Airlines And Service

[JS]

Well TravelPro,

I for one hope that US stays in the air for a long long time. DL maybe ready when you are but they ain't ready when I am. I have NEVER had one positive experience on DL EVER. I just don't care for them.

I don't really like the whole bottled water thing for a preflight drink either. But on a 321 that's usually full it's nearly impossible for the F/A to serve drinks predeparture. Besides I actually like to watch people and how they act boarding.

Service is a funny thing. what's excellent to one is crap to another. I just had an incident with a hotel that totally set me off to the point where I changed hotels on the spot. Was it a huge or even big deal? Not really. For the folks who don't fly regularly I think it's hard to understand what a prima donna you can become if you're not careful. I'm not just talking Customers, I'm talking F/A's, Pilots too. It's something about being on the road and seeing the good & bad in customer service that does it.

[post="256555"][/post]​

I've had bad experiences on Delta as well, but guess what -- unless you color your views (hmmmm), no matter what airline you fly, some trips will go well and some won't. When you say that you NEVER had one positive experience on Delta EVER, you either took very few flights like one or two (i.e., not enough to draw a conclusion), or you're biased.

Heck, I'll even admit that I've had good flights on AA, an airline that I avoid as much as possible due to prior bad experiences.

You even threw a fit and changed hotels for basically no reason. After all, you did write, "Was it a huge or even big deal? Not really."

Prima donna -- you betcha.

 

[usairways_vote_NO]

When you say that you NEVER had one positive experience on Delta EVER, you either took very few flights like one or two (i.e., not enough to draw a conclusion), or you're biased.

Prima donna -- you betcha.

[post="256703"][/post]​

You just hit the nail on the head. That is the exact reason I started this thread to show it's ones own bias why one airline wins over another another.

 

[usairways_vote_NO]

Piney I got a idea next time one thing goes wrong with USAirways why don't you pick up your marbles and take off somewhere else? I will be sure to watch for your next complaint against them and remind you. Hey there is no reason being hypocritical right? If a airline or hotel messes up just chuck em.

 

[KCFlyer]

Yet you'll drive how many hours out of your way to fly out of BWI on occasion, or add how many hours to your trip by making a connection somewhere, even though SWA could get you there from PHL non-stop?

[post="256685"][/post]​

Well, Piney's time for air travel is in "dog time" - 7 times the normal human time. So an hour at $250 (billed to his client???) waiting in line for an hour (not true for someone as internet saavy as Piney..."online check in" gets you your A seat) is actually worth more than 3 hours in a car or waiting at a hub airport (still billing the client???) Bob is saying that ability be "in control" of exactly where he is sitting on the plane is worth $500 to $750. Does his client think so? I guess it doesn't matter....Bob is true blue to US - The airline...not the employees, just a nice pat on the back for the agent giving him his upgrade or the FA bringing him his drink, just as long as they don't balk at giving up pay and benefits to keep "his" airline in business. That is, unless they start screwing around with the DM program....then it's cockroach city and the threat to take his miles to Continental, while telling the world how "great" those US employees are. Now if only y'all didn't belong to one of those slacker unions and would just roll over for any amount of concessions that are asked for...hell, work for FREE - just get Bob his upgrades.

 

[ELP_WN_Psgr]

KC:

Somehow I don't think it will be long before Bob replies.

Here's the bottom line: It wouldn;t matter....if WN started assigning seats tomorrow....then the excuse would be (a) no F (B) no club © They don't fly to DFW (d) the sun got in my eyes or (e) my foot slipped on a rock. As Roseanne Roseannadanna used to say...."It's always something."

I would recommend watching the typical boarding process in this old ad as an example of good service, with a caveat "USAirways employees...don't try this at home."

Link 1

 

[whlinder]

Piney I got a idea next time one thing goes wrong with USAirways why don't you pick up your marbles and take off somewhere else?

[post="256712"][/post]​

Because someone else won't seat him in F.

(not true for someone as internet saavy as Piney..."online check in" gets you your A seat)

[post="256762"][/post]​

When Southwest starts assigning seats to Bob (in first class) Bob will fly Southwest.

 

[usairways_vote_NO]

[post="256772"][/post]​

So when USAirways is gone what will you you you do then?

You have said all it would take is assigned seating to fly Southwest what about having FC?

 

[whlinder]

As for $500-700 more you're so full of crap your eyes are brown. Fares for the 2 PHL-DFW trips were in excess of $1,500 EACH. The fares out of BWI were $279.00 on BOTH occassions.

[post="256772"][/post]​

You went to BWI to save a ton of money and to fly in F. But if your time is worth $250 an hour, it would be at least an extra hour of your time to fly in and out of BWI. Probably 3 extra hours total. So $750 + $279, anything under $1000 in F is a better deal for you out of PHL, correct? Air Tran will sell you an F (or business class as they correctly label it) ticket for $778 + taxes/fees (total no more than $850) so why didn't you purchase that? It is a better value to you according to the way you measure value for your travel dollar and time. Or at least according to the way you say you measure value.

