American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[P. REZ]

They want Fleet pissed so we'll vote against it and keep track with Maintenance who will vote no.

All the talk about "when and where directed" and ask the attrition stuff but NO ONE can point towards that language. (It doesn't exist)

Speak to a PHX BSO Agent, they are being outsourced because of "when and where directed" language! That job was always in house since AWA started in 1983. Stations have outsourced UM work upstairs because of "when and where directed" language, this with a company who has made how many Billions since the merger? How many Billions in cash? How many Billions in stock buyback?

Oh, there's a reason we are stuck on scope!

 

[NYer]

Speak to a PHX BSO Agent, they are being outsourced because of "when and where directed" language! That job was always in house since AWA started in 1983. Stations have outsourced UM work upstairs because of "when and where directed" language, this with a company who has made how many Billions since the merger? How many Billions in cash? How many Billions in stock buyback?

Oh, there's a reason we are stuck on scope!

4 words strung together doesn't necessarily mean the same thing to everyone that uses those 4 words in the same order.

Point towards the Company proposal where it leads to the elimination of jobs because those 4 words... Which aren't in the Scope article to begin with.

If you read the language as it's meant to be read, please show how that eliminates jobs. Please.

 

[ALUS78]

[/QUOTE]

Speak to a PHX BSO Agent, they are being outsourced because of "when and where directed" language! That job was always in house since AWA started in 1983. Stations have outsourced UM work upstairs because of "when and where directed" language, this with a company who has made how many Billions since the merger? How many Billions in cash? How many Billions in stock buyback?

Oh, there's a reason we are stuck on scope!

There was no doubt they were going to lose those jobs when the contract was signed wording in contract maybe but probably more so that AA was already outsourcing bso .

 

[V.O. Reason]

My understanding of the CS agents contract was the language was clear that BSO would be contracted in some cities.
I don’t think they were surprised by it

 

[P. REZ]

4 words strung together doesn't necessarily mean the same thing to everyone that uses those 4 words in the same order.

Point towards the Company proposal where it leads to the elimination of jobs because those 4 words... Which aren't in the Scope article to begin with.

If you read the language as it's meant to be read, please show how that eliminates jobs. Please.

I'm not understanding your issue with the language. It means they can give you work not spelled out in the contract or take away work you are currently doing if not protected. That work in PHX would be lavs, water and mail. They will methodically outsource one piece at a time if the current scope being proposed is voted in. Can I 100% say so? No, but look upstairs. A conversation with the Cargo Director in PHX a few months ago was very telling as well. Oh, and I've never seen any work given to us in PHX. As a matter of fact, they outsourced catering security while we were in negotiations.

 

[P. REZ]

My understanding of the CS agents contract was the language was clear that BSO would be contracted in some cities.
I don’t think they were surprised by it

It was worded that it could be CSC's, CSA's, CAR's, contractors or other company employees.

 

[NYer]

I'm not understanding your issue with the language. It means they can give you work not spelled out in the contract or take away work you are currently doing if not protected. That work in PHX would be lavs, water and mail. They will methodically outsource one piece at a time if the current scope being proposed is voted in. Can I 100% say so? No, but look upstairs. A conversation with the Cargo Director in PHX a few months ago was very telling as well. Oh, and I've never seen any work given to us in PHX. As a matter of fact, they outsourced catering security while we were in negotiations.

Have to do better than this: "They will methodically outsource one piece at a time if the current scope being proposed is voted in. Can I 100% say so? No, but look upstairs."

The language is clear. They protect jobs and they tell you in advance what they don't protect. The "when and where directed" does take away protected work.

If it isn't protected then THAT creates the ability to outsource not the "when and where directed."

Actually, that language only spells how we may do those jobs in the areas where they may have been outsourced.

If otherwise, please show us.

 

[1986Mekanic]

Just sharing information, like everyone else.

Yes.. but,,, you are sharing information and coming across as someone that has access to information normally not available to people that post here.

So, in reality you are just another poster speculating about a situation that has been completely unpredictable to the rank and file. And, I predict,,,,,, will continue to be.

 

[NYer]

OK. Here is the language. Article 6 clearly states all current work belongs to those workers in the name cities for the life of the agreement.

So is how the "when and where" language means they can take away rather than what it reads, which is the we can do that work where it isn't protected. I even used the cargo in PHX example your brought up.

