ALPA/USAPA Topic for week of 1/24 to 1/31

[sharktooth]

Except apparently Credit Suisse doesn't understand the DOT reporting requirements for airlines. Being privately held doesn't exempt one from reporting the same into - O/T, baggage, etc. Only being small (less than 1% of domestic passenger revenues) get's an airline out of that requirement. So much for the "sinecure of privacy".....

Jim

But privatizing a company allows one to market oneself without the same oversight. Unless someone messily subpoenas the data, you can report, pretty much, whatever you want.

Jim, you are old enough to know about this kind of behavior. Why would you naively believe there is any kind of accountability here?

 

[end_of_alpa]

You sure can pick'em can't you? They turn on the very people that hired them in the first place. I guess conflict of interest doesn't apply to the Seham's wow.


In this week’s installment of The Seham Series, which explores USAPA’s choice of outside legal advisors, the ACPC will introduce you to the relationship between USAPA’s law firm and the American Independent Cockpit Alliance, Inc. (AICA)—another group that Seham Seham Meltz & Petersen, LLP, started at American Airlines to decertify APA. That’s right, it’s the very same APA the Sehams used to decertify ALPA at American. This article will also further outline the law firm’s track record with the Allied Pilots Association.

The B-Scale Plague

American Airlines adopted the benchmark B-scale in November 1983, permanently reducing pay for newly hired pilots by 50 percent. In fact, under the AA system—negotiated while the Seham firm sat on the labor side of the table—pay rates and pensions for new employees would never merge with those of then-current employees.

Martin Seham wrote proudly of this accomplishment in Cleared for Takeoff: Airline Labor Relations Since Deregulation.

As general counsel to the Allied Pilots Association (APA), the independent certified representative of the American Airlines pilots, I was close to the negotiations that resulted, in 1983, in one of the earliest realization of the two-tier system. APA was not faced with an insolvent or failing carrier; it was, however, forced to deal with an economic environment that had changed dramatically because of the effects of deregulation and was, by virtue of its independence, mandated to reach an agreement consistent with the needs and objectives of its constituency.

—Martin C. Seham

Although B-scales were not a new concept, their initial format was unique to the airline industry. Following American’s lead, other airlines began to demand similar packages—forcing the entire airline labor movement into a new era of concessions. Good for management; bad for pilots, flight attendants, mechanics, and all of the airline industry’s workers.

While ALPA pilots were forced to deal with this blight brought to the industry by APA and the Sehams, not one ALPA pilot group accepted a non-merging two-tier scale. The clearest example of this was the ALPA strike at United in June 1985, when the pilots refused to agree to a non-merging two-tier pay scale.

Ironically, it was ALPA’s success in preventing implementation of the Seham B-scale at UAL that led to the Rakestraw case, where replacement pilots who crossed the picket line attempted to reverse ALPA’s successful efforts to negotiate seniority protection for hundreds of pro-ALPA new-hires who had refused management’s demand to become strikebreakers. USAPA’s law firm now misinterprets and misrepresents this case—in which ALPA protected pilots who adhered to union principle and honored picket lines—as somehow giving it carte blanche to change seniority as it sees fit. To read more, click here.

In fact, following ALPA’s win at United, ALPA pilot groups, through their strength at the bargaining table, led the effort to eliminate the B-scale structure. They did it by working together, forging a pattern and sticking to it—the same way ALPA pilots throughout our industry are working to rebuild our contracts after the era of bankruptcy and ATSB constraints.

Ousting an Independent

Last week we discussed the 1992 firing of the Seham firm as APA’s general counsel. There’s more to this drama, however. Just six months after being dismissed, the Sehams launched a bid to create another independent union for pilots at American Airlines—the American Independent Cockpit Alliance, Inc. (AICA)—with the aid of the McCormick Advisory Group, an administrative support firm that funds start-up “independents.â€

According to its website, “AICA was incorporated in June 1993 . . . and provides all services normally associated with a labor union except collective bargaining. AICA exists to become the certified bargaining representative for the pilots of American Airlines.â€

Seham Seham Meltz & Petersen—the same general counsel that USAPA has hired to represent US Airways pilots—set up another independent union to decertify its own former client, the Allied Pilots Association (APA), the supposed model for USAPA.

In fact, the AICA website refers to Martin Seham’s experience as APA counsel to show his ability to help establish “independent†unions. It does not mention Seham’s dismissal by APA.

The AICA website also talks favorably about the law firm’s representation of management. Of the firm’s lawyers, the site states: “They have had the experience of sitting on both sides of the table and share one of the greatest aids to negotiated settlements; that is, the ability to put oneself in the other guy’s shoes.†That is a fancy way of saying that the firm, while it primarily represents management, attempts to walk on our side of the street but has no allegiance or loyalty to labor or to unions.

