types flying the routes after the conversion is complete? I agree that the reconfigured airplane is perfect for the Florida markets, it does not seem to be the aircraft of choice for the LAS market. Sub fleeting the 757 into 2 configurations isn't the answer. This brings up a multitude of operational problems and restricts your ability to have flexibility within a fleet type. It is a problem that we run into daily with the A319's and the overwater A319's. So what is the answer?
 
I don't think the 2 extra F/C seats are the reason. Take a look at the operating costs of the 757 VS the A319/20/21 family on that route. Also, LAS is very low yielding with significant amount of upgrades used on these routes.
 
Of the 1st Class going to Vegas, I would venture to say that not very many seats in that cabin are actually purchased. Most are Cert. upgrades or more FF miles.
 
longing4piedmont said:
As we all know they pay full Y fares and never want to be upgraded. :blink:
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And there really is a great pumpkin, Charlie Brown :) .

Regarding LAS: if folks blow things like US20s to get the upgrade (in my US3 days I did this frequently to ensure the upgrade on a tough to upgrade route like LAS) it's actually a good thing from US perspective, as it reduces the mileage liability in a rather efficient way (heck, it's like an entire off-peak coach ticket for 20k, right?). This is good.

Regarding other types of upgrades, it's the classic tradeoff--without being able to upgrade this route and/or without reasonable chances to upgrade this route, there are many VFFs who will seek another carrier. The catch-22 for U is that the coach product is poor in comparison with UA or AA, in particular. UA is particularly bad--if I can get the U miles, preboard, use the elite security line, and get an E+ seat, I'll buy the ticket from UA knowing that I can sit comfortably. Why gamble chasing the upgrade (bad pun going to LAS)?

The prevailing attitude of "it's a low yeilding route, so we should make it a slave ship" only applies if the other aspects of the value proposition allow that to hold. In U's case, it currently does not work that way.

Then there is the classic issue that I've actually had conversations with folks from CCY about: the total customer relationship. I used to give U almost all of my traffic. Walkup Y all the way to the $200 runs to the coast and everything in between. After last year when BBB made it clear that U was not interested in anything except the proverbial last minute lynch type fares, I stopped flying U on those routes. When I've needed to cross the pond on short notice, it's been on AA/BA/UA and so forth. WHen I have some time to plan, I buy a $500 ticket from U and upgrade into Envoy, or fly to the coast in F for $200. I faxed the receipts to consumer affairs and a few others at CCY with my rationale--if you don't like me when I'm not blowing money hand over fist, you can kiss the revenue goodbye when I am blowing money hand over fist. If I buy a $1700 walkup AMS-PIT now and again, I want to be able to sit in front now and again going to someplace like FLL or LAS. Lacking that, I see no reason to give U the "BBB gets wood" fares.

The folks in upper management in CCY still don't get it. It is about the complete value proposition, even for the once a year type flyer. Why do you think people blindly run to southwest.com even when they are not necessarily the cheapest?

Mark, I'm not entirely sure how to solve the problem with regard to fleet reconfiguration. I probably would have gone with 12F on the 757 if the config could have been worked. At least it's then in line with the 737/319s from a "chance to upgrade" perspective.
 
Some passengers do pay for first I know I've seen the tickets. These are the passengers with the money and business sense not to wait and try to get something for nothing they know what they want and they pay for it.

Now US1’s do pay one way or another but still First is First and there should be some better way of providing this service so we don’t undervalue it like we have. When a US1 buys a really cheep ticket and expects an upgrade because of all the flying his company has paid for and he has flown. US1’s need to realize that if we are to use this as a marketing tool it needs to have some value to it.

I don't know maybe when you spend a certain amount not just how many segments you fly and I don't think they should be allowed to upgrade anybody else
now I have been away for a while so some things may have changed but it just needs to have some real value.
 
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