 

[KCFlyer]

We don't bill a thing to clients. I work for a manufacturer. I threw that number out to make a point.

As for $500-700 more you're so full of crap your eyes are brown. Fares for the 2 PHL-DFW trips were in excess of $1,500 EACH. The fares out of BWI were $279.00 on BOTH occassions.

If your time is worth $250 an hour and you are driving 3 hours to catch a flight from another city for a cheaper fare, then thats $750. And I am assuming that, time being money, even with an hour wait for Southwest (again, totally unnecessary with online check in) that's $250. So...is time really worth THAT much money?

Love Field in Dallas doesn't help me. Nice place but to far from where I go when I'm in TX.

What about when the Wright Ammendment gets repealed?

That being said if todays US 14 day advance fare for BWI to DFW is $262.00 with a F/C seat and SWA's is $365.00 with no assigned seat of any kind why would I fly the turd brown bus?

If you really love the US employees, you'd implore their managment to stop offering a $262 fare when the "low cost carrier" is charging $365. US is losing money on a COACH seat at that fare...have you ever stopped to think about how much they are losing with a $262 money losing coach class butt sitting in a First Class seat? Southwest makes money. US could too, but not when they try to "out-southwest southwest" buy offering money losing fares AND giving up potential revenue of a person willing to pay a premium to sit in a first class seat that is now occupied by someone paying a money losing fare. Maybe it's different today from the days I travelled for a living out of Dallas. Back then, we didn't have 14 days to plan for a trip. Many times they were made with a day or less notice. Sometimes we paid out the ass for our tickets. If our flights were within the WA states, then we were always on the "turd brown bus". Actually, they are now canyon blue, with really great legroom (you should try them sometime).

 

[KCFlyer]

I for one would pay a small premium to fly US with the F/C upgrade opportunities.

[post="256787"][/post]​

So....lets say that US adopted a new policy - a pricing policy similar to Southwest's...maximum for an unrestricted one way coach ticket of $300, and a First Class pricing structure of, say, a maximum of $450 one way, with the F class ticket priced at about a $100 to $150 premium over coach. That means you could fly all the way across the country in First for $900 total. But....they'd drop the "upgrade opportunities"...you want First, you buy First. Would this be welcomed, or would it be the begining of "cockroach II"? I think I already know the answer to this one.

 

[KCFlyer]

KC,
On business on the company dime. I want the upgrade free. I don't want a GoFare or a BloFare I want a FairFare.

[post="256795"][/post]​

And I maintain that that upgrade is the responsiblity of the company, not the airline.

Why should the airline subsidize something that your employer can't justify paying themselves? Or... if you're willing to pay for yourself, why would you not be willing to pony up a hundred bucks or so and bump your company paid for seat to a first class seat? Why is the fact that your company bought the ticket for you not worth you coming up with the extra dollars to get that upgrade?

 

[bookmdano]

Reading the above posts is very educating. Everyone made such valid points about good service, such as: fares; seating; first class upgrades; ontime; baggage; etc. But a friend sent me the details of what's really going to turn "us" around (sarcasm in effect-SIE)....it's the cups!!! Apparently in a recent bulletin us indicates that "the stylized, gray flag symbol on the existing cups will be replaced with vibrantly colored, whimsical line art highlighting caribbean, transatlantic and domestic service. The change is cost-neutral to the company, as the existing cup supply is depleted, the revised cups will be phased in, onboard all us** and us** express flights. Cups will be rotated seasonally based on customer travel patterns.
The first cups introduced feature a beach scene printed in the same turquoise as our caribbean logo. Next, the transatlantic design depicts well-known european landmarks in a lively shade of fuchsia. The domestic sketch features cityscapes in a cheerful, bright blue. Each version includes us** flag symbols drawn freehand, as well as the us**.com logo. The fresh designs and unique color palatte underscore us**'s transformation into a more approachable, low-cost, value-driven carrier."
OH, my....our office has never had such a hoot of a laugh!!! This is so great for comic relief!!! Wow, if this doesn't turn the airline around...nothing will!! Keep up the laughs!

 

[JS]

If you really love the US employees, you'd implore their managment to stop offering a $262 fare when the "low cost carrier" is charging $365. US is losing money on a COACH seat at that fare...have you ever stopped to think about how much they are losing with a $262 money losing coach class butt sitting in a First Class seat? Southwest makes money. US could too, but not when they try to "out-southwest southwest" buy offering money losing fares AND giving up potential revenue of a person willing to pay a premium to sit in a first class seat that is now occupied by someone paying a money losing fare. Maybe it's different today from the days I travelled for a living out of Dallas. Back then, we didn't have 14 days to plan for a trip. Many times they were made with a day or less notice. Sometimes we paid out the ass for our tickets. If our flights were within the WA states, then we were always on the "turd brown bus". Actually, they are now canyon blue, with really great legroom (you should try them sometime).