The fundamental question is this: Does Seham Seham Meltz & Petersen help establish independent unions to represent labor?

We don’t think so. Simply put, USAPA’s law firm acts in a way that seeks to divide and conquer labor and, at the same time, helps management undermine contract standards and set legal precedent that is favorable only to management.

The ACPC will further examine Seham Seham Meltz & Petersen’s litigation and bargaining work in the weeks to come and provide some examples of how the efforts of USAPA’s law firm have harmed pilots and the entire labor movement.

For example, in future issues, you’ll see that the firm has also worked to undermine other AFL-CIO unions like the IAM through their representation of AMFA—similar to its work to undermine the APA after being dismissed as its general counsel in 1992.

The Seham Series will explore the track record of Seham Seham Meltz & Petersen, LLP, the law firm that USAPA has hired for legal advice and counsel, to help you make an informed business decision with all the facts on the table. Stay tuned for next week’s installment. You can also read the entire series, as it rolls out, on the ACPC website.

Rhetoric gets UGLY NOW! Pilot's do IT to pilots. DON'T BLAME THE LAW FIRMS!

New stuff coming out shortly. Don't want to "spill the beans" so we'll wait for a few days and see what the cat drags in. Shall we?

 

[end_of_alpa]

Let me see if I have this right. It took you months to swindle cards out of members, and now you claim that you were ale to do in one week what it took you months to do?? Yeah right!!

Swindle. Guess we'll see who's doing the ole "bait and switch" when the NMB checks the cards, then, won't we?

 

[AWA320]

You wouldn't believe me back then, why would I expect you to accept and believe me now? I think swindle is a little short sighted on your part, don't you?



To put it mildly. Wrong!!

Lets vote already!!

Talk to two very close long time friends on the east side. Both told very simular stories of being met by usapa clowns with cards in hand when they pulled in to the jetway. Not wanting a conflict right there in the jetway they both signed cards. Both said they have absoluty zero intention of voteing for usapa. I wonder how many more you've unprofessionally approached in this manner and will do the same and not vote for a clown organization. You guys are a class act all the way and you have Benedict Arnold as your legal advisor Go for it...

 

[end_of_alpa]

Dariencc,

The post above could possibly be interpreted as a personal attack. You may dispute the issues but you may not insult or attack the poster.

This is a final warning--do NOT make it personal. The next personal attack on this thread gets the thread closed and we will not allow another thread on this subject for a week, while those responsible spend that time in the cornfield.

Its okay to argue passionately--you've all been doing that. But some of you have crossed the line. The post above teeters on the edge, but in future, leave the PERSON out of it.

Cornfield. Is that where the corn liquer is made???? (Liquer....I don't even know her!!)

 

[end_of_alpa]

Talk to two very close long time friends on the east side. Both told very simular stories of being met by usapa clowns with cards in hand when they pulled in to the jetway. Not wanting a conflict right there in the jetway they both signed cards. Both said they have absoluty zero intention of voteing for usapa. I wonder how many more you've unprofessionally approached in this manner and will do the same and not vote for a clown organization. You guys are a class act all the way and you have Benedict Arnold as your legal advisor Go for it...

You're scaring me now. We have never ASSAULTED pilots on the jetway. If they didn't want to sign a card, they did'nt have to. How do YOU know whether they vote yes or no? Are they going to turn over their ballots to you to vote for them? I say prove it. Well just see how the numbers work out.

 

[Phoenix]

ALPA is in a predicament.

They are funding an ACPC to spread the ALPA gospel but no one can find the authority by which it operates. They have a Blue Ribbon Committee but it too is operating by protocols that the BRC members themselves have agreed to but have not disclosed to the rest of us. ALPA leaders themselves tell us we are in unchartered waters. They didn’t have a plan and now they are making it up as they go. I sympathize with them. They have a problem and their policies didn’t foresee the reality that they would hamstring themselves in fixing it, so they have to be inventive.

The predicament now is that if they convince the AAA and AWA pilots to negotiate an agreeable fix to the Nicolau award, by way of the specious BRC of six pilots, then they have made their problem even bigger because they have persuaded everyone that Nicolau is not final and binding. When did the respective ALPA MECs grant the three members from each side to negotiate the Nicolau? And did they skirt their own constitution and bylaws to come up with it?

If ALPA finds a solution then it will serve as a wonderful starting point for a union that could propose it for ratification without skirting its constitution and bylaws.

Additionally, remaining in ALPA only serves to keep the two groups polarized because a contract can be vetoed by either side. A contract ratification under USAPA would actually moderate the two extremes (contrary to popular belief there are moderates) and make a mutual solution more attainable (it is simply a matter of math).

The only thing left for ALPA to endear pilots to it over the other union is ALPA’s history, which brings us full circle to the first line.

