Any Word On 757s?....

[Art at ISP]

Twice,

Thanks for your comments. While I agree that there are some preferred members who act like "royalty" as you put it, my experience has been that they are in the minority. Most of the fellow US1's I meet and talk to are more like me than them.

While I see your position regarding selling more Y seats, as it applies to the 757, I am not sure it will result in improved yield. Selling more $99 seats isn't really going to help, and to be frank, that is what the leisure passenger is looking for. I wonder if you fill the whole cabin with $99 seats, what the break even load factor would be? I hate to say this, but the company should be doing what it can to attract the few business travelers left, rather than take a step back and cater to the once a year travelers (who, by the way, are much more of a problem during irregular ops than those of us who know the deal). This would include rational business fares, and enhanced rather than gutted premium cabin services.

The vast majority of us do appreciate you folks, and I for one am very vocal about it--to other passengers as well as to CA. I can only apologize for those who you refer to as self proclaimed "royalty", but now that you mention it, since I fly 99.9% of my travel on US Airways, it almost is like a personal airline to me--one in which I feel I have a vested interest.

Good luck and keep up the good work.

 

[ClueByFour]

Cluebyfour didn't say anything about "deserving" an upgrade. He's telling you that he values it so much that he'll fly elsewhere in order to ensure that he gets it. BBB ought to be listening very carefully to that.

ClueByFour is not saying he deserves an upgrade. He's saying that the back end of a U 757 is such a miserable experience that I'll look elsewhere.

I'd happily ride in a MRTC 757 on AA or an E+ seat on a UA 757. I'm not going to ride in a U 32" "slave ship" config. It's that simple.

A 321 with laptop power and a little more pitch, I'd do. The 757s are bad enough in back that the VFF who knows better simply avoids it for other equipment. Since U seems hell bent on running "slave ship" configurations to "leisure" destinations, I'll work around it even if it includes taking someone else.

I'm not a particular upgrade hound. I rarely upgrade my AA flights or flights on UA. The coach product does not bother me enough. U's boeing coach product (and by that I mean 737/757, and especially the 767s) is horrid in comparison with the available alternatives. If seeking out the most comfortable experience makes me royalty, I guess it makes those who don't gullible or stupid (and while that may be B. Ben's target market, I've never been a fan of stupid decisions to help an overpaid wanker like B. Ben self-fulfill his marketing prophecies).

As for Twicebaked--

I think you would be hard pressed to find me on a U aircraft. I make it a point to do everything possible to become invisible to the crew so that they can concentrate on making a great impression on the not-so-frequent flyers who are on board. This happens regardless of my ticketed cabin.

 

[TomBascom]

Business travel has decreased tremendously and is still declining. AGAIN, although we appreciate the continued business, US has no guarantee that business travel will increase. Therefore, they need to shift a bit to the leisure travel. Those pax will always be there. Technology won't bring Florida or the islands to them as will corporations bring meetings an what not to you via technology.

This is management kool-aid. If it makes you feel better about what they've done to you that's nice but it isn't even remotely true. In the long run playing this "the customer is the enemy" game isn't going to help you. It will just continue to fuel management's need for cost cutting.

Business travel is not all that reduced (if at all). Nor is it significantly impacted by technology (aka video conferencing). Your planes probably carry a greater percentage of business travelers (persons traveling to do business) now than they did 2 years ago. While the leisure travelers fret and worry about all the bad things that might happen to them we're out there every week going to and fro. It hasn't stopped.

What has happened is that business travelers have stopped bending over while handing the lubricant to Uncle Ben and buying so-called business fares. Genius' like BBB then say "business travel is down". If Ben and his cronies would get their heads out of their butts and walk around in an airport talking to customers and maybe even fly on a few of their own planes they might get an idea or two about what is really going on in the world.

 

[Busdrvr]

Art and Tom.
UALs 757's still have 24 FC seats, and if you don't want to use up your miles, then enjoy the 35" seat pitch in econ plus, free movie and channel 9. Come on over! We'll appreciate your business.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

I wish U would adopt a lot of UAL's inflight, including seating and cleanliness. I don't have enough experience on UAL to judge service, but I don't go for the super-friendliness, anyway.

 

[taylor01]

If its such a great marketing tool why doesn't WN and B6 have first class?

 

[taylor01]

I'll tell you why cause there in business to make money!!!


oops I answered my own question....Sorry!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MarkMyWords]

This is the arguement that I just love. The company makes a business decision that makes sense, and all of a sudden people are jumping ship because they feel that we are taking something away from them. Let me try to put this in prospective one more time. The routes that we will be flying these reconfigured 757's on will be high density, low yield markets. Most of them will be to Florida. Currently the 757's that we fly with the current configuration does not make sense. We offer 24 seats in a market that only usually requires 8 to accomodate most of the demand. Cities like MCO, TPA, FLL, PBI, etc do not have that many customers upgrade to fill a 24 seat cabin. So we usually end up departing with empty seats, or do courtesy upgrades for the oversales in coach. During peak travel seasons like Easter and Patriots Day Weekend, inventory services usually blocks 1/2 the seats in the first class cabin, and oversells the coach cabin by those additional 12 seats (on top of the 10-15% standard no-show). The new configuration does more accurately meet supply with customer demand, while adding additional coach revenues over the same cost structure. That is it pure and simple!

Rather then US taking the same approach as DL with Song and eliminating the first class cabin completely, we learned from our mistakes with MetroJet. When we had MetroJet flying, our number one customer complaint was that there was not a premium cabin for its loyal frequent fliers. And I do agree that having the cabin is a perk that keeps many of our valued top tier frequent fliers with us. (Thank you by the way.) Many of these newly configured 757's will be flying routes primarily in Florida and the Caribbean. The demand for first class seats to the islands are also not worth keeping 24 seats.

