American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

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ALUS78 said:
Tim you and I both know Sito is incompetent and therefore unpredictable but do you think we will see much less vote on a company offer before section 6?
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Lol. That's the problem with these unions, they have absolute morons running them as the morons climb the corporate ladder within them. Members aren't the smartest either as they rent out their brains and believe every chest thumping bull chit update. Members don't deserve to have their health care stolen from them with a company making Billions but they dumb and are for their own destructed benefits.

Sito won't file section 6 without the expedited resolution process (toss in another 6 months). Him and CB don't care, they are both making hundreds of thousands and don't have to go without pay raises. But, it's in Sito's hands. Alex is submissive to Sito and actually worships the dude. The company has moved on and will be getting ready to address flight attendant and pilot issues. Actually, the company is mind numbed. They believe that if Sito showed the offer that the employees would overwhelmingly vote yes. They are protecting all jobs and status, but offer no protections to the unborn. The union is trying to protect its future dues and is leveraging us for the unborn. The reality is that the work will fade as people retire and quit. Company wants to grandfather the work to us but backfill with vendors or new hires that aren't protected in most stations regarding everything other than loading and unloading. Even catering will be protected but it will be backfilled as people quit or retire. For those of us on the payroll at JCBA time, it's a job for life, for new hires maybe not.

And now isn't the time for the company to wipe out 1,200 IAM jobs but if the Association commences or continues a slowdown then everything will be fair game and gloves will come off imo.
 
Tim Nelson said:
Lol. That's the problem with these unions, they have absolute morons running them as the morons climb the corporate ladder within them. Members aren't the smartest either as they rent out their brains and believe every chest thumping bull chit update. Members don't deserve to have their health care stolen from them with a company making Billions but they dumb and are for their own destructed benefits.

Sito won't file section 6 without the expedited resolution process (toss in another 6 months). Him and CB don't care, they are both making hundreds of thousands and don't have to go without pay raises. But, it's in Sito's hands. Alex is submissive to Sito and actually worships the dude. The company has moved on and will be getting ready to address flight attendant and pilot issues. Actually, the company is mind numbed. They believe that if Sito showed the offer that the employees would overwhelmingly vote yes. They are protecting all jobs and status, but offer no protections to the unborn. The union is trying to protect its future dues and is leveraging us for the unborn. The reality is that the work will fade as people retire and quit. Company wants to grandfather the work to us but backfill with vendors or new hires that aren't protected in most stations regarding everything other than loading and unloading. Even catering will be protected but it will be backfilled as people quit or retire. For those of us on the payroll at JCBA time, it's a job for life, for new hires maybe not.

And now isn't the time for the company to wipe out 1,200 IAM jobs but if the Association commences or continues a slowdown then everything will be fair game and gloves will come off imo.
Click to expand...
Yes Tim these members will believe anything they hear from the union even after being bullchitted for decades.Lemmings or fools or maybe just lemming fools
 
ALUS78 said:
Yes Tim these members will believe anything they hear from the union even after being bullchitted for decades.Lemmings or fools or maybe just lemming fools
Click to expand...
It is what it is Al. Morons leading Morons. Just ignorant uneducated people who continue to get abused by their very own union. Just like the IAM pension. It's amazing how these morons rent out their brains to retarded people who are smart enough to rob them and loot their pension and their dues and make hundreds of thousands of dollars in salaries then toss out dopey screaming updates about "We are fighting like hell for you."

I'm sure NYer and others also feel the same way but maybe our members will finally do the math in a few years after they been stripped of health care and have to endure yet another cut in their pension. I doubt they will listen or learn so they will remain stupid. After the pension gets cut again, these morons will probably buy the IAM bull chit "Hey, if you just have the company up your contribution to about $2.50 an hour, you can once again get your benefit about $54."

I mean, when the IAM pantsed everyone and cut our future benefit from $84 to $48, the AGC's went around and said no big deal, in negotiations we will just get the company to up the contribution amounts and bring you back closer to $84 that we robbed from ya." People bought it hook line and sinker for a couple months then they forgot. I did a video even showing the official reports, and dopes like CLTrat said it was fake news and that his plan is in the green. Never understanding anything. Good Grief! They dumb but they love getting hosed by their enemies who keep taking their money.
 
