American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[dfw gen]

LUS didn't take LAA out of BK, it was Chapter 11 not Chapter 7.

It was a merger, not a purchase.

Take over, complete with a purging

 

[swamt]

BS they are not eliminating any jobs that’s BS union speak to keep stringing us along and think they are saving us just like the left wing liberal government democrats
The company is trying to streamline the operations to be more competitive to be able to survive the next downturn in our economy.
They have stated more than once no one is loosing their job but you can be damn sure there will be layoffs if the union keeps stonewalling on this deal.
Every time they have met over the last year the company offers improvements in the agreement but the union just kept saying no.
Screw the union they are worthless POS who have no interest in helping any of us while they line their pockets with our dues money

What about catering? And there was two other groups they were trying to outsource or get rid of, I just forget what they were. Others on here have verified this is in the co. offer.
Do you really think it is just rhetoric from the union? I bet some thought it was all rhetoric when they wanted de-ice and push backs too huh? Don't assume, it may come back and hit you hard right on the nose out of the blue.

 

[lax]

You must know a number 4 airline can't afford as much as a number 1 airline.

We wouldn't even be making what we're making let alone get what's been proposed.

Delta, United and American have always been on par in my time in this biz. I'm sure it would've stayed that way with or without lus. If LAA wanted lus that much they could've waited till they went out of business

 

[Vortilon]

LAA did not bail out LUS. LAA was in CH11. LUS brought LAA n took them.out of ch11. DP went behind our backs to garner support from LAA unions n it was a success while we waited n waited for contract

Can't rewrite history: https://www.wsj.com/articles/american-airlines-us-airways-complete-merger-1386599350

 

[swamt]

Your position is neither established or supported in any way since all contracts have "line item" concessions of some sort.

I think the contract offer on the table at AA can be established as > AMFA WN contract. I think it will be easy to do so. It simply is worth more per capita. Same with fleet.
The math simply doesnt lie. The fleet proposal is a $120 million cost positive per year. Im not sure of the mx but even with line item concessions on scope its more than amfa. Look, i like amfa and, because of the large wage spike at wn, it was imputed at AA and amfa gets credit for that, especially since the dopey association didnt even ask for wages that high.
But, the association will and should get final credit.

Your right, people do look at ILC differently. Myself views ILC as comparing contract to contract from say other airlines. I like to compare the overall contract not just tid bits here and there. In my mind UPS has the almighty contract, not only in pay, but, also with the bennies, medical, retirement, vac, hol., etc...
Now of course AA cost of the contract will be way-way more than ours was or is, just due to the numbers of the workgroups. Since this asso represents what--7 different groups covering, what--15K-20K people? Of course their cost will be much greater, that's a no brainer.

 

[NYer]

Delta, United and American have always been on par in my time in this biz. I'm sure it would've stayed that way with or without lus. If LAA wanted lus that much they could've waited till they went out of business

United became larger and broader with the Continental tie up. Delta became larger and broader with the Northwest tie up. AA would have been 4th in size without the merger, substantially behind UA, DL and SW.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

I believe industry leading is over all cost of the package not individual articles

what does that mean? overall cost? some airlines have more employees than others. some airlines gift their employees with an additional 15% of their yearly wages in one check.

if aa doesn't tick the box as industry-leading in every article...then, employees who have been around long enough, will know if it's industry-leading, or, not.

the definition of nude art vs. porn, as given by a supreme court justice: "i'll know it when i see it".

 

[CremaDiLimone]

And we wouldn't be in a position to gain as much as we will. The merger was mutually beneficial.

i can't agree, in fact, i have to disagree. lus have clearly benefited more...from seniority issues to pay issues to medical insurance to even the bonus the company has proposed.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

LAA did not bail out LUS. LAA was in CH11. LUS brought LAA n took them.out of ch11. DP went behind our backs to garner support from LAA unions n it was a success while we waited n waited for contract

how much did parker-isom pay horton for the keys to the store? we merged, can't have 2 ceos.

 

[robbedagain]

Can't rewrite history: https://www.wsj.com/articles/american-airlines-us-airways-complete-merger-1386599350

And with the merger AA came out of CH11. Cant rewrite history. But without the merger where would AA be at today? US would be most likely profitable but not on the scale it is with the merger

 

[robbedagain]

how much did parker-isom pay horton for the keys to the store? we merged, can't have 2 ceos.

Didnt horton stay on just short time following the merger?

 

[CremaDiLimone]

And with the merger AA came out of CH11. Cant rewrite history. But without the merger where would AA be at today? US would be most likely profitable but not on the scale it is with the merger

aa filed years after everyone else, including us air twice..because aa couldn't compete funding our pensions as dl/ua and us air didn't need $10 fare hikes to fund pensions since they had already filed and trimmed labor costs.

aa filed with over $4 billion in the bank. i don't believe lus ever had that kind of money, ever.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Didnt horton stay on just short time following the merger?

he did, but the agreement was for him to step down after getting a nice piece of coin - so nice of a piece of coin, the bk judge had a conniption fit.

 

[NYer]

i can't agree, in fact, i have to disagree. lus have clearly benefited more...from seniority issues to pay issues to medical insurance to even the bonus the company has proposed.

Always looking into someone else's backyard.

Without the merger TWU Members wouldn't stand to make the gains they'll eventually have under a JCBA. As a standalone, we would not be anywhere near even the Company's current proposal. We certainly wouldn't be making what we are.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Always looking into someone else's backyard.

Without the merger TWU Members wouldn't stand to make the gains they'll eventually have under a JCBA. As a standalone, we would not be anywhere near even the Company's current proposal. We certainly wouldn't be making what we are.

you're entitled to that opinion..

united, 3rd largest/4th most profitable airline - at the time...got the ball rolling to $30/hr for fleet/ramp.

that tells me that being #1 has nothing to do with anything. southwest isn't the largest nor most profitable...what do they pay their fleet and AMTs?

as far as looking into the other backyards...it's allowed, in our industry.