Enlightened us.

Article 6B-2.a: At DFW, JFK, LAX, MIA, ORD and PHX, normal and customary cargo warehouse work as described in Classifications and Qualifications Article 7, Paragraph C.3., that is currently insourced, will be performed by employees covered by this Agreement for the duration of this Agreement. All other normal and customary cargo work (i.e., cargo office work) at these six stations may be outsourced. At all other stations, normal and customary cargo work (i.e., cargo warehouse and office work) may be performed by employees covered by this Agreement, or contractors, or other employees of the Company.

Article 7C-3: When and where so directed: normal and customary cargo work including, but not limited to work associated with the handling of cargo office and warehouse functions; normal and customary work associated with the sorting and transporting of cargo.

 

[NYer]

Yes.. but,,, you are sharing information and coming across as someone that has access to information normally not available to people that post here.

So, in reality you are just another poster speculating about a situation that has been completely unpredictable to the rank and file. And, I predict,,,,,, will continue to be.

Never presented myself as anything, any inference is your own.

 

[P. REZ]

Have to do better than this: "They will methodically outsource one piece at a time if the current scope being proposed is voted in. Can I 100% say so? No, but look upstairs."

The language is clear. They protect jobs and they tell you in advance what they don't protect. The "when and where directed" does take away protected work.

If it isn't protected then THAT creates the ability to outsource not the "when and where directed."

Actually, that language only spells how we may do those jobs in the areas where they may have been outsourced.

If otherwise, please show us.

Huh? Work that isn't protected under scope and listed under "when and where directed" could be gone. Look upstairs, their intentions are clear. Our goal in our 14 contract was to protect current work we did but the company kept pushing us towards a JCBA. We got what we could with the intentions of protecting this work moving forward in the JCBA, and here we are, with a company that has made Billions, has Billions in cash and has bought back Billions worth of shares. What now? Stop fighting and cave to GREED?

 

[NYer]

Huh? Work that isn't protected under scope and listed under "when and where directed" could be gone. Look upstairs, their intentions are clear. Our goal in our 14 contract was to protect current work we did but the company kept pushing us towards a JCBA. We got what we could with the intentions of protecting this work moving forward in the JCBA, and here we are, with a company that has made Billions, has Billions in cash and has bought back Billions worth of shares. What now? Stop fighting and cave to GREED?

Stop going upstairs. We have our own language for reference. Show us the language that opens the door for the eliminate jobs with the when and where directed. Just point the way...

 

[P. REZ]

OK. Here is the language. Article 6 clearly states all current work belongs to those workers in the name cities for the life of the agreement.

So is how the "when and where" language means they can take away rather than what it reads, which is the we can do that work where it isn't protected. I even used the cargo in PHX example your brought up.

Enlightened us.

Article 6B-2.a: At DFW, JFK, LAX, MIA, ORD and PHX, normal and customary cargo warehouse work as described in Classifications and Qualifications Article 7, Paragraph C.3., that is currently insourced, will be performed by employees covered by this Agreement for the duration of this Agreement. All other normal and customary cargo work (i.e., cargo office work) at these six stations may be outsourced. At all other stations, normal and customary cargo work (i.e., cargo warehouse and office work) may be performed by employees covered by this Agreement, or contractors, or other employees of the Company.

Article 7C-3: When and where so directed: normal and customary cargo work including, but not limited to work associated with the handling of cargo office and warehouse functions; normal and customary work associated with the sorting and transporting of cargo.

Where is mail in the above language? Not protected!

 

[iluvaa]

Huh? Work that isn't protected under scope and listed under "when and where directed" could be gone. Look upstairs, their intentions are clear. Our goal in our 14 contract was to protect current work we did but the company kept pushing us towards a JCBA. We got what we could with the intentions of protecting this work moving forward in the JCBA, and here we are, with a company that has made Billions, has Billions in cash and has bought back Billions worth of shares. What now? Stop fighting and cave to GREED?

Don’t you needs weapons to fight. What weapons do you think you have in this “fight”?

 

[P. REZ]

Stop going upstairs. We have our own language for reference. Show us the language that opens the door for the eliminate jobs with the when and where directed. Just point the way...

With our current language the company outsourced mail in LAX a few years ago. Under "when and where directed" we were allowed to do mail, then they decided not to direct us to do mail. Mail is gone in LAX unless they want to direct us to do again.