BTW, I am not sure how the IAM Pension Bosses are going to slice it this time but they have to shave a few billion off of liabilities. If they eliminate the early out without penalty then that might cut at least a $1 billion. if that happens then you won't be able to get your IAM pension until you are 65 unless you want a 5% penalty for each year prior to 65. Right now, it's unreduced as long as you have 85 points, i.e., 55 and 30 years, etc. We were imputed credit back in 2003 so at 58 and 33 I can retire now with nothing reduced (not much but $1,150). If the Trustees cut our benefits then we are hosed, but if they abolish the unreduced plans then us casual airline people who retire before our 60th Bday will be boned and have to work until we are 65. Thank Cltrat and PJ for that since they are on the hate train and didn't support bringing the Grand Lodge (overfunded pension) into the IAM Pension to help THEIR pension sustain and ours. Sad.
 
I do not think the recent offers by the company are helping them. If they do read these forums then I will tell them I do not think what they are doing is going to work.

Their old strategy of trying to give one side something to pass might have worked. Now all they have done is frustrate both sides. There could be a small minority of people on here, the ones that make wacky decisions at work and outside of work, and make other decisions that are obviously detrimental to their careers who might vote yes. The company had already lost many LUS votes by trying to get rid of the LUS medical. By making SCOPE much less certain, the company will lose the AA side or enough of them to vote down an agreement that might include reduced medical for the LUS side.

This tells me the company does not want an agreement. Maybe they are waiting until the last moment to come back and say ok we will give you the SCOPE that we agreed to back. Any possible TA without LUS medical and with a big loss in SCOPE will never pass and I doubt the negotiators would bring it back. The LUS side will already have difficulty in bringing back anything without the LUS medical and I do not see any way they will bring back something with a lot less SCOPE.

This is a bad move in my opinion. I will not vote for anything without a very clear definition of SCOPE, part time limits, job protection, and how positions will be backfilled. And to the person who seems to care nothing about the employees who will come after us, and who also cares nothing about unions and organized labor, you do not belong in a union much less in charge of one. The Association is probably better off, with fewer people who behave like this (personally, professionally and politically) as members. Maybe the other people here who think the same way can all get together and form their own anti-union union?

I do not see myself voting for anything that says that jobs can be filled with outsource workers after we all start to leave. Have we forgotten the anger that different scales caused in the past when there were huge differences in compensation for doing the same work?

CB Prez and NYer please do not even bother bringing something back that authorizes unlimited outsourcing now or later. I think the association should do a better job about informing everyone about how bad unlimited outsource newhires would be.
 
gulfcoast1 said:
I do not think the recent offers by the company are helping them. If they do read these forums then I will tell them I do not think what they are doing is going to work.

Their old strategy of trying to give one side something to pass might have worked. Now all they have done is frustrate both sides. There could be a small minority of people on here, the ones that make wacky decisions at work and outside of work, and make other decisions that are obviously detrimental to their careers who might vote yes. The company had already lost many LUS votes by trying to get rid of the LUS medical. By making SCOPE much less certain, the company will lose the AA side or enough of them to vote down an agreement that might include reduced medical for the LUS side.

This tells me the company does not want an agreement. Maybe they are waiting until the last moment to come back and say ok we will give you the SCOPE that we agreed to back. Any possible TA without LUS medical and with a big loss in SCOPE will never pass and I doubt the negotiators would bring it back. The LUS side will already have difficulty in bringing back anything without the LUS medical and I do not see any way they will bring back something with a lot less SCOPE.

This is a bad move in my opinion. I will not vote for anything without a very clear definition of SCOPE, part time limits, job protection, and how positions will be backfilled. And to the person who seems to care nothing about the employees who will come after us, and who also cares nothing about unions and organized labor, you do not belong in a union much less in charge of one. The Association is probably better off, with fewer people who behave like this (personally, professionally and politically) as members. Maybe the other people here who think the same way can all get together and form their own anti-union union?

I do not see myself voting for anything that says that jobs can be filled with outsource workers after we all start to leave. Have we forgotten the anger that different scales caused in the past when there were huge differences in compensation for doing the same work?