Be that as it may, if there is an election the leaders of whichever union prevails will have an extraordinary challenge in leading pilots to remain civil and quell the cheering and catcalls back and forth.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Talk to two very close long time friends on the east side. Both told very simular stories of being met by usapa clowns with cards in hand when they pulled in to the jetway. Not wanting a conflict right there in the jetway they both signed cards. Both said they have absoluty zero intention of voteing for usapa. I wonder how many more you've unprofessionally approached in this manner and will do the same and not vote for a clown organization. You guys are a class act all the way and you have Benedict Arnold as your legal advisor Go for it...

I think, out of friendship and considering your present position, they wouldn't tell you the real story anyway. Actually we are a class act and that is really bothering you isn't? How else would you characterize what we've accomplished in such a short amount of time? Please keep posting the attacks. It only solidifies my reasons for finally getting out of such a fine organization such as ALPA.

 

[Gunther737]

Talk to two very close long time friends on the east side. Both told very simular stories of being met by usapa clowns with cards in hand when they pulled in to the jetway. Not wanting a conflict right there in the jetway they both signed cards. Both said they have absoluty zero intention of voteing for usapa. I wonder how many more you've unprofessionally approached in this manner and will do the same and not vote for a clown organization. You guys are a class act all the way and you have Benedict Arnold as your legal advisor Go for it...

I find your story highly suspect AWA320. First, I flew all week last week and never had anyone approach me in the jetway or otherwise. Secondly, why would someone fill out a card to avoid a "conflict"? Would it not be easier to just say, "I already sent one in yesterday"? To be able to get 3000 replacement cards in one weeks time should tell you that there is finally some real solidarity on part of this property.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

ALPA is in a predicament.

Phoenix,

That is a great post. Very insightful.

 

[AWA320]

I think, out of friendship and considering your present position, they wouldn't tell you the real story anyway. Actually we are a class act and that is really bothering you isn't? How else would you characterize what we've accomplished in such a short amount of time? Please keep posting the attacks. It only solidifies my reasons for finally getting out of such a fine organization such as ALPA.

You can believe what you want all day and night but my relationship with these two goes back twenty years so I doubt very seiously that they would sugar coat a thing. The truth of the matter is your very unprofessional gathering of cards and just how many will vote in the clown gallery!!! Makes you go Hmmmmm doesn't it?? No insults my man just telling it like it is and I am sorry that the truth hurts, maybe you shouldn't play the game if you don't like the contact...

 

[AWA320]

You're scaring me now. We have never ASSAULTED pilots on the jetway. If they didn't want to sign a card, they did'nt have to. How do YOU know whether they vote yes or no? Are they going to turn over their ballots to you to vote for them? I say prove it. Well just see how the numbers work out.

So you are stating here on open forum that usapa supporters did not use catcrew to locate pilots that had not turned in cards then met those pilots in the jetway when they arrived or were taking off for a flight. I want you to post how usapa did not use this tactic for card gathering...

 

[Phoenix]

So you are stating here on open forum that usapa supporters did not use catcrew to locate pilots that had not turned in cards then met those pilots in the jetway when they arrived or were taking off for a flight. I want you to post how usapa did not use this tactic for card gathering...

If you have an accusation to make don't beat around the bush with innuendo. Stand up and tell your rumors with confidence.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

Last one first. The UAL pilot board member, if I recall, was extremely limited in what he/she could do and veto rights, if any, would not have applied to a merger situation, as I recall. I followed this pretty close because I thought ALPA sold a heck of a lot of concessions just to get board membership for the US pilots.

It would seem your recall is incorrect.

The pilots board member at UAL did indeed have veto power over proposed mergers, the problem was that it was coupled with the mechanics board members vote.

They both had to vote against the merger to veto it, Peterpaul(the IAM board member) voted for it, the rest as they say......is history.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

You can believe what you want all day and night but my relationship with these two goes back twenty years so I doubt very seiously that they would sugar coat a thing. The truth of the matter is your very unprofessional gathering of cards and just how many will vote in the clown gallery!!! Makes you go Hmmmmm doesn't it?? No insults my man just telling it like it is and I am sorry that the truth hurts, maybe you shouldn't play the game if you don't like the contact...

yep you're right, I will believe what I want. Especially since I know how the campaign was conducted. Can't be too good of friends. Hey I know 2 brothers who didn't speak to one another for years after the US/PI merger. So what you say means nothing. Prove it, as you're so fond of saying. Even though you can't, so I'll let you off the hook.

Besides, a man in your position has a vested interest in the outcome. Truth? Your truth? Now that is really laughable. If you think this is a game, go ahead. One more thing, I guess by your inference, ALPA is going to challenge every card as being "unprofessionally" gathered. You're way too funny.