Again, we are not taing anything away from you as a customer. If you are a top tiered frequent flier, you will still have the same possibility to upgrade on the routes that we fly. We are more accurately aligning supply with demand.

 

[LavMan]

The first reconfiguration is scheduled for 10-26

 

[TomBascom]

This is the arguement that I just love. The company makes a business decision that makes sense, and all of a sudden people are jumping ship because they feel that we are taking something away from them. Let me try to put this in prospective one more time. The routes that we will be flying these reconfigured 757's on will be high density, low yield markets. Most of them will be to Florida. Currently the 757's that we fly with the current configuration does not make sense. We offer 24 seats in a market that only usually requires 8 to accomodate most of the demand. Cities like MCO, TPA, FLL, PBI, etc do not have that many customers upgrade to fill a 24 seat cabin. So we usually end up departing with empty seats, or do courtesy upgrades for the oversales in coach. During peak travel seasons like Easter and Patriots Day Weekend, inventory services usually blocks 1/2 the seats in the first class cabin, and oversells the coach cabin by those additional 12 seats (on top of the 10-15% standard no-show). The new configuration does more accurately meet supply with customer demand, while adding additional coach revenues over the same cost structure. That is it pure and simple!

Rather then US taking the same approach as DL with Song and eliminating the first class cabin completely, we learned from our mistakes with MetroJet. When we had MetroJet flying, our number one customer complaint was that there was not a premium cabin for its loyal frequent fliers. And I do agree that having the cabin is a perk that keeps many of our valued top tier frequent fliers with us. (Thank you by the way.) Many of these newly configured 757's will be flying routes primarily in Florida and the Caribbean. The demand for first class seats to the islands are also not worth keeping 24 seats.

Again, we are not taing anything away from you as a customer. If you are a top tiered frequent flier, you will still have the same possibility to upgrade on the routes that we fly. We are more accurately aligning supply with demand.

That all sounds nice and sensible. You'll have to forgive me for being somewhat cynical and disbelieving.

I don't suppose you could clarify "usually requires 8 to satisfy most of the demand." That sounds a lot like "we would frequently deny upgrades if we had 8 F seats". Some actual numbers would be useful although I doubt that the proper statistics are tracked.

A more innovative and customer friendly solution to the "problem" of "too large" an F cabin in so-called leisure markets might be to relax the rules about upgrading award tickets. Or perhaps you could sell upgrades to anyone who wants them if there really aren't any preferred members queing for them. Sell it for $50 each way and you've covered your additional coach seating.

I'm also more than just a little skeptical about the claim that this will only ever be seen in these markets... :unsure:

Anyhow, if what you say is actually true and the traffic & demand numbers really back it up then yes this makes sense and might even work (although I think there are better solutions). But given marketings track record I think a healthy dose of skepticism and paranoia is in order and quite appropriate.

 

[USFlyer]

This is the arguement that I just love. The company makes a business decision that makes sense, and all of a sudden people are jumping ship because they feel that we are taking something away from them.

Go look at flyertalk.com and you'll see a bunch of people criticizing every decision US makes, yet for some odd reason they haven't moved their business elsewhere. The problem is, for the most part, reading bulletin boards does not give a good sampling of the opinions of Preferred flyers out there. Most of us are simply too busy to really care if the F cabin has two rows or thirty rows. Flying is what it is for VFFs -- a means to get somewhere else to work!

Had to vent ... As a US1, I want you guys to do whatever it takes to survive long term. Removing F seats on some planes seems logical to me. (FWIW, I also think the A321 F cabin is simply too big.)

 

[Hope777]

I have a few different opinions on this. After thinking about this for some time, I think this is a poor move. I must admitt I thought it was good in the begining but again after thinking about it I think it is a poor marketing move. The reason for this is follows, If we ran point to point like Piney compares us to NK, we would not need as many 1st Classs seats so eight would work. BUT, in our Hub and Spoke system it requires more 1st Class seating. The reasoning for this is that if someone wanted to purchase a 1st seat from say BOS, LGA, EWR, ALB, RDU and so forth we need the capacity to handle them from the Hub, say CLT. Now if we flew from the above cities to FL or even Vegas, the demand for the 1st Class Cabin is greatly reduced. So, unless we are going to use these aircraft to over-fly the Hubs, this just another one of BBB Blunders. If we are not going to use these aircraft to over-fly the Hubs, we should start pulling F/C seats out of all the other aircraft as well. Just my 2cents.....

 

[TomBascom]

If its such a great marketing tool why doesn't WN and B6 have first class?

Because you're after a different market segment.

Which you better be happy about because you don't stand a chance against WN, B6 et al on a level playing field. Your costs will never match theirs and your leisure product is inferior (that's why you sell it for less than they do...)

 

[Twicebaked]

Piney,
With all due and "little deserving" respect, you continually tell us employees that no one is forcing us to stay with this company. You continually say leave if you don't like it. (maybe not those exact words but you get the point) The same goes for YOU. If you don't like what BBB or this company is doing.... LEAVE. We appreciate loyalty, but the bitching has got to stop. Do everyone on this board a favor. If YOU are unhappy with US leave and don't let a flight attendant kick you in the ### on the way out.

I have never heard anyone complain soooooooo much about the same thing over and over again..blah blah blah blah blah

 

[USFlyer]

I couldn't agree more. Again, go look at flyertalk.com. I've never seen so many unhappy people. But, as I've said, the vast majority of VFFs don't post on bulletin boards. I know a bunch of US1/US2/US3 folks who wouldn't recognize a different cabin configuration if their lives depended on it.