CB Prez and NYer please do not even bother bringing something back that authorizes unlimited outsourcing now or later. I think the association should do a better job about informing everyone about how bad unlimited outsource newhires would be.
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Buckle up gulfcoast, I was informed it's about to get real serious real quick.
 
gulfcoast1 said:
I do not think the recent offers by the company are helping them. If they do read these forums then I will tell them I do not think what they are doing is going to work.

Their old strategy of trying to give one side something to pass might have worked. Now all they have done is frustrate both sides. There could be a small minority of people on here, the ones that make wacky decisions at work and outside of work, and make other decisions that are obviously detrimental to their careers who might vote yes. The company had already lost many LUS votes by trying to get rid of the LUS medical. By making SCOPE much less certain, the company will lose the AA side or enough of them to vote down an agreement that might include reduced medical for the LUS side.

This tells me the company does not want an agreement. Maybe they are waiting until the last moment to come back and say ok we will give you the SCOPE that we agreed to back. Any possible TA without LUS medical and with a big loss in SCOPE will never pass and I doubt the negotiators would bring it back. The LUS side will already have difficulty in bringing back anything without the LUS medical and I do not see any way they will bring back something with a lot less SCOPE.

This is a bad move in my opinion. I will not vote for anything without a very clear definition of SCOPE, part time limits, job protection, and how positions will be backfilled. And to the person who seems to care nothing about the employees who will come after us, and who also cares nothing about unions and organized labor, you do not belong in a union much less in charge of one. The Association is probably better off, with fewer people who behave like this (personally, professionally and politically) as members. Maybe the other people here who think the same way can all get together and form their own anti-union union?

I do not see myself voting for anything that says that jobs can be filled with outsource workers after we all start to leave. Have we forgotten the anger that different scales caused in the past when there were huge differences in compensation for doing the same work?

CB Prez and NYer please do not even bother bringing something back that authorizes unlimited outsourcing now or later. I think the association should do a better job about informing everyone about how bad unlimited outsource newhires would be.
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I agree with a lot you say but if they came out with a contract offer with all the goodies Tim described and chitty scope it will pass by 85%..personally with a scope you described I would vote no even being safe with 40 years and in NYC
 
AANOTOK said:
Nope! A fly only tells one person, this was told to multiple people.
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That would be funny if he got his information from Tim in Facebook cause that is what he pretty much is saying.You know how rumors roll at this place
 
Tim Nelson said:
It is what it is Al. Morons leading Morons. Just ignorant uneducated people who continue to get abused by their very own union. Just like the IAM pension. It's amazing how these morons rent out their brains to retarded people who are smart enough to rob them and loot their pension and their dues and make hundreds of thousands of dollars in salaries then toss out dopey screaming updates about "We are fighting like hell for you."

I'm sure NYer and others also feel the same way but maybe our members will finally do the math in a few years after they been stripped of health care and have to endure yet another cut in their pension. I doubt they will listen or learn so they will remain stupid. After the pension gets cut again, these morons will probably buy the IAM bull chit "Hey, if you just have the company up your contribution to about $2.50 an hour, you can once again get your benefit about $54."

I mean, when the IAM pantsed everyone and cut our future benefit from $84 to $48, the AGC's went around and said no big deal, in negotiations we will just get the company to up the contribution amounts and bring you back closer to $84 that we robbed from ya." People bought it hook line and sinker for a couple months then they forgot. I did a video even showing the official reports, and dopes like CLTrat said it was fake news and that his plan is in the green. Never understanding anything. Good Grief! They dumb but they love getting hosed by their enemies who keep taking their money.
Click to expand...

Look here you stupid fk, I have never ever wasted my time looking at one of your stupid videos much less commented on one.thats just another in a long list of lies for you,anytime you post you’re either lying or feeding your massive ego.
I sure don’t buy everything Sito says and I out right dislike Klemm but you sure as hell ain’t the answer.The only dopes I know are you and your brainwashed followers.
Personally I wouldn’t vote you for jock washing attention
 
cltrat said:
Look here you stupid fk, I have never ever wasted my time looking at one of your stupid videos much less commented on one.thats just another in a long list of lies for you,anytime you post you’re either lying or feeding your massive ego.
I sure don’t buy everything Sito says and I out right dislike Klemm but you sure as hell ain’t the answer.The only dopes I know are you and your brainwashed followers.
Personally I wouldn’t vote you for jock washing attention
Click to expand...
Maybe he thinks you're somebody your not
 
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