[post="256780"][/post]​

Bad example. Southwest does not sell through fares to DFW; the DAL fare is two fares. The US fare to DFW is one fare.

 

[TomBascom]

And I maintain that that upgrade is the responsiblity of the company, not the airline.

The company has the option to buy an F fare. There's no "responsibility" here.

Why should the airline subsidize something that your employer can't justify paying themselves?

The airline has the option to dangle F upgrades in order to influence customer purchase behavior. It seems to work. It apparently offends you...

Or... if you're willing to pay for yourself, why would you not be willing to pony up a hundred bucks or so and bump your company paid for seat to a first class seat? Why is the fact that your company bought the ticket for you not worth you coming up with the extra dollars to get that upgrade?

[post="256806"][/post]​

It is. Back in the bad old days when they had certificates and I ran out I'd buy more. On my nickle. Even for short hops.

But those aren't the rules today. I think the company had good reasons to change the rules and I'm happy that they did.

I also think that, as Bob keeps saying and you keep ignoring, GoFares are unreasonably low and BloFares are far, far too high. As a business traveler I'm more than willing to pay a fair premium. It needs to be presented in a rational manner and marketed. And I have to have a chance to buy it without fighting the sales process every step of the way. So far as that goes WN "gets it" -- they make it really easy to buy the fare that makes sense. US does not.

I also agree with Bob -- BBB, Barry and the crew rehashed a tired old airline tale about bookings "drying up" immediately when they raise fares by $5. That's crap as an excuse -- it doesn't hold water on multiple fronts. They're simply too timid to get out from behind their desks and figure out how to do it. (Ok, the ringleaders got out from behind their desks and are now screwing up Spirit -- so maybe there's hope...)

Average fares need to go up. BloFares need to go away. Completely. GoFares are probably still needed (you also continually ignore people who try to explain to you why they aren't "losing money") but they need to be much better executed. And there needs to be a sensible effort made to attract people to the higher value fares in the middle instead of chasing them away from them.

BTW -- I personally have nothing against WN. The old brown planes are kind of ugly but the new paint job is better. Assigned seats don't bother me -- an "A" BP is easy enough to get. The "cattle call" is no worse than the "gate crush". If they go where I need to go and nobody with an F cabin goes there then I'll get on their planes long before I'll take an RJ... They do things their way and there are lots of great lessons to be learned from them -- but not everything they do is right for US Airways. Product differentiation is what US needs. Trying to "out southwest" Southwest is a doomed "strategy".

 

[JS]

Actually I had a lengthy conversation with B. Ben and his side kick Barry on that very topic. VFF's like me don't want or need GoFares. We also don't need what we now call "BloFares" like $800 PHL -BUF R/T 7 day advance purchase either.

Same with the $184.00 & $258.00 fares I paid PHL to LAX. Complete insanity, a bargain fare for that trip should be at least $300.00 R/T, A more realistic fare I think would be in the $350-400 range for a 7 day advance and maybe $750 walk up fare last minute.

I for one would pay a small premium to fly US with the F/C upgrade opportunities.

US Airways leaves so much money on the table wit me it's not funny with there convoluted pricing model. Just priced out PHL to CLT 21 days out and the fare was $1,016 R/T a typical Hub to hub "BloFare". Since I have time on this trip I'm booking PHL-RDU for $78.40 R/T and driving to CLT. I have to spend an extra night for $79.00 at the Courtyard in RDU. US Airways left several hundred dollars on the table. If the PHL - CLT fare had been $599.00 I would have done it no problem. But at $1,016??? They can KMA in Macy's window.

The pricing model at SWA is far superior, BUT US swears that they HAVE to match the lowest fares or else bookings dry up. I'm not buying it.

[post="256787"][/post]​

I checked PHL-CLT Monday April 4, returning Tuesday April 5 (next Monday-Tuesday more than three weeks from now). Here are the results (same airline and routing each way, roundtrip fare, including tax):

NW $188
CO $238
Delta $305
US $465 via ATL
US non-stop $1016

If you have enough time to fly to RDU, spend the night, and drive to CLT, you certainly have enough time to change planes to save $600 or $800.

I think I know what's going on -- you want the absolute cheapest way to fly to your destination (or some place fairly close) on US Airways. You claim that you don't "need" GoFares, yet that is all you buy!

Come on, this is ridiculous to expect US Airways to survive, let alone give you a free upgrade to First Class, especially with linens and china and fine wine, for the princely sum of $29 to